WEB Host Check

[TjmSmith]

A word to the wise; check out your ISP capabilities/support fully before moving on with CMS development.

Just learned the hard way.  I've had a static site on an ISP that provides PHP/MySQL service.  I built the DW5.5 CS 'test web site' (check_php) from the guide by David Powers and it worked fine on my local testing computer (XAMPP...).  I then tried to create the MySQL database on the live system and found they were using what apparently is an older version of 'everything'!!!.  Access to the entire site is provided via cPanel.  The create database function does not allow 'NON-alphanumeric' characters in the DB name (so much for my 'check_php' work!).

I then created a (test) database without the underscore and was able to upload the sample data (index & users) from Mr Powers examples; ok so far.  Then tried to add MySQL users:  Add New User is limited to seven characters (ok I guess but hampering from an end user point of view).  Did all the work to add the new user and on clicking 'create' it responds w/page 'success' but on return to the management screen the newly created user never appears

Sent 'comments/feedback' message yesterday; no response as of now.

I guess a new ISP is in order.

Tom

[Lon_Winters]

Are you equating ISP with web hosting, or are you using the hosting that some ISPs provide as yo "personal web space". Your ISP is ther mainly just to provide you with Internet access, and any other of these features they may offer are bound to be sub-standard. If that's the case, then you need an account with a real web hosting provider who will have the latest versions of PHP and MySQL installed.

[TjmSmith]

Ooops!  No question about it, I was referring to my web hosting service (not my ISP).  I do know the difference but the frustration just got in the way.  Thanks for pointing it out though.

Anyone else having difficulty with the cPanel interface on their hosting service?

Tom

[Lon_Winters]

I don't admin any sites on hosts that use cPanel.  But you shoild be using phpMyAdmin to manage the database, correct? Do you know exactly what versions of PHP and MYSQL the host is running? It mat not be a version issue so much as a settings issue on the server regarding the restrictions for the DB name, not sure. But field length and data type can be managed in the database. if you do have phpMYAdmin, or some other tool to look at your database, view the table in design mode and check the properties for the UserID field. It most likely defaulted to a certain datatypes and field length which you shold be able to change.

[Rob Hecker2]

"Anyone else having difficulty with the cPanel interface on their hosting service?"

cPanel is the not problem. However, as Lon suggested, the naming convention may have been set by the Webhost for some reason. However, that's really a non-issue.

cPanel can be configured by the webhost in many different ways. You probably don't have access to certain configuration files but can either make changes through cpanel or via a htaccess file.

From what you's said, it really isn't clear that your webhost is a problem, either.

[Lon_Winters]

The only issue with the database name is he was following the tutorial that used a specific name, which as far as I an gather was named "check_PHP". That can easily be changed to something else like "checkphp" and the tutorial project files would have to be amended. Which as far as I can tell, this should only really need to be updated once in the connections file.

[TjmSmith]

Rob.., Lon...;

Thanks for input.  Not to be really argumentative, although I'm still trying to work thru connection details, my initial point was to recommend users check their Hosts operation before going too far along in local development.  As you have noted, in following a tutorial (I'm new to DW5.5), the sample therein used a database name of 'php_test' and a user name of 'phptestuser'.  After developing the basics of the sample site (which worked fine on my local hosting machine running a very recently downloaded XAMPP), I uploaded my files to my online host and, using their cPanel interface, tried to create the database and test user.

The 'create' database function would not let me use an underscore in the name.

The 'add' user function would not let me use a name longer than 7 characters and they had to all be alphanumeric.

As well, the 'add' user function, with 7 chars, reported 'successfully added' but the user never shows in the 'list of users' (of course, this part I'm trying to resolve with the host's tech team).

I have noted that in my local setup (new XAMPP), the MyPHPadmin is version 3.3.9 vs host reports version 3.2.4 and for MySQL server version mine is v:5.5.8 vs host's 5.0.91 community.

Although the 'naming conventions' don't really cause a big problem, it would have been great to have discovered the limitations early and that was my 'word to the wise'.

Thanks very much for your support.  Siince the forum doesn't seem to allow the specific segration of messages by subject, I'm seeing just about everything and your input/replies are informative and super.  A great job and I'm sure welcomed by everyone.

Tom

[Rob Hecker2]

Tom, I see, you made an assumption that the environments should be the same. There can actually be many differences that can cause mysterious and frustrating issues. It's actually amazing that the apache environment on a Windows desktop is so compatible with the environment on a Linux server. For instance, PHP can be run as DSO, CGI or SuPHP. Your shared host probably runs it as SuPHP, but I run my own VPS server as DSO (better security). You see, you probably thought that PHP is PHP, and the only difference would be the version, but there can be many differences, and each web host has to make decisions regarding how to set up the services.

Yes, the naming convention isn't such a big issue. As you dig deeper into server side programming, you're going to wish all your environmental mysteries were that simple.

[TjmSmith]

Rob.  How correct you are on assumptions.  If only the tutorial writer had mentioned this.  I know one can't think of everything but checking out your host's requirements by a newbie should have been a forewarning, I'd say.  Again, thanks for all the help - I'll probably be back in the not to distant future!  Tom

[Lon_Winters]

It's probably only something we ake for granted, with many of us using a select group of hosts and knowing what the limitations are. Still is good advice for anyone. I may get a project that involved updating or enhancin a site on a host I'm not familiar with, and I would be sure you check out the versions and configurations.

[TjmSmith]

Rob, Lon, and all.

Maybe a final note on checking out your web host requirements!  After finally determining that my hosting service was apparently using an older version of MySQL yet still having some problems connecting to my database, I found at least one other 'naming convention' requirement that was not correctly announced on the input page (they indicated a user name not to exceed 7 characters but actually it appears the limit is 6!!).  The reasoning on this is immaterial; it does though substantiate my initial recommendation to all that it is important (as a newbie I say imperative) to ensure your development desire and work is doable on your live hosting service.  Had I been directed to establish the (test) database and users shown in the tutorial before developing the sample site, I would have save considerable time, effort and frustration.

Thanks for all the help you guys provide to everyone.

Tom

[Lon_Winters]

I would still like to know the rationale and/or technical limitations of limiting a user name to only 6 characters. . Normally, the table field that holds the username can be assigned a certain max length, but perhaps earlier versions of MySQL only allows 6 for certain data types. If that's the case, what versions would have such limitations? In evaluating hosting providers, establishing PHP and MySQL versions would be easier than any particulars of any limitations of certain versions.

[TjmSmith]

Bad, worse, ugly...

Host help still hasn't responded as to why the character limitation but new wrinkle!  The MqSQL connection string need to have the cPanel login ID prefixing the database name and the user name (eg., the connections file generated by DW should read $database_check_mag = "cpanelid_database" and  $username = "cpanelid_username").

Tom

[Rob Hecker2]

Yes, I believe that is standard cPanel convention. Is that a problem?

[Lon_Winters]

Different hosts have different requirements for their connection strings, which to me is fine as long as they don't bury the information in some obscure knowledge base article or something. Have you viewed your database and table design in phpMyAdmin to see if the character limitation is merely the setting for that filed in the users table?

[TjmSmith]

Rob, Lon, et al:

I agree that specific conventions for naming things via the web host's user interface are not/should not be a problem but as was said by Lon, 'so long as the instructions are not buried...'.

The response I received from the Host's 'help' to the question why? really didn't do much for satisfaction (as follows):

"Unfortunately upgrading from version like PHP 5.2 to 5.3 tends to break a lot of older software so we are unable at this time to upgrade all of our servers like that without breaking a lot of our clients sites. I believe the issue is not quite as severe with MySQL.

Cpanel on your server actually is a bit out of date and needs to be updated. At this time we are quite busy migrating many of our servers to a new data center so we don't want to update cPanel and cause anything to break in the middle of this. However, it should be updated likely within the next few weeks. the newer cPanel version makes the username and such much clearer."

But having gotten my answer to the connection problem, I can continue.  I just can't imagine when I would have guessed to add my cPanel login ID in front of the database name and user name in my connection string!!!

Regards

Tom

[Lon_Winters]

I would like to hear from the veterans her about the upgrading of PHP.  They're either being prudent, or they're feed ing you a line. I can only comment on my experience where either it was simply upgraded, upgraded but with a few weeks of advanced notice, or, a newer version offered in addition to the older version. So there may be something to it. Sounds like one of their bigger problems is simply communication.