Dreamweaver Video Tutorials ?

[Peter Carr]

Does anybody know of any indepth video tutorials for Dreamweaver ? The ones provided by Dreamweaver are very basic and barely scratch the surface. The tutorials on Lynda.com/LinkedIn seemed to have been removed.

[pziecina]

What do you wish to learn?

Except for how to set-up a site definition, Dw is nothing more than a text editor with a few additional helper functions. It also requires one to know how to code, which means that any video or resource that teaches html, css, (and possibly js with a server side language) will be more benificial than a Dw specific tutorial.

The days of visually creating a website using Dw are long gone, and not to be recommended.

[Peter Carr]

I've been working with Dreamweaver for about 20 years. From a designers perspective I don't like using Wordpress etc. What I don't understand is why Adobe, if selling the product, don't provide detailed video tutorials.

[pziecina]

https://forums.adobe.com/people/Peter+Carr  wrote

What I don't understand is why Adobe, if selling the product, don't provide detailed video tutorials.

Because there is nothing to learn beyond setting up a site definition anymore. Dw is no longer a drag and drop designer friendly program, instead it is aimed at users who wish to code, (though not an IDE).

[Peter Carr]

It's an excellent package for real heavy weight designers. But this is off the point.

[pziecina]

https://forums.adobe.com/people/Peter+Carr  wrote

It's an excellent package for real heavy weight designers. But this is off the point.

That's just the point, it is not.

Just to give you an idea of the problem, I, (and a few others, even in the Dw pre-release) have been asking for a discussion with the Dw managment, (or even a team member) for 4-5 years now. As we know Dw is not for anyone anymore. It is not for those who wish to code in a serious manner, or for those who wish to built sites with only a basic coding knowledge, (certainly not for those without any coding knowledge).

Even a well known Dw extension developer, (dmxzone) have developed a more 'designer' friendly program, (Wappler it is called) as they no longer think Dw is aimed at 'designers'.

Whilst I can understand your frustration(s) regarding Dw, (and lack of tutorials) I cannot in all honesty recommend Dw to anyone anymore. It does not offer the developer what they require, and it does not offer the designer what they require, but until the Dw managment answers our concerns regarding the future of Dw, its future user audience is a mystery to everyone.

[Peter Carr]

I hear you.

As an experienced designer I like refining my work, and even though with code, Dreamweaver has given me that ability.

Anybody can drag and drop, I like to design the experience.

What I'm really looking for is a refresher video tutorial, to make sure I keep up to date.

[pziecina]

If you look at the 'learn' section, (on the r/h side) of the forum landing page -

https://forums.adobe.com/community/dreamweaver

that is all there is. Everything else you need to learn is html, etc. which is none Dw specific, -

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Tutorials

[Peter Carr]

Thanks.

Those tutorials are to basic.

[pziecina]

As I and you said, there is a complete lack of direction regarding Dw. I agree the tutorials etc. are too basic, and lacking any in-depth information.

It is either for very basic site building, or for no user type.

[osgood_]

pziecina  wrote

Even a well known Dw extension developer, (dmxzone) have developed a more 'designer' friendly program, (Wappler it is called) as they no longer think Dw is aimed at 'designers'.

Is it? I've been following its progress and it seems to be rapidy in danger of becoming more aimed at the ex-coder who no longer wishes to code. It is a really bloated and complex bit of software now, surely not aimed at the novice/designer it wishes or wanted to originally attract. Even those in its forum, some long term uses, are perplexed/complaining as to how to use it.

Problem with the scene at the moment is its all over the shop. No one who creates these part-automated solutions really know who their product is aimed at and these products are not and will not be capable of doing everything everyone wishes or thinks they should be able to do.

The questions that get asked on some of the forums are quite frankly obsurd at times. You have to have some sympathy for the producers of such software, they try their best but its never good enough for a lot, who expect just to be able to click a button and something magical, which is a fantasy in their head, will happens, without any knowledge of how complex or problematical introducing such a workflow into a product may be.

Long live coding!

[pziecina]

First I hope the OP does not mind us going off-topic?

As for Wappler, I did read a discussion regarding PWAs in their forum. But PWAs require api's, off-line databases, user interaction features, well beyond normal web sites, which cannot be done without a very good knowledge of code.

Maybe itis time to forget none IDE programs, and the people that want to incorporate such features without knowing 'how'. As without a program including the necessary features such as a de-bugger, (js and server side) more advanced site requirements such as those for PWAs are impossible to code.

At the moment though, Dw must 'up its game' especially when it comes to the requirements of those developing for the web, and stop creating features that are only 'half finished'.

[osgood_]

pziecina  wrote

At the moment though, Dw must 'up its game' especially when it comes to the requirements of those developing for the web, and stop creating features that are only 'half finished'.

I can't argue with that....one update a year is not really acceptable these days. However I think we all know the fate of DW, its on life-support. The question is when not if it will be pulled.

[pziecina]

osgood_  wrote

I can't argue with that....one update a year is not really acceptable these days. However I think we all know the fate of DW, its on life-support. The question is when not if it will be pulled.

Lets be honest Dw does not fit in with any other Adobe product. It does not even require any other Adobe CC product.

Animate one can completely forget. Photoshop has had no new features added for the web since CS6, and even then cheaper products are available. Even Illustrator for svg's does not match upto inkscape when it comes to the web.

Adobe themselves do not require Dw to support its web 'products' such as coding for its experiance management features, and the team for experiance manager did not even consider Dw durring development.

[osgood_]

pziecina  wrote

osgood_   wrote

I can't argue with that....one update a year is not really acceptable these days. However I think we all know the fate of DW, its on life-support. The question is when not if it will be pulled.

Lets be honest Dw does not fit in with any other Adobe product. It does not even require any other Adobe CC product.

Animate one can completely forget. Photoshop has had no new features added for the web since CS6, and even then cheaper products are available. Even Illustrator for svg's does not match upto inkscape when it comes to the web.

Adobe themselves do not require Dw to support its web 'products' such as coding for its experiance management features, and the team for experiance manager did not even consider Dw durring development.

Yeah, I'm shaking my head a lot to see where it fits in the stable of Adobe applications, it doesnt really. You would expect Adobe to be on top of the game, as it usually is for DTP, Image Editing etc applications, but this is one area where they have failed to keep pace with much more exciting an innovative products, produced by smaller companies with a focused view. As I've said previously, there probably isn't enough financial rewards for Adobe to compete, bring out and maintain a main-stream web-development product.

[pziecina]

Adobe do know how profitable web development requierments can be, as its experiance cloud offerings generate over 30% of its profits, (more than any other offerings).

For those who do not know about experiance cloud see-

https://www.adobe.com/uk/experience-cloud.html

The problem for Dw though, is that the experiance cloud is aimed at enterprise sites, which is not the type of site Dw can develop.

[BenPleysier]

Maybe itis time to forget none IDE programs, and the people that want to incorporate such features without knowing 'how'. As without a program including the necessary features such as a de-bugger, (js and server side) more advanced site requirements such as those for PWAs are impossible to code.

It is so refreshing to be able to use a program containing built in features. I have recently needed to create a checkout module using Square as the payment gateway. Used GIT to clone the repository and NodeJS to install the package, all without leaving the IDE. Debugging is also super easy.

[pziecina]

Thanks for joining in Ben.

I don't know when or how Dw managed to get so far behind, (I have a few ideas, but do not know) what is really required, but unless something changes soon, I don't think it can survive. It's not even a question of what developers are willing to pay for an IDE, (for most cost is 'almost' secondary) that would make an Adobe IDE, (Dw or something new) profitable, but the fact that Dw in its current offering is not what is required or even close to what is required.

[osgood_]

BenPleysier  wrote

It is so refreshing to be able to use a program containing built in features. I have recently needed to create a checkout module using Square as the payment gateway. Used GIT to clone the repository and NodeJS to install the package, all without leaving the IDE. Debugging is also super easy.

Whats so refreshing? Are you saying DW doesnt even have a terminal window?

[pziecina]

Correct Os, Dw does not have a terminal window, it does not even have the old js runner window anymore.

Correction - It does have a terminal window for git, but it is another one of those 'half finished features' that does not do what is required by most developers.

[osgood_]

pziecina  wrote

Correct Os, Dw does not have a terminal window, it does not even have the old js runner window anymore.

Correction - It does have a terminal window for git, but it is another one of those 'half finished features' that does not do what is required by most developers.

Hummm git.....who the **** uses git, maybe if you work in a large team but then I dont see a professional team using DW. I dont have time as a single developer to keep commiting, adding and pushing, writing comments etc. I'm a developer not an administator. In a big/medium team its probably a requirement and a benefit but come on for a small independent developer its just a waste of time. Works being backed up every hour through-out the day so if I want to revert I can do that anyway.

Well an inbuilt terminal window is a bonus but its not essential really.

[B i r n o u]

osgood_  a écrit

Hummm git.....who the **** uses git, maybe if you work in a large team but then I dont see a professional team using DW. I dont have time as a single developer to keep commiting, adding and pushing, writing comments etc. I'm a developer not an administator.

well, I am a ****, as I use GIT

I don't think we should miss the fact that GIT is first and foremost a versioning tool, not just a team tool only.

so, even working alone, it is a really valuable tool. I don't want to teach you life , and please, see in my remarks only an open door to the use of GIT to make code management more flexible when adding features to your sites or applications

let's say your site is online, working and the work is finished, at least the current module is finished.

you want to add a modification, or a new feature to the site.

no problem, you create a branch of the current project (which is by default the master), and you make all the necessary changes to this branch.

these modifications can concern dozens of (linked) files without affecting the master.

you can create as many branches as you want from either the branches created or from the master again... which allows you to do many different tests and consider as many alternative approaches as necessary

once one of the branches satisfies you, you have a magic GIT tool that allows you to merge the desired branches together, or with the master... no doubt about which file has been modified, where, or by what, who, when or how... etc... everything remains 100% operational flexible and so easy to use

[pziecina]

https://forums.adobe.com/people/B+i+r+n+o+u  wrote

once one of the branches satisfies you, you have a magic GIT tool that allows you to merge the desired branches together, or with the master... no doubt about which file has been modified, where, or by what, who, when or how... etc... everything remains 100% operational flexible and so easy to use

O/K, I will agree that in a team environment some form of version control system is necessary, (would be stupid not to). But is it really necessary for a lone developer?

I can remember a discussion in which Dw users where being told to upload the site to git, then upload via ftp from git. Again, doesn't such advice overcomplicate a workflow?

[B i r n o u]

pziecina  a écrit

O/K, I will agree that in a team environment some form of version control system is necessary, (would be stupid not to). But is it really necessary for a lone developer?

as soon as a development has to evolve, and if we separate all the files that compose it, it quickly becomes tedious to remember all the changes made, where, on which files, in which functions and has the structure of some modules been modified... etc....

the versioning tool becomes essential... and moreover it is so simple to use.

especially since once validated, we keep full control of the branch which merges step by step in front of our eyes with the production version

[B i r n o u]

pziecina  a écrit

I can remember a discussion in which Dw users where being told to upload the site to git, then upload via ftp from git. Again, doesn't such advice overcomplicate a workflow?

it is true that if we ask users to do anything, it quickly becomes a mess

GIT must be used to manage intermediate versions and FTP in order to synchronize the production server.

then, and depending on the access provider, we can define the DNS on the master branch, which avoids going through an FTP