InDesign Kerning-Bug (DE/EN)

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

(DE) Ich habe in InDesign das Problem, dass sich beim Einstellen des Kerning-Abstands nicht nur der Abstand zwischen den gewünschten Zeichen verändert, sondern auch andere Abstände beeinflusst werden. Das Problem tritt bei allen getesteten Schriften auf und betrifft sowohl den optischen als auch den metrischen Kerning-Modus.  Danke

(EN) I have an issue in InDesign where adjusting the kerning not only changes the spacing between the selected characters but also affects various other spacings. This problem occurs with all tested fonts and in both optical and metric kerning modes. Thanks

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

By the way, I am using the latest Windows 11 Pro with the latest InDesign version.

[Peter Kahrel]

This looks like a display problem. You can check whether the space between the p and the r (in your example) really changes by taking the horizontal position of the r before and after applying the kerning. The cursor position's horizontal position is shown in the Info panel (F8 or Window > Info).

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

That was a good tip, thanks! And yes, it does shift, and it's indeed a display-bug. However, I also have this display issue on another device with Windows 10 and a different GPU. So it seems to be a general Windows problem? But how can I set good kerning if I can't trust the display? 😞

[Peter Kahrel]

>  yes, it does shift, and it's indeed a display-bug.

Well, if those other pairs really shift then it's not a display bug, but a kerning bug.

The shift probably doesn't occur when you zoom out a bit. Did you try that?

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

Thanks again Unfortunately, the display errors are still present when zooming. In the following example at 1600 % with high display quality. The errors are not as obvious, but they are still there, as can be seen.

[Peter Kahrel]

I tried with the font you use (Montserrat) and I can see the same problem, in the place, with the same characters. The kerning of the characters does not change, it's really a display problem. When you use other fonts you'll see the same, though with different characters.

It's not necessarily an InDesign problem, I've seen this happen when you zoom in and out, also in e.g. Acrobat.

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

Thank you, Peter! Should I report this to Adobe or are the responsible developers reading this forum? (does reporting it actually help?) I think this is a significant problem. But at least, thanks to you, I can rule out problems with my computer.

[Dave Creamer of IDEAS]

I do not think it is a problem or bug per se but a difference between a monitor resolution and the kerning settings. Kerning/Tracking is 1/1000 of an em, generally a very fine amount (on 17 pt type, it would be 0.0017 pts). 

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

Even with larger kerning steps, the problem persists. Moreover, kerning is intended precisely for such small adjustments. By the way, alternative programs like Affinity have no display issues at all.

[Dave Creamer of IDEAS]

Interesting. I'll have to try it when I get to my production computer. 

I looked up Affinity Page kerning specs (I own the Affinity programs too). It looks to be the same amounts as InDesign's. But I did learn a new word: "permilles", which is a parts per thousand. In this case, 1/1000 of an em.

[Peter Kahrel · Accepted solution]

I can confirm that the problem doesn't occur in Affinity, so it looks as if this is an Adobe problem.

@Holger Walter34008837xo0j : Go to https://indesign.uservoice.com to log a bug.

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

Done: https://indesign.uservoice.com/forums/601180-adobe-indesign-bugs/suggestions/49555862-indesign-kerni...

[Mike Witherell]

When I watch the video, I see you (probably) kerning between the characters on the left tighter or looser. That means that all the rest of the characters to the right of the insertion point are also going to move. 

But because InDesign's typesetting engine is also "musing" several outcomes and finally settling on one, any kerning in the line of text can trigger InDesign to re-think the rest of the line and/or paragraph. That is what Paragraph Composer does.

To test that theory, change your paragraph style to call for Paragraph Composer and also test the behavior when set to Single Line Composer. Perform your kerning under both conditions and see if the problem persists or is different.

Oh, just one more thing: always use the correct spell-check language on the text. In your example, you are kerning English-language words while the text language is set to German. See the red squiggle underscoring? That might be confusing the matter.

[Holger Walter34008837xo0j]

Thanks also to you for the help. Unfortunately, it didn't help.