Fixing frames that cut off equations

Explorer ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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My team has a chronic  problem with equations in FrameMaker. They look fine in FrameMaker, but when converted to help in WebWorks ePublisher, the edges are cut off so that you can't see the math symbols. 

Today I discovered that the equation looked cut off on my computer but fine on another writer's computer. An example is attached.

 

At one point, I thought the solution was to add a little space around the equations with a FrameScript. That worked beautifully a few times. Now the problem is back.

 

Has anyone run into this problem? We're using unstructured FrameMaker 2015. All of the writers are using the same fonts. We've tried unshrinkwrapping and reshrinkwrapping. And like I said, adding space around the equations (inside the frames) helped only temporarily.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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Hi @SheilaOK:

 

Someone here may have direct experience and can offer a solution, but you might also want to reach out to Webworks since the issue doesn't appear to be in FrameMaker, but rather with the Webworks conversion.
https://www.webworks.com/Products/ePublisher/FrameMaker/

 

~Barb 

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Explorer ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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Barb, I've talked to WebWorks about this exhaustively. After many exchanges, they surmised:

"The display view in FrameMaker is only an approximation of the print view. I can only conclude that the algorithms used to calculate the necessary size of equations in an anchored frame are too aggressive and not leaving enough room for error based on the fonts used for the display view and those used by acrobat distiller."

 

Also, because the problem now appears to affect the view of the equation in FrameMaker (not just in the HTML that ePublisher creates), I don't think ePublisher is the problem.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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Ok! You checked that one off the list. Have you tried the most current version of FrameMaker (there's a 30-day free trial) just to see if the issue is resolved? The PDF export engine has had a considerable update and it no longer uses Distiller (unless you choose to).

 

I haven't used WebWorks in years, so I won't be of any additional help. I hope someone else can step in to help you resolve this. 

 

~Barb 

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Explorer ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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Good to know about the new PDF engine, Barb. I haven't used the new FM trial extensively.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 24, 2021 May 24, 2021

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I just created a similar equation and converted it to PDF and to HTML5. Everything fine.

I am not sure, if I understand correctly.

You have the problem, but on your colleague's PC everything is fine?

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Explorer ,
May 25, 2021 May 25, 2021

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Five writers work on 14 "books". The cut off equations can occur on anyone's computer. The example I gave was just one instance of where the equation looked fine on one writer's computer but not mine.

To replicate this problem in the HTML, I have to convert the whole 14 books to HTML using WebWorks ePublisher. The problem doesn't occur if I convert only one book.

One writer has found a cut off equation in the PDF. I don't think the problem is with ePublisher because the equations can be cut off in the HTML or the PDF files.

The computer I'm generating the help on has 52GB of free space and Intel(R) Xeon(R) Gold 6148 CPU @ 2.40GHz 2.39 GHz processors. That seems like enough space and processor speed so that hardware isn't an issue.

My company farms out their tech support for Adobe. The technician's suggestion was to add even more space above and below each equation. I'm not convinced that that will work but I'm going to try it.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 25, 2021 May 25, 2021

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Have you tried (as a test) to generate HTML5 directly out of FM to see if the effect is happening there too?

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Explorer ,
May 25, 2021 May 25, 2021

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Jeff, no I haven't. That's a great idea.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 25, 2021 May 25, 2021

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That's what I had tested (see my post above).

At least with FrameMaker's default template everything was fine.

Possibly you could import settings like paragraph formatting and then also math definitions to see, if this changes something?

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Explorer ,
May 28, 2021 May 28, 2021

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@Jeff_Coatsworth, I converted the books to HTML in FM doing a simple File > Publish. The equations that were previously cut off are fine now. However, many equations converted to blank images.

 

In FrameMaker, for each equation and anchored frame that contains multiple objects, Distiller DC was converting PS to PDF. It sounds like the PDF files are then converted to PNG. Does that seem right?

 

As far as ePublisher goes, it uses FrameMaker to create a PostScript file that is then rasterized. Acrobat Distiller is not used. 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 26, 2021 May 26, 2021

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One thing I just thought of: Maybe the equations could be converted to graphics ahead of time on copies of the documents. Then Webworks would just see them as ordinary graphics and not equations. This might be worth exploring.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 26, 2021 May 26, 2021

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I know I dealt with this problem (many) years ago with a client and the Quadralay people. I am pretty sure the problem was custom font sizes for the equations. Are you using the older equation editor or the new XML editor?

 

frameexpert_0-1622032042025.png

I think the issue was that the Webworks rasterizer used standard font sizes and that is what caused the clipping. But I am not sure. I can't find any of my old emails about the issue.

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Explorer ,
May 26, 2021 May 26, 2021

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Hi, Rick. We're using the old equation editor in unstructured FM 2015. I compared the default equation sizes in my FM template versus a default FM file. The sizes in my template are a little smaller. For example, the default small sigma size is 14 pt. The small sigma size in our FM files is 12 pts.

 

I've sent your explanation to WebWorks and will let you know what they say.

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Explorer ,
Jun 01, 2021 Jun 01, 2021

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WebWorks Tech Support says you might be on to something, @frameexpert. They're going to do some experimenting.

I did discover this: I changed the space above and below equations from 12 pt to 20 pt. That prevented the vertical cut off equations, except that I don't want the same space above and below inline equations. I'll send you an email about it.

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Explorer ,
May 26, 2021 May 26, 2021

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@frameexpert (Rick!), that's an interesting idea. Could a FrameScript convert equations to graphics and then reinsert them in the FM files?

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