Adjust Layout and disappearing headers

[casinclaire]

I have a book layout in which I needed to adjust top/bottom margin  for a bit more balance. The book is completed, so it is too far along to siimply change the initial layout; this is a last-minute request from the client to shift everything up on the page. I went to the main master (upon which all the others in use are based) and opened Margins & Columns, intending to use "Adjust layout."

First thing is, it took something like 30 seconds (!) before the check mark would even appear in the Adjust Layout checkbox.  Then it took another 30 seconds, EACH, to change the margin measurements in the top, then bottom, margin fields.  I have 16 gigs of RAM on my machine and few processes running, so I tend to think this is an InDesign time lag, but I've never run into such a very slow response.  Yes, slow at times, but not like this.

So, first question:  Could this kind of thing be because the book is 200+ pages?  That doesn't make sense to me -- I've worked with larger manuscripts (though don't recall if I've tried to use "Adjust Layout" in any of them).  But even if the # of pages matters, why would InD start struggling even before I hit "OK"? I can't really even get to OK because just filling in the margin fields and trying to select the Adjust Layout box is taking such long, long minutes. (I first thought the program had frozen, and I chose to "end task" about three times before I figured out it was just delayed.)

Second thing is, when I sit it out and actually get the margins changed -- NOT that I've selected OK yet, but I just get the margin numbers changed -- my header text boxes disappear (I have Preview turned on).  The header text boxes are set to ignore text wrap (just as a precaution), and they are set to align to None, so they shouldn't be getting bumped in any way by the higher top margin or the "rising" text on the page. If anything, I'd expect them to overlap the page's main text box -- though, I actually did resize them so this wouldn't happen anyway, just for aesthetic purposes.

These two things are driving me crazy. I will add that, in general, I've noticed a lot of "slowness" in InD recently. Has anyone else experienced any of this sort of thing, or even just general lack of response, since any recent updates?  I'm running v. 14.0.3 x64 via Creative Cloud.

Any thoughts, anyone? Thanks in advance.

[Barb Binder]

No, I haven't see this before either, but here's what I would do:

• Use Save as... to make a copy of the file
• On the copy, cut or copy the header/footer frames to the clipboard
• Work your way through the Adjust Layout dialog box and walk away while it processes
• Hopefully it completes the update correctly, and if the header/footer frames are gone, just Paste in Place to restore them. Adjust position, if necessary.

~Barb

[casinclaire]

Thanks, Barb. That hopefully will work, at least for a temp workaround as far as the headers go (I like to think it would have occurred to me to try this sooner or later, LOL, but I was late for an appt and just wanted to get the query posted).

I am still puzzled about the slow program response but as for the headers,  I just went through the motions again, and THIS time I noticed that when the Adjust Layout "checkmark" finally appeared, the headers didn't actually disappear but, rather, both header text frames shrunk to about a pica square in size and shifted position to sit right in the hori and vert centers of the gutter of my two-page spread.

I expected the page/primary text frame to shift but not the header frames -- though maybe I shouldn't be surprised.  The shrinking and repositioning of header frames seems illogical, and yet, why should those frames be exempt from being "adjusted"?  On the other hand, I don't know what adjustment InD thinks it is making or why, especially since all I did was change the margins. 

Seems I've seen something like this before, with InD shrinking my header text frames and plopping them in the middle of my spread, but I don't remember the circumstances.  Does this info shed any further light on the subject for anyone?

[Barb Binder]

I've never seen InDesign plop the headers in the middle of the page, but auto-adjust does resize all the frames when you change the paper size. I can't speak specifically to how it is behaving with your document because I haven't seen it.

Hopefully, the workaround I shared will be sufficient, but if you want more control over what gets to resize and what does not, you can always define liquid layout rules which let you determine which frames will resize—and how—when you update your document size.

https://helpx.adobe.com/indesign/using/alternate-layouts-liquid-layouts.html

~Barb

[casinclaire]

Thanks.  I will definitely look into liquid layout rules.  I wasn't doing book design during my pre-self-employed days and never needed to explore it, and it's never come up since, so I have never really explored it -- wasn't even sure what it did and was under the impression that Adjust Layout had usurped its function.  But it is great to know it has some customizable features. re which frames get affected. That might be just the ticket for situations like this.

Just to be clear, in my InD doc, I didn't change the page size. I simply adjusted the top and bottom margins so that the text would ride a little higher on the page. I am pretty sure I did this for another book layout a month or so ago, and the Adjust Layout feature worked perfectly -- it did not touch my headers at all -- which is why I decided to use it this time. So this messing-with-my-headers thing is still a real mystery for me.

Anyway, I'll definitely look into Liquid Layout. Thanks for the tip. 🙂

[Barb Binder]

For book design, I recommend using a primary frame on the master pages. If you change the frame size (to accomodate new margins, for example) the body page text just reflows.

https://indesignsecrets.com/indesign-basics-primary-text-frames.php

~Barb

[casinclaire]

I am a long-time InD user and know about primary text frames; I've been designing books for years.  This new behavior is just something that hasn't happened to me before. I'd really like to know why it happened in this doc and not in a previous one where I performed the same process.

[casinclaire]

P.S. I didn't change the frame size to accommodate the new margins. I simply wanted it to move UP the page, which it did, but the headers relocated in the process. That is the real question -- as I mentioned, I'd done this in another book, and the header text frames weren't touched.

[Barb Binder]

If you have primary frames in place, you don't need to use Adjust Layout at all. Simply adjust the two primary frames on the master, and the body pages will update according. No other frames will move or adjust.

Again, I can't speak specifically to how Adjust Layout it is behaving with your document because I haven't seen it, nor why it was different with the other one, which I also haven't seen.

~Barb

[casinclaire]

Yes, of course, I can manually move the primary frames, and I likely will, after I manually change the margins. This problem isn't insurmountable. I just would like to use the tools available in the software and would like them to work correctly. I do appreciate all your suggestions, and I can get around this. It is just a mystery to me why it worked this way.  Maybe the problem was just a glitch with this particular doc, which can happen sometimes.  I must just have had a peculiar confluence of circumstances that just doesn't repeat itself with every doc, and I'll probably never figure out exactly what they were.  Or maybe Mercury was in retrograde....