Chapter number away from spine

Explorer ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Hi,

I'm working on a small book (not using book feature) in newest version of InDesign.

 

I want to have chapter numbers appear away from spine - see enclosed. How do I do this?

 

I tried chosing away from spine in the paragraph style but that does not help in terms of the number always showing up before the text - on right hand pages I want the chapter number to be right justified - text to the left - and on left hand pages I want the chapter number to be left justified - text to the right. See image.

 

Can this be done?

 

Best wishes,

Anita

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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One way woulld be to create a text frame on your Master / Parent page that is as wide as the page margins and as tall as required to hold the page number. Create a paragraph style for page numbers that is set to align away from the spine and apply it to the page marker in this text frame.

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Explorer ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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But would that solve the problem that the number on one page would be on the right, and on the facing page on the left? Both the chapter number and the chapter title is in the same paragraph (line)

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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I suspect you will need separate frames for the number and the chapter head, or you will need to set up two Parent/Master pages, one left, one right, as a master spread which I think would be preferable. That will allow you to have different inside and outside margins as well.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Hi @Belsen01:

 

I'm not sure I understand the question. Is this what you are asking for?

rh.png

If so, set the alignment to left and use a Right Indent tab to separate the chapter number from the chapter head. It's Shift+Tab and it will push everything to the right of the cursor to the right side of the frame. 

 

Or is it this? This will require tab stops, in different locations on the facing pages. If this is it, we can help explain how to set the tabs.

rh2.png

 

~Barb

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Explorer ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Hi,

That's the look I want. My problem is that right now my chapter format is as follows:

3.2 (tab) Chapter name - I want the number (and only the number) to be away from spine, but what happens when the chapter number+chapter name is on a right hand side - then the chapter number would be to the left. 

Maybe the way to go is to write the numbers manually in seperate text boxes and create anchors to the chapter titles?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Hi @Belsen01:

 

I'm still clarifying the question.

 

  1. So you are using the Running Head variable, to pull the running head content off of the body pages, and make it look like my second screen shot?
  2. And you are manually typing in the chapter numbers and not using Auto-numbers?

 

~Barb

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Explorer ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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I'm not using running headers - yet. Only tried that once. But maybe that's the way to go. However, I am not sure it would work as the running header would have to show the number to the left of the chapter titel when on a left page and reverse if the text gets pushed to the next page. 

I hope I was able to explain it ok now. 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Hi @Belsen01:

 

I have to run but here's what I think you are asking for? I'm still guessing, but if it is correct, let us know and we can tell you how to accomplish it.

 

~Barb

 

running head.gif

 

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Explorer ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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No, that's not it 😞 Sorry for being so poor at explaining it. 

I want it to look like the image I uploaded. Normally you would have it like this in a book:

 

3.2   Chapter Head

Body text ...

3.2   Chapter Head (the number being in the same location to the left on both left and right hand sides.

 

I want the number to be at the left hand side of the body text if the chapter starts on a left page. Then to jump to the right hand side (the number that is - not the Chapter Head which is now on the left of the number if the text flows to a right side. Hope that's more clear?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 06, 2022 Jan 06, 2022

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Can you please show a larger screenshot or a sample file to clarify what you're asking?

 

Seems to me you just need to have these on your master pages.

And on the left page put the numbering - then the title

And on the right page put the title- then the numbering

 

You can use Text Variables to pull this information.

You don't need 2 text frames on each left and right page - 1 text frame per page.

 

Inbetween your text variables - you will need a Right Indent Tab (usually pressing Shift Tab)

As @Barb Binder already pointed out - very well.

 

Previously - I've setup books up to 3000 pages with 6 or more running heads per page. 

I and others have extensive workflow knowledge of this.

 

If you like you can share your files and we can talk  you through the correct setup for this.

 

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Explorer ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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Hi,

Here is a larger image which shows what I am looking for - note that it is headers inside the body text that I talk about.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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The only way I can think of to accomplish that is to put the numbers in separate frames as anchored objects, aligned away from the spine.

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Explorer ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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Ok, thank you very much for helping me everybody. It is much appreciated.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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You could also use a 2 cell table. Tables can extend outside the text frame. 

David Creamer
Adobe Certified Instructor, Adobe Certified Professional, and Adobe Certified Expert (since 1995)

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Guide ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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I think the biggest hurdle is that the number comes before the text in left pages, and after the text in right pages. Here's an example set up with custom anchored frames:

Screen Shot 2022-01-07 at 12.43.39 PM.png

…but when text flow changes which page an item is on, it doesn't automatically change the position of the anchored frame:

Screen Shot 2022-01-07 at 12.43.54 PM.png

If I were doing this, I'd wait until all of the type was set and manually move the frames to their correct position. It could be possible to write a script to do this, but a scripting expert would have to tell you that (which isn't me…sorry).

 

EDIT: I found a way to make it work

 

You need 3 styles to make this example work. One for the body, one for the bold title and one for the anchored frame with the number. If you set the leading for the title to zero with no space before or after, it will align horizontally with the number anchored frame:

Screen Shot 2022-01-07 at 1.06.54 PM.pngScreen Shot 2022-01-07 at 1.07.12 PM.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 07, 2022 Jan 07, 2022

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Would you be interested in using Adobe FrameMaker?

The left pages use a single style; the right pages use two styles. (Edit: No anchored frames necessary.)

I would wait until all edits are completed until changing the formatting.

image.png

David Creamer
Adobe Certified Instructor, Adobe Certified Professional, and Adobe Certified Expert (since 1995)

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