Is it possible to add a spread of two pages (to keep the pagination right) in the middle of my flow?

Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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I'm building a multi-document book -- a manual for a piece of equipment -- and I just discovered that I need to add a few more sections in one of the documents to explain a few more procedures.

My document is left to right on the pages.  I know I'll have to redo the TOC, but I'm OK with that.

I need to add a 2-page spread in a few places to add these procedures and corresponding images.  I cannot for the life of me here figure out how to add two pages in the middle of my document to do this, I'm going to have to do it a few times for the few procedures extra I need to add.  I tried carriage-returning to give myself some space, but I have anchored frames with images and details all over the place and that didn't work.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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1 Correct Answer

Adobe Community Professional , Jun 27, 2018
Barb Binder Adobe Community Professional , Jun 27, 2018
Hi Jim,Ugh. This is tough lesson to learn under deadline. Anchored frames will move with the edits—that's why they are so important. It's going to take some time to go back and anchor all of your frames, but it is the right thing to do. In addition, there are various anchoring positions that you will want to explore at some point. (See the link at the bottom.)For now, at least on the spread you shared with us, you can just cut the frame at the bottom of page 58, and paste it at the end of step s...

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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It sounds like you need a tabloid-sized layout in the middle of your doc. If that's true, you need to split your current doc add an 11x17 file in the middle.

If not, please provide a graphic to show what you need.

-Matt

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Hi Jim:

I cannot for the life of me here figure out how to add two pages in the middle of my document to do this

Screenshots will always help us be more precise in our answers, but generally speaking, as you add more content, you will force the text after it to reflow, and Fm will add pages to the end of the file. After adding two pages worth of content, the existing pages will realign themselves on the correct sides, and the tables and frames (if anchored correctly) will follow along.

You can force this to happen more quickly by selecting the paragraph that needs to go to the top of the next left page, and put a page break on it to move it to that position. You may want to remove it when you are done—it depends on the layout. If you want to give it a try, use Insert > Page Break in 2017, Special  Page Break in earlier versions. Import, type or paste content at the end of the previous text (likely at the bottom of the previous right page) to add your procedures.

Screenshot 2018-06-27 11.54.22.png

~Barb

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Barb, I added screenshots in the reply below.  I hope they help.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Hi Jim:

They sure do!

Click your mouse in the red paragraph at the top of page 60, and add the page break to force it to the top of the next left page (page 62).

Then add your content to the end of page 59, which won't fit, so it will end up at the top of page 60.

~Barb

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Barb (AND Matt), thank you -- when I do what you said, I get all kinds of a mess with the anchored frames sitting on the pages.  They don't traverse down the page or to the next page, and I get what looks like text stuck behind them... 

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Matt, I've had to blur out most of this, but hopefully you get the picture...  It's a 8.5x11" letter-sized doc, and I need to add pages in the middle of the flow in order to add some procedures for some stuff.  I've snapped the two-page spread and a zoomed in spread.

FM_Page_2.PNG

FM_Page_1.PNG

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Place your cursor directly to the right of the anchored frame anchor on page 59, and insert your graphic. You should be good to go.

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Well, the issue is that I need to basically make two new pages a few more times that look like p. 59...

Heading 2

[text]

Warning
Caution

Parts:

Tools:

Steps:

and then on the following page, some diagrams and illustration.

The problem comes when I try to do anything like add a page break, carriage return, anything -- the anchored frames with graphics in them stay put, text gets hidden behind them, it's a real mess.  I can't figure out how to clear myself some space like I would in Word (forgive me!)...  by just carriage returning or adding a page.  I'm on Framemaker 2017.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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It sounds like you might have disconnected flows. Does everything highlight when you use Ctrl+A to select all?

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Yessir, it does.  Everything gets selected on all pages.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Excellent! Can you click once in the space at the end of 59 to create a blank line on 59?

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Yes, with this qualifier:

If I cursor to the end of that FigureTitle there on p59, I can get one line at the end of that page.

If I create one more blank line, I get this -- see how that frame on 60 stays put?

FM_Page_3.PNG

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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They don't traverse down the page or to the next page, and I get what looks like text stuck behind them... 

I'm wondering if maybe the frames aren't anchored, and are instead just sitting on the page? If you want the content to move with edits, you do need to use anchored frames.

~Barb

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Is there a way to convert those to anchored frames?

You would not believe how much custom illustrating I've got in so many of them...

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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You can select the graphic, cut, position your cursor where the graphic should reside in the flow, and hit paste.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Hi Jim,

Ugh. This is tough lesson to learn under deadline. Anchored frames will move with the edits—that's why they are so important. It's going to take some time to go back and anchor all of your frames, but it is the right thing to do. In addition, there are various anchoring positions that you will want to explore at some point. (See the link at the bottom.)

For now, at least on the spread you shared with us, you can just cut the frame at the bottom of page 58, and paste it at the end of step six. Then cut the frame on page 59 and paste it at the end of step six, between the first anchor and the ¶. You may have to use the arrow key to move past the first anchor on that line. The default position of anchoring below should be find. Anchor order matters, or they can switch positions.

Here's some background information on the feature, which is worth reviewing before you get too far.

Adobe FrameMaker (2017 release)

~Barb

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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I wonder if there is a way to maybe create these new procedures at the end of the document for now, and then move the pages.  I'm a newbie to FrameMaker (about 6 months into it now) and I'm discovering new stuff pretty much every day I work with it.

Is it possible to move pages around?  Am I dreaming?  You know, a la InDesign where I could basically move pages as if they were their own entity?

You two have really saved my rear end here, I thank you very much!

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Hi Jim:

I can give you a work-around, but only if you promise to come back and fix it later.

You can add disconnected pages via Insert > Add Disconnected Pages (v 2017) or Special > Add Disconnected Pages in all earlier versions. Try adding 2 on page 58, and make a new flow tag, i.e. B.

I need to be clear that we are making a file that isn't flowing correctly worse by adding disconnected pages. One of the strengths of Fm is its ability to reflow content after edits and this will slow you down even more. However, it will let you meet your deadline. Work on a copy of the file.

~Barb

P.S. InDesign does allow you drag pages and spreads around, but you end up with the threaded frames completely out of order. I just helped someone fix this on the InDesign forum the other day.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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I'm curious...what would the reason be to not to leave the flow the same as the previous (likely Flow A)?

-Matt

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Well, the situation I find myself in is that I was waiting on a colleague to provide me a copy of the images for four procedures that are for four parts of the widget I'm writing the manual on -- let's call them Widget Part L, M, N, and O.

I wrote the whole manual for Widget Parts A-K and P-Z and did not leave room for L-O because I did not know how much space I would need, and in my FrameMaker Ignorance, I assumed that I would be able to just add some pages and do the deed.  I am the fool here, this is no one else's fault but my own, and I own my mistakes!

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Sorry, Jim, I was asking Barb why she'd change the flow tag...

I wouldn't think you'd need to create a Flow B to the disconnected pages.

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jimlight AUTHOR
Explorer ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Do you know...  I actually feel guilty doing that!! 

I am going to make a copy of the file and try your workaround.  I am also spending this evening creating anchored frames because I feel like a slacker!
I gotta do things the right way, I know you know what I mean!

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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You will likely find one or more object styles handy for formatting your anchored frames.

Here's my Object Style Catalog, followed by the settings in one of my more useful styles (pardon the typo in the label):

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jun 27, 2018

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Hi Jim!

I gotta do things the right way, I know you know what I mean!

Yes, I do know what you mean—and really, it shouldn't take that long. (Maybe you are almost done!) That's the best choice in the long run. You'll be glad you did it the right way, because text will flow and reflow with edits—just like you want it to.

~Barb

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