Pantone Connect PMS to CMYK conversion

[positive_Rocket1587]

Has anyone used the pantone connect subscripton to successfully convert a PMS to CMYK values please?

The client has 2607 corporate colour which I need to convert for CMYK printing job.

Using pantone connect the breakdow it gives me is:

C 68 M 100 Y0 B0

It looks quite off.... (I know this is likely due to the differences between the inks)

I don't have the PMS colour bridge swatch to check, can anyone confirm this is correct please?

Thank you for any help!

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

You're right, that CMYK value is not a good match, at least on-screen.

A fairly reliable color site gives C33 M94 Y0 K53, which is about as close an onscreen match as I could want:

(And yes, I realize there's several layers of fudge in this recipe!) But apples to apples...

Frankly, I no longer trust Pantone, especially in things like color equivalencies. They seem to have withdrawn their former "universal standard" position, which seems as if it would be eminently profitable even with only a partial paying user base, in favor of a relentless "pay me" model that's greatly reduced their usefulness outside of the most lavishly budgeted shops. I try not to work with PMS except in the most indirect ways.

[Willi Adelberger]

Use Adobe Color ManG, the values are different, depending on the output profile. 

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

It all depends on the degree of accuracy/conformance needed. If "close" is all that's asked, I'd go with the above mix for general commercial printing.

If "as close as possible" is demanded, say to match other printed pieces, it will require cooperation with the printer and matching of the mix to their exact press profile, and maybe a press check against a Pantone chip.

And if they're really insistent, then only a Pantone spot color will really assure satisfaction.

(My recollection on this is with Novell, the original LAN company. They had two Pantone colors and were as insanely protective of them as any current high-end luxury brand. You had to request the full media/color kit and get permission to print anything using their logo or colors, and send in samples... and if they didn't match closely enough, they would demand they be withdrawn from use.)

That purple is going to be a tricky shade to hit, so I hope "close enough" is all they're asking, unless they have the budget for a spot ink.

[Eugene Tyson · Accepted solution]

Hi superstardj,

The conversion you're seeing from Pantone Connect might indeed seem off because Pantone to CMYK conversions can vary depending on the tools you use. Pantone Connect is based on LAB values, which represent how we perceive colors, and those can sometimes be tricky when converting to CMYK.

Pantone 2607C to CMYK

From what I can find, Pantone 2607C typically converts to something like C 84 M 100 Y 0 K 3

These values might give you a closer match for printing.

The breakdown you got (C 68, M 100, Y 0, K 0) is a bit less saturated and would likely result in a different hue.

Pantone Colour Bridge: The Colour Bridge swatch book is the most reliable resource for matching Pantone to CMYK. If you don't have it on hand, you can refer to Pantone's official documentation or online tools that simulate those values.

Or contact the printer(s) producing the print and ask them what CMYK values would be best to best match the Pantone colour.

Double-Check on Proofs

Even with Pantone-approved conversions, there are always differences when shifting from spot colours (PMS) to CMYK.

Always test the output on your proof or printer to see how close the conversion gets to the desired colour.

It’s not uncommon to adjust these CMYK values slightly based on the specific print job, paper type, or ink limitations to get the best result. So, tweaking might be needed after a test run and perhaps your printer could help with this.

You could always send them a previous printed job and ask them to match it - as they can make tweaks on press.

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Best advice I can offer - contact the Printers who are producing the printed piece - it's imperative you work closely with them to get the best match.

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Hope this helps!

[positive_Rocket1587]

Thank you, really helpful! Yes, my conversion was pretty much the same as you were able to find... The client seems to want to design their own materials in coreldraw so I have advised about the colour conversion and suggested they contact the printer for further colour queries!

[rob day]

The client seems to want to design their own materials in coreldraw so I have advised about the colour conversion

Just make sure they understand that 2607 is out-of -gamut and can’t be reproduced via standard process CMYK offset inks. The appearance of  CMYK 84|100|0|3 would depend on the press conditions (the press profile), and InDesign will display it differently depending on the document’s assigned CMYK profile:

Offset printing on an uncoated sheet:

[rob day]

Hi @positive_Rocket1587 , The appearance of any CMYK build is device dependant, so there would never be a single CMYK value that accurately simulates a Pantone solid ink color on all CMYK devices. Same goes for the display of a single CMYK build in InDesign—the on screen preview of the color depends on your document’s assigned CMYK profile which could be anything. This post might help with  branding color:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/indesign-discussions/branding-color-guide/td-p/10818696

[rob day]

It looks quite off....

Also, PANTONE 2607 C is well outside the gamut of any typical CMYK profile, so you’ll never get a match with offset printing.

[Enlightened_play5CFB]

I am latching on to this thread.
I wanted to ask Eugene where he gets his "typical" conversion values from and ask James for a link to his "fairly reliable color site."
I need to translate an entire RGB/HEX brand color palette (a wide range!) to PMS and CMYK values for print output, and I wonder what the best process is for me to get there.

The existing RGB/HEX palette takes advantage of the wide gamut and has bright, clear, clean colors that will be hard to match in PMS and CMYK, but I need to get the closest, best matches, and I'm looking for an efficient way to get "good" matches quickly. 
I need close standard/average PMS and CMYK values for the brand palette — I won't be able to determine the palette colors by test printing with all the different vendors on different materials. We may be able to do some test printing for individual jobs but even for those I need "good values" to go from – a standard PMS/CMYK palette that matches as close aspossible the RGB/HEX palette, if that makes sense.

Thank you!

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

I long ago bookmarked colorbase, which has a comprehensive conversion page for pretty much any color value to any other color value; I can't recall it ever being "off" for my purposes. (I'd rather not put a link here; easy to find under that name.)

But as this thread and others have established, such conversions are... for basic use or a first approxination only. Only a printer can tell you exactly what digital mix to use to most closely approximate solid colors on their press and your project.

There often are no good solutions if you are working with branded or otherwise coordinated material, either following strict (luxe-brand, etc.) design guidelines or trying to make an evolving suite of material produced over time all match. You either use Pantone or another color spec, work with a printer who can match exact colors (even if off from the Pantone spec) or put up with variations in the results.

But most value-to-value conversions are good enough for "business grade" and "commercial grade" work, allowing for a good understanding of gamut range and shift. —that is, the client needs to understand the tradeoff between shifted digital printing and extremely costly Pantone spot printing.

[Enlightened_play5CFB]

All good points. Thank you, James. 
Conversions are suitable as a basis, and for first approximations, I agree. The same is true when the colors make it to the guidelines — they are, just like other assets and guides, a recommended ideal. But you want this ideal to be as good and consistent as possible. 
I'm interested in the color managment tool you mentioned above. 

[James Gifford—NitroPress]

I'm interested in the color managment tool you mentioned above.

I'm not sure what you mean...

Ah. After an exchange in PM, I see that there are multiple entities out there under "colorbase" and the one that's easy to find is not the one I meant, nor is it very useful.

What I use and recommend is the conversion page under the name colorbase at

• [https] hex-to-rgb [dotcom]/convert/pantone-to-cmyk/