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I have a big textbook project that I have been working on for over five years and plan to continue updating on a regular basis. The goal is a free, online PDF ebook, but which people can print if they wish. (Maybe porting it to a website via IN5, but that's a project for the future.) I'm doing it all by myself. In my spare time, but with lots of content reviewer/contributors.
I have divided the textbook into four volumes, each with several chapters. Originally, I had it in four one-volume .indd files, but ran into performance problems (like, InDesign totally locking up: see https://community.adobe.com/t5/indesign-discussions/three-documents-freezing/m-p/14362906#M558068).
I have since gotten good advice like:
Right now, for each multi-chapter volume, I have a Book Panel ("book" in InDesignese but not a book in plain English usage so I will keep calling it a Book Panel). For each of these four volume-specific Book Panels, I have designated the same .indd file, titled AppSAR Chapter Template.indd, as the Style Master. (AppSAR is short for Appalachian Search and Rescue, the name of the textbook.) That's right, I'm using the same Style Master for all four volume Book Panels. Nobody told my I couldn't, so I did it to help keep all of the styles consistent through all four of the volumes. Seems to be working OK so far. I can make a change to AppSAR Chapter Template, then use each of the four volume Book Panels to sync those changes ("cascading") to all of the chapters within each volume's Book Panel.
One of the main things I'm using the Book Panel for is to sync styles, particularly Paragraph Styles, between all of the chapter. One issue I've run into with doing things this ways is when I tried to rename a style folder in AppSAR-Chapter-Template.indd and then sync it to the various chapters. Don't do it. It doesn't work.
There is one other issue with syncing my (many) Paragraph Styles between the various chapters: the ordering of the styles. In the Paragraph Styles Panel of AppSAR-Chapter-Template.indd, I carefully arranged all the Paragraph Styles so that the most commonly-used ones are near the top, and styles that are used together are grouped together. All well and fine.
When you sync Paragraph Styles using the Book Panel, it indeed syncs all of the Paragraph Styles. What it doesn't do is sync that ordering of them that I laboriously did in AppSAR-Chapter-Template.indd. Back when I had only four big volume files, not 16 individual chapter files, it wasn't hard to keep the order synced between those four .indd files. But now, with 16 different .indd files, it's labor-intensive to get the Paragraph Styles in the same order in each of those files. And as I said at the outset, I expect to be editing these files weekly or sometimes daily in the preparation of new drafts, so it makes my work easier when the Paragraph Styles are in the same order. If anyone has figured out how to sync the order of styles, please let me know! If not, vote for the feature request https://indesign.uservoice.com/forums/601021-adobe-indesign-feature-requests/suggestions/40754158-st.... And for exporting individual chapters as PDFs from the Book Panel, there is already a feture request that you can vote for: https://indesign.uservoice.com/forums/601021-adobe-indesign-feature-requests/suggestions/38548021-ex....
Here is a listing of my Paragraph Styles, which I use both for my textbook and for my class handouts. I use Word for the class handouts so that I can use EndNote to prepare (often extensive lists of) citations and import into InDesign; thus, the EndNote Bibiliographies style. I don't use that in my textbook, as I put references in simple footnotes. That way I can (a) avoid the extensive reformatting required by importing a Word file that has superscripts for citation references and italics for species. (InDesign's import puts the text in superscript or italics but never bothers to turn them off) and (b) edit text and do page layout at the same time in InDesign.
Here is my list of current favorites, in case you're interested. I made this by (a) sorting the paragraph styles in my Chapter Template .indd file, and (b) using Snagit's Scrolling Capture (had to scroll slowly) and then Grab Text functions to get the list into a form I could paste into my MS Word Style Guide Keith.docx file for easy reference.
[Basic Paragraph]
Hl
H2
H2 Subhead
H 2 Sidehead
H2 Sub-Subhead
H3 Knot URL
H3
H3 Sub-Subhead
H3 Subhead
H4
Field Subhead Left
Field Subhead Centered
FirstPara
Body
Bullet
Bullet with Space After
Bullet 2
Bullet 2 with Space After
Bullet 3
Bullet 3 with Space after
Bullet in Margin
Blockquote
Blockquote Bullet
Blockquote Bullet with space after
Blockquote no space after
Blockquote Bullet 2
Pull Quote
Sidebar Heading
Sidebar Subheading
Sidebar Text
Sidebar Footnote Text
Sidebar Text Single-Spaced
Sidebar Text Bullet 1
Sidebar Text Bullet 2
Sidebar Text First Line Indent
Sidebar Text Important Point
Sidebar Text Indent 1
Sidebar Text Indent 2
Important Point Heading
Important Points Title
Important Points Title for frame
Important Point
Important Point indented
Important Point indented 2
Caption
Caption 2
Caption attribution
Caption Left-justified
Caption Left-justified No Number
Caption Subhead Centered
Caption Subhead Left Bullet
Caption-in-Graphic
Change History Heading
Definition Heading
Definition Definition
Definition Phonetic
Definition Term
Marginal Text
Marginal Heading
Marginal Text Bullet
Marginal Text Bullet 1
Marginal Text Bullet 2
Table Heading
Table Subhead
Table Text
Table Text bullet
Table Text R justified
Card Bullet
> Styles you shouldn’t need to apply
Here are some of the characteristics of the most important styles, along with a couple of tricks:
I am laying out what I've done and discovered in case it helps others. I suspect I'm going to run into some issues as I keep down this path, so any advice welcomed.
Thanks for reading this far!
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Quite a conundrum
I'd suggest using Style Groups
So you can go to the Headings and select the headings
Body group - for all your body text
=======
Have you tried 'Loading Styles'
Try a sample file first - don't do it on your main files for now
So in one of your Chapters - go to the Paragaraph Styels panel -a nd the sub menu - choose Load Paragraph Styles
You can then select your Template file
Then Select All
it will also include the Character Styles (you don't have to - you can pick and choose
Then you can replace the Styles in your document and 'use incoming definition'
I'm not sure if this will realign the structure you're intent on using.
Periodically you could reload the styles if it works.
But having Sync styles on and a parent style document in the Book File should work - I'm not sure what you need a parent template file for
I'd just pick the first page of teh book - make some parent pages that you don't use - and put in all the style samples you need with the Paragraph Styles and Character Styles used
You could name Parent Pages as Headers - then another one called - Body - and another called - Tables - another called -Captions- etc.
Then when you need to update your styles - sync to the file in the Book File contianing all your unused Parent Pages that contain all the styles you use.
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As you obviously know and as Eugene has further commented, ID does have a variety of tools to handle variorum publication. I have several books that are updated often enough to need some of this kind of management, and I've adopted several approaches.
The one thing you're not going to get, even with those tools, not without considerable effort in setup and probably some custom scripting as well, is any kind of "Push A, Push B, Push C" system where spitting out updates of two or three variant versions is simple or automatic. Even if technically attainable, that would take more effort than the cumulative total effort of exporting several updates across a year or so, and would likely be fragile as well.
Making two assumptions, here —
Unless there's something about your project that accelerates these time assumptions, I'd use a combination of Books (one per edition, more or less) and Conditional Text to help shape the internal content and flow of each chapter. Far better, in my experience and opinion, to have one master version of each chapter, use CT to swap content in and out, and then a dedicated Book to compile, renumber and TOC each edition than any other combination I can think of. In particular, don't try too hard to have one of anything do too many jobs (e.g. one Book that you somehow reconfigure) or multiply elements (e.g. have two or three variant chapter files you have to keep in sync).
And have a written process or checklist for each edition, so you don't have to remember details about which chapters need CT switching etc. You will develop a perfected process... and then forget it when you come back around six months later.
And, future comment on future plans, which I think we've discussed: if you aren't concerned about digital copy protection, HTML could be a very good alternative, and likely attainable without need for anything like In5. InDesign's export from print layout to HTML is very good and very manageable with advanced use of CSS styles. For all of In5's capabilities, it does not seem best suited to long-form docs and tends to generate complex code that could get insanely bulky for a long, complex book. Direct export gives you more control and produces, usually, cleaner and more streamlined code suited to "books" instead of short, highly designed publications like presentations or brochures.
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Are you OVERWRITING your original / currently open file - every time you are doing Save As?
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Yes. It's easy, which is why I've been doing it. Someone else had recommended as a way to get cruft out of the file. A long time ago, I had seen another post recommending saving it as an .idml file every night to really get the cruft out of it. Do you not recommend this? If not, why?
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Yes. It's easy, which is why I've been doing it. Someone else had recommended as a way to get cruft out of the file. A long time ago, I had seen another post recommending saving it as an .idml file every night to really get the cruft out of it. Do you not recommend this? If not, why?
By @keithconover
Save As WITH A NEW NAME - YES - but OVERWRITING your currently open file is a big NO NO.
If something goes wrong - you may lose your file...
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But I just used Save a Copy to save a copy to avoid that problem. Which IS saving it under a new name. And I want the procedure to be easy enough that I do it on a regular basis every time I leave my computer for a while. I saved it under [original file name] copy.indd.
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But I just used Save a Copy to save a copy to avoid that problem. Which IS saving it under a new name. And I want the procedure to be easy enough that I do it on a regular basis every time I leave my computer for a while. I saved it under [original file name] copy.indd.
By @keithconover
In your opening post - you wrote:
[...] I simply first "Save a Copy" and save it over the previous [filename]-copy.indd and then "Save As" and save over [filename].indd. [...]
So you ARE overwriting your original file - the one that is still open.
And as you are OVERWRITING both files at the same time - your previous copy and current file - you have NO BACKUP AT ALL - in case it will hit the fan...
The better option would be if you add current date or even "counter" to the copy - and keep all copies - just in case, if you will have to go back few versions... or just to check something...
HDDs / SSDs are cheap - doing it from scratch... and there are free online places - like Google Drive.
Or if you have GMail - or any other email account with web interface - you could ZIP / RAR it and attach it to a draft message - another "remote, temporary backup".
Or even email it to yourself - but only if you leave it there - not download to your computer.
Of course you can do purge from time to time - but you should still keep a monthly copy - at least... just in case it will hit the fan...
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Well, every time I leave my desktop for a few hours, or just before bedtime, my data/content files get backed up to my laptop using GoodSync. Every night my data/content files are backed up to Infrascale online. Every night my hard drive is incrementally backed up via Acronis TrueImage to an external hard drive that, every month, gets swapped with one I keep in my locker at work.
What you're talking about is more along the lines of versioning as we do when working on computer code. It would be nice if InDesign offered versioning.
From time to time, I create a draft PDF to circulate, and that gets that day's date as the beginning of the filename.
Also, from time to time, I save a versioned .indd file, again with that day's date as the beginning of the filename. For instance: 2023-05-23-AppSAR-1-Survival.indd. Maybe at the end of a large chunk of time editing a file, I should save it with such a dated name, rather than overwriting AppSAR-1-Survival copy.indd each time.
Thanks for forcing me to think about this! And I hope that others see this thread and benefit from your advice as well.
And, this just inspired me to go to https://indesign.uservoice.com/forums/601021-adobe-indesign-feature-requests/suggestions/36060232-fi... and upvote it. And add a link to this thread.
Thank you!
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Yeah, you can call it versionig.
All the backups you do - are perfectly fine - it's just I would never overwrite any file(s) - especially one that is currently open...