Selecting all layer object in layer panel selects locked objects too

[Sorontar]

Selecting all layer object in layer panel (clickin at the right most part of the layer).
It selects locked object too if there is only one object locked. And I am able to move this locked object with all the other selected stuff. What does the meaning of the lock here? What is this feature good for?

[Monika Gause]

A lot of people have asked that and so far we haven't found an answer.

[CarlosCanto]

Click on the Target Circle instead, that should not select locked objects

[Kurt Gold]

I don't remember exactly, but about 15 years ago there was a long-winded discussion about this behaviour in this forum. Many pros and cons were fervidly debated and at least one Illustrator engineer confirmed that it is intended behaviour.

In short, think about an Illustrator layer as a real container that is stored at a harbour. You can throw all kinds of objects into that container and tether them, so they are locked. If some crane now takes the entire container and humps it onto the loading area on a freighter, it is pretty consistent that the locked objects inside the container move together with the container. And then the freighter can go from Shanghai to New York or elsewhere.

Basically, I do like this behaviour in Illustrator. What I don't like is that it is not consistently implemented. For example, if a main layer contains at least one sublayer and that sublayer is entirely locked or all objects inside the sublayer are locked, the real container idea as outlined above doesn't work anymore. All locked (or hidden) objects inside the main layer will then not be selected.

I agree that there should be an option to control the behaviour. Such as the one that currently controls whether locked and hidden objects are moved together with artboards.

[Eugene Tyson]

It's 100% a bug.

It's not a harbour. 

There's many reasons to lock a layer and not have that item deleted. 

I'm not arguing with anyone - it should be an option

Delete Locked Objects = Yes or No

InDesign does not work like this

You lock an object and you cannot select it the same why by hitting the layer square - it won't select it.

There's no harmonisation on the products.
And I'm aware that InDesign Layers and Illustrator layers are different. 

In my case: https://community.adobe.com/t5/illustrator-discussions/locked-items-within-layer-able-to-delete/m-p/...

I want to keep certain elements that are technical elements specific to that artwork. 

I can get around it by having them locked - turning off the other layers and pressing CMD A

This selects all on the artboard except the locked objects.

But it's clunky.

It should be at least an option to select the Layer square and delete and then a warning to delete locked objects or not.

I found an open case in the Bugs Forums

https://illustrator.uservoice.com/forums/601447-illustrator-desktop-bugs/suggestions/38315200-select...

I've added my voice here too.

It's not intuitive and works differently across the suite of products.

[Kurt Gold]

You are right, it's not a harbour. But I guess you may understand the container part of the short description.

You may also call it a bug, but according to Teri Pettit (a former Illustrator engineer) it is indeed intended behaviour, not a bug. As already mentioned, we once had an acute discussion about the topic. Unfortunately, it is not there in this forum anymore.

If you never have the need to select and move an entire layer including locked objects (which can be pretty useful), then just do what Carlos recommended above.

[Eugene Tyson]

I know how to do it already. That's not the question.

[Kurt Gold]

Yes, you described your workaround and called it clunky.

Just clicking the Target circle in the Layers palette does what you want in one step.

[Eugene Tyson]

Yes it's clunky.

What's wrong in saying that. 

[Kurt Gold]

You can call it whatever you like, but you just don't have to use your clunky workaround.

The Selection column and the Target column are located side by side in the Layers palette.

If you want to select an entire layer including locked objects, use the Selection column to do it.

If you want to select an entire layer without selecting locked objects, then just use the Target column.

[Eugene Tyson]

Call  it whatever you like - it's wrong

Bug - incorrect - whatever

It's shiit.

[Kurt Gold]

Well, good luck with your attitude.

[nou.lionandchild]

I must be missing something, because both Selection column and Target column select all objects and groups within layer (or group, or nested group, doesn't matter) exactly the same, including locked objects and groups... I have to then shift-click on any of locked objects/groups to deselect all locked objects. Here, again, it doesn't matter at all, if I click on Select or Target column. And IIRC, this behaviour changed some years ago. 

[MikeGondek]

Your post asks why clicking on the column showing the yellow arrow is for. That is if you want to select all items regardless if they are locked. Just click in the column under the red arrow to not select locked items

[Eugene Tyson]

<profanity removed - apologies, I'm better than that>

Locked objects shouldn't be

[nou.lionandchild]

Do you have any idea of a possible reason why this doesn't work like this for me? Clicking either column selects everything. I have to then shift-click on any of the locked objects/groups to deselect all of them. 

[Monika Gause]

Can you please show screenshots?

Before and after selection.

[nou.lionandchild]

As I wrote, it doesn't matter if I click on Select or Target column, and as you can see, everything, including hidden and locked objects/groups gets selected. I then have to either shift-click on locked, or just click on hidden layer to deselect those objects/groups which should not get selected in the first place. This is annoying as hell when I have dozens or even hundreds of individual new objects in the layer, which I want to group, because if I press group shortcut, everything gets grouped, including hidden objects within groups. So I have to scroll to the first hidden/locked object and shift-click it and only then I can group what I wanted. This behaviour is even stranger considering that you cannot otherwise nest a group which has an invisible object in it and a dialog about inability to group objects from different groups pops up if you try.

[nou.lionandchild]

Ah, and it doesn't matter, that there are only groups on this screenshot. It works the same if there are loose objects or any mix of objects/groups/nested layers.

[nou.lionandchild]

I just checked - it works as intended in Illustrator 25.4.6 but not in 27.9

[Monika Gause]

Works for me in version 27.8.1 and in 27.9

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cr56yFt_PHY 

So maybe you need to reset the preferences, reboot the computer or the like.

[Kurt Gold]

Ah, and it doesn't matter, that there are only groups on this screenshot. It works the same if there are loose objects or any mix of objects/groups/nested layers.

For sure, it actually does matter how the layers are structured and what they contain. As I mentioned above, the main issue of the behaviour in my view is that it is pretty inconsistent, just depending on what is stored in the container.

Can you perhaps share a sample Illustrator file? Then I may try to explain what happens.

[nou.lionandchild]

It's completely not file dependent, it works this way for me since at least late version 26 in every file, old and new, simple and complex. Resetting preferences doesn't solve a thing either. I guess it is probably the same answer I got on numerous previous occasions - I'm on OSX Catalina (can't upgrade because of other soft's compatibility issues with newer OSX) and v.27 seems to have a lot of unsolvable problems on that OS, both functional and with performance. 

[Kurt Gold]

If you can provide a sample Illustrator file, I'm pretty sure that I can explain (or describe) why you are facing the behaviour. Probably I can also provide a workaround to prevent the unwanted behaviour.

You may trust me that it can get insanely complicated. We once debated this topic in extenso a long time ago in this forum (predecessor version).

I may take a look into my archive. I had a sample file that demonstrates the inconsistencies.

[nou.lionandchild]

You can't really say, that this behaviour is "content dependent", if even in case of the simplest new document, with just a few simple rectangles in it, right after fresh properties reset, it will still behave the same as soon as there is even a single group of two objects in the layer. Pure objects layers work as you both say, groups are always selected via both columns, no matter if invisibile or locked. It is also a perfectly consistent behaviour, it always works like this. Completely unlike in Monika's video. So thank you both for your time and responses, there is really nothing more here to discuss. I'll just have to live with yet another Illustrator quirk on Catalina, since I won't try any "nuclear" option, like e.g. a fresh system install.