Add a legacy DNxHD output option that would be compatible with older Avid versions

[Matt Boardman]

Just wanting to bump this again as this is a pretty important issue I've seen mentioned in a few places.  With the update to how AVID codecs are processed in v22.3, I have been forced to stay on 22.2.1 because the productions that I've worked on and the one I'm currently working on cannot import AVID Quicktimes that I render in v22.3 and later.  In the release regarding this change, I believe this was said that it was done with the AVID team, but something is broken here because what used to work, no longer does.  If I'm wrong here and there's a new procedure that I need to follow to get things to work, I would be grateful to know that.  Sadly, as of now, I'm stuck on v22.2.1 and unable to enjoy the updates that have been released since.

[Original Title: Still stuck on v22.2.1 due to AVID Codecs Change with v22.3]

[m1jackson]

Hi, I've been using AE2021 very sucessfully to render DNxHD Quicktimes on a Windows 10 machine.

It plays back on my Windows machine a in Quicktime Player 7 or on Mac without issue.

However, when rendering in AE2023 on the exact same machine using the exact same project, and the same output que (upgraded scene file of course), when playing back on a Mac in QT Player or in the Avid, the movies appear black. When playing the movie back in QTPlayer 7 on my Windows machine they also appear black.

These are the same file rendered in the two versions of AE

To mess with my brain just a little more, when opening the file in VLC, the movie plays back fine.

Rendering the movie to frame sequences works, but that's not really a work around because the DNxHD still comes out black.

Rendering to ProRes 422 works just fine.

I've tried to reset preferences.

I've reset up the "C:\Users\<username>\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\After Effects" (that's a pain)

Any input or recommendations by anyone would be appreciated. Thanks.

[jaydude-wb]

Same here. I used Elmedia Player to play DNxHD .mov's generated by previous versions of Ae, but with Ae 23.0. the movies are black in Elmedia Player.

Seems that Ae writes some kind of new dialect that no other app understands (when imported back in Ae, the .movs look fine)

[m1jackson]

In conversation with another artist friend, I was told that Adobe "did" change something in their render procedure of DNxHD files to accomidate Avids announcement of "no more Quicktime support", but didn't tell anyone what they did or how it may affect end users. Seems that new versions of Avid Composer "may" support the old version, but old versions of Composer don't support the new version's renders.

Adobe, many editors don't upgrade Composer for years, we AE artists need a path backwards to reach these clients that are reticent to change, and working in 2021, while possible, isn't allowing us to use the upgraded software that you develop, and that we pay for.

It's really important to hear from Adobe on this on what we're supposed to do. We can't use 2022 or 2023 because of the black frame issue.

[jaydude-wb]

My workflow is not very smooth, due to this incompatibilities. I like to work in Ae 22 (but incompatible with precious versions of Avid) and even more in 23 (Finally support for my GPU, and the new track mattes!), but there is no MacOS player available that can play DNxHD rendered with 23. (Time for an Adobe player?)

So I still need the ancient version 21 to get things done.

So I can not review render results! Really disastrous.

[jaydude-wb]

I am struggling myself with asynchonicity of Ae/DNxHD and Avid/DNxHD.

My current workflow with After Effects 2023 runs via ProRes, which the latest versions of Avid can import.

[JohnColombo]

Hi @Matt Boardman & @m1jackson,

Thank you both for highlighting this issue with the DNxHD format when working with older Avid systems. For some more background, I did find this post from April when this change was first made in cooperation with Avid: https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-discussions/announcement-changes-to-quicktime-dnxhd-supp.... Matt, I see you posted in that thread as well, so this is more for the benefit of Michael and others visiting this thread.

Per the conversation in that linked post above, I've moved this bug report to the Ideas section and changed the title to request a legacy output for DNxHD that would be compatible with older Avid versions. Please let me know if this correctly reflects your needs or if it should be changed to something else.

Thanks again for bringing this up,

- John, After Effects Engineering Team

[ericmlevy]

The workaround is to render DNXHR and force resize it to 1080p in the output settings. I haven't had an AE with a problem, and we've done 4, 5 shows with these settings.

[Matt Boardman]

Thank you, John!  Having the ability to render a legacy AVID format would be fantastic!

[JohnGeisz56]

Thank you for this feature request.  This is a problem for our shop's workflow and we are also forced to continue using older versions of Premiere, After Effects and Media Encoder.  Our process uses Quicktime animations and the work-arounds cause other inconvenient issues.

I hope Adobe can help us with this.

[mesee3d]

This is a major issue.  Any  updates? 

[Matt Boardman]

Hey John,

Just wanted to check in and see if you if any traction had been made on getting a Legacy render option for Avid DNxHD Format renders?

-Matt B

[Matt Boardman]

So, here's the point where I start to get really frustrated with this.  I raised this issue in October of 2022.  Since then, we've had MULTIPLE updates to AE, which is now currently on v23.2.1 and I'm still stuck on v22.2.1 because any other version after that renders AVID QTs that are unusable by the productions that I work with.  That is beyond my control. I can't tell the production to update to the latest version of AVID.  So, I'm STUCK.  I can't upgrade to the latest version.  I can't use the latest features, updated stability features of existing features, or anything new because of this change that I'm pretty sure no one asked for.  I have been using AE professionally for 13 years now and this is the first time in the course of this that something like this has happened.  So, I'm beyond frustrated that adding a Legacy AVID format is not something that couldn't easily be added amongst all the other fixes and additions.  This is something that has affected a great deal of people who may not be here on the Support Community to say something about it.  You've effectively nerfed us while the Nuke users have no issues providing renders to Editorial with the latest version of their software.

[m1jackson]

It's been 3 months since we've heard anything from Adobe. Is there any movement or plans that can be shared?

Depending on your payment plan, $150 some odd dollars has been paid to Adobe per user., and no feedback given from Adobe returned.

Just silence.

[mesee3d]

Looking for an update.  This issue isn't going away any time soon. 

[m1jackson]

We are at 6 months with no resoution or update from Adobe on this topic.

Rendering to DNxHR is not a solution as the movie is unplayable on the desktop in Quicktime Player.

Rendering to DNxHD does not work in older Avid Media Composer programs

This is wildly irresponsible on Adobe's part and makes me really want to search out new non Adobe solutions.

[m1jackson]

John,

It's been a YEAR AND THREE MONTHS since this came up. No fix for the problem in any subsequent version of After Effects.

The reason I bring this up is because yesterday my C drive crashed and I lost my working copy of 22.2.1 and am unable to download it from the Creative Cloud Application anymore due to some policy change about downloading versions older than 2 versions.

I've continued to pay for a legal licesne of AE because it's the right thing to do even though I can't use the newer version to the change. Adobe has continued to do nothing to rectify the situation and now I can't even work without some convoluted work around requiring multiple steps of rendering.

What are we supposed to do without a fix? I'd say thank you, but I'm all out of courtesy.

Michael Jackson