Font thickness in InDesign CC 20

Explorer ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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Hello,

 

I have been working on a project in Indesign CC 19 and for some reason, I have to convert them to a higher version of CC 20.

 

When I do this. I notice the thickness of the font has been changed in CC 20 converted file.

 

I have attached a sample pdf file of both CC19 and CC20, where you can notice the change.

 

Name of the font: Seven One Eight-Extra Thin (OTF)

CC19 Version : 14.0.3

CC20 Version : 15:0.2

 

Since this thickness change is shown in pdf visual comparison, we need to convince the customer what is the potential cause. It will be helpful if somebody can answer what goes wrong here.

 

Thank you,

Nesan J

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Bug, Print, Type

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 10, 2020 Dec 10, 2020

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SevenOneEight seems to be the name of the foundry, rather than the name of a font – can you clarify?

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Explorer ,
Dec 10, 2020 Dec 10, 2020

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Hi,

 

It's the name of the font. Find the attached.

 

SevenOneEight.PNG

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 10, 2020 Dec 10, 2020

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If I inspect your PDF the text has a stroke applied. Select the text and make sure there is no stroke applied or the Weight is set to 0.

 

Screen Shot.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 10, 2020 Dec 10, 2020

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It appears the CC19 version has a separate vector object creating the stroke, above the live type, hopefully that can help you identify its source. One possible explanation would be the stroke is on a separate layer and you are exporting all layers in CC19 and just the live type layer in CC20?

CC 2019.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 10, 2020 Dec 10, 2020

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Hi Luke, I think any stroke amount greater than 0 applied to the text will show as Stroked Text in Acrobat. Here the top A has a .1pt stroke applied in InDesign, and the bottom version has the stroke set to 0:

 

Screen Shot 4.pngScreen Shot 5.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 11, 2020 Dec 11, 2020

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Hi Rob, normal stroked live text should remain as one object, the sample PDF has two objects, one of which is not live type, which is odd, suggesting it was done with some intent, or possibly by an automated workflow (trapping, for example), although the document properties description should indicate this. I can envision a scenario where a client said "show me a version with thin type and one slightly thicker" so the designer made a layer with slightly stroked text (outlined so the stroke alignment can include align stroke to inside). This doesn't explain why the CC19 PDF is different from the CC20 PDF.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 12, 2020 Dec 12, 2020

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If any of the answers are helpful or correct let me know - we can mark them as correct or you can do that yourself. 

Great answers and good detective work here guys! 

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Explorer ,
Dec 14, 2020 Dec 14, 2020

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Hello All,

 

Thank you for all response and study on this subject.

 

I was unaware that a stroke was applied to the text. Basically, stroke is not part of the style. Now I have corrected them.

 

But, one thing nudges me. Why I see the difference in thickness level when the stroke value is the same in both CC19 and CC20 versions. I'm not sure this something that happens with this particular font or any conversation issue between 19 and 20.

 

I  have attached, a screengrab of the stroke value from the live file, and the output pdf.

 

Any answer will be helpful to understand the issue happening during conversion.

 

Thank you

Indesign CC_19_Screen grab.PNGIndesign CC_20_Screen grab.PNG

 

Compare video link, which shows thickness difference.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xHotJijIQQT7qZZCBA_t1lj_1ztLJ7yC/view?usp=sharing 

 

 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 14, 2020 Dec 14, 2020

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As Eugene pointed out your PDF has 2 text objects—there are likely two copies of the AGNES text at the same X, Y position. You can check via the Layers panel:

 

Screen Shot 6.pngScreen Shot 7.png

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Explorer ,
Dec 14, 2020 Dec 14, 2020

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Hi Rob,

 

Sorry, I don't see any two layers in original InDesign file or output pdfLayer.PNG

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 14, 2020 Dec 14, 2020

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Why I see the difference in thickness level when the stroke value is the same in both CC19 and CC20 versions. I'm not sure this something that happens with this particular font or any conversation issue between 19 and 20.

 

It looks like there is transparency on the page. If you open both versions in Acrobat and view at a high magnification 600%+ do you see a weight difference? 

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Explorer ,
Dec 14, 2020 Dec 14, 2020

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Yes, I do notice a slight difference even magnifying to a maximum percentage. Especially "E" from "AGNES".

 

If you would like to check the pdf

 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1-x8yr25JQCeZa6zBhIN1C5LxodbHB2ep?usp=sharing 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 15, 2020 Dec 15, 2020

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Acrobat Preflight is showing the text as outlined and stroked in the 2019 version, and as stroked text in the 2020 version. When you convert text to outlines it loses its hinting—https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Font_hinting

 

Screen Shot 18.png

 

Screen Shot 19.png

 

 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 15, 2020 Dec 15, 2020

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Can you share the 2 InDesign files?

 

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Explorer ,
Dec 15, 2020 Dec 15, 2020

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 16, 2020 Dec 16, 2020

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When I export a PDF of the 2019 version I’m not getting the vector outlines that were showing in your PDF. Both ID versions have a .125 stroke applied to the text. 

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Explorer ,
Dec 17, 2020 Dec 17, 2020

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This was my export setting on both CC19/CC20

 

CC19 export.PNG

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Dec 17, 2020 Dec 17, 2020

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Not sure why your PDF has the vector objects—I don’t get them on an HQ export either. You didn’t provide the fonts, but that shouldn’t matter. 

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