InDesign Backwards Compatibility in CS5 an MAJOR issue

[Cynthia_Ryan_Graphic]

I am a print designer who works in InDesign. I bought CS3 Design Premium in late summer of 2008. Shortly thereafter CS4 came out, but after just having forked out a big chunk of change, I decided against upgrading to CS4 right away. Recently I considered upgrading but then heard CS5 was coming out so I decided to postpone the upgrade and wait for the new software. I've just checked out the trial version of CS5 InDesign and after speaking with Adobe Support have come to the conclusion that I can't upgrade to CS5. Why? BACKWARDS compatibility to CS3. The previously offered export features that supplied a path for backwards compatibility via an .inx file are gone.

I design freelance for a lot of different customers and once the design is complete, I have to deliver the InDesign file along with all associated fonts ad images to my clients. Most of my clients are still on CS3. If I upgrade to CS5 I will instantly not be able to work for 2/3 of my clients, as I will have no means by which to save a file backwards to CS3. I was informed by Adobe support that I would need to buy CS4 and CS5, as I could save my CS5 file in the IDML format and open it in CS4 and then I could save the file from CS4 as an INX file and open that is CS3. ARE THEY INSANE??? First off that requires keeping 3 version of InDesign up and running on my machine all of the time and secondly, why should I have to buy CS4 when I'm paying an additional fee to upgrade to CS5 because I didn't upgrade from CS4? This is so screwed up that it has to be an oversight---please tell me there is a patch in the works!!!

PS- I've never posted to a forum before, so if I have broken any rules of forum etiquette or offended in any way, I offer my apologies now and if I (and the Adobe Support staff I spoke to) have overlooked something, please enlighten me!

[KVL_NY]

I think for a LOT of designers this IS a major issue.

For instance, one of my clients, is a very big national marketing firm which has tons of work and pays very, very well, regularly commission designers from all over the country to create and craft the initial design for various projects.

Once the design is completed the InDesign Package is collected and given to thier production department to be set to their printing standards, as well as any future minor copy changes.   Then they commission another project.  This is a very lucrative relationship.

They are currently on CS4.  For them to upgrade to CS5 they have to upgrade their entire company of 500+ staff and production department.  So for them it's a big deal.  They will be on CS4 for a long time still.

I'd like to be able to create files for them in CS5 but it's just not realistic since downgrading is very difficult and it doesnt' retain a lot of the design formatting.  There would be too many foreseable problems, and in their case,  if a designer is creating files that are giving the production team headaches, there are plenty of other designers waiting for the work.  Especially now in this economy...

I think in those instances where you can be protective of your files, only send PDF's,  is not really in the majority of real work out there. The landscape of boutique work is changing just a bit in my opinion.

[Jeremy AB]

KVL_NY wrote:

Once the design is completed the InDesign Package is collected and given to thier production department to be set to their printing standards, as well as any future minor copy changes.   Then they commission another project.  This is a very lucrative relationship.

In the case of your example, if this relationship is as lucrative as you state, then I would stick with whatever version they are using. If you already own CS4 and that's what they use, then any work you do for them, do it in that version. It's all about managing your projects properly and using the tool, program and version that's right for the job. If you upgrade to CS5, you could perhaps use it for other projects though.

[KVL_NY]

You're right.  Exactly what I was suggesting earlier in the thread.  I have CS4 and CS5 for the purposes mentioned.

If I had to use CS5 only and work around the downward compatibilty issue, it would drive me nuts.

I think that's what a lot of people on this thread are suggesting.  That Adobe just make CS5 downward compatible so that a designer doesn't need to own both copies.

Have a good holiday.

😉

[Peter Spier]

There si no reason you can't continue to use your CS3 installation and also install CS5. Choose the version to suit the client.

Back-saving is at best a crapshoot as far as text reflowing, and you risk a lot of file damage if you inadvertently use a new feature. It just isn't a good workflow.

[macinbytes]

I don't see keeping 3-5 versions of InDesign as being too much to expect of a freelancer. Also probably a good idea to keep Illustrator CS3 at minimum for the compatibility. I think it just comes with the territory. This isn't MS Word where years of format confusion all culminates into DOCX and everyone is sick to their stomachs because they've had years of compatibility on a stagnant format designed a decade ago. It beats digging ditches.

Real complaints could be directed at Freehand, not InDesign.

An auto mechanic has to buy new tools as new cars come out, but still has to use the old ones to work on older cars. A bad analogy maker has to make new analogies when car analogies no longer work, but still have to use car analogies to explain why my Epson GS6000 solvent printer, like gasoline in a car, performs differently with different substrates. There is a point where you have to tell your client that you don't work on Trans AM's if you can't handle keeping all the tools around.

We used to make steel in this country. We are talking about gigabytes that cost less than a couple of dollars and a couple of minutes application launch time. I've got hundreds of custom dies eating up space that I can't get rid of because the moment I do someone will need a job printed and cut with one. Physical space costs money, the storage space for 4 versions of InDesign will cost less than the delicious sandwich I will soon eat.

[BJN3]

I also think it's ridiculous not to have a better workflow for backward compatibility. I've been working with InDesign CS5 and have yet to see a feature that suggests a new file format was necessary for this version. I suppose it's the dynamic/interactive content enhancements that are behind the format change. Since a key client is using CS3 and doesn't have any reason to upgrade, I'll likely set Bridge to default to the older software and may, on occasion, use CS5 when I have time to diddle around with it. It's tiring to be a working designer and see the Adobe fan club beat someone up because they're exasperated with the treadmill logic of the annual upgrade. Adobe could provide a compatibility mode of operation of InDesign, but they don't. That makes my job harder and I'm less likely to use the "wonderful" new scheisse I got in my Master Collection. Living on the bleeding edge doesn't pay my bills.

[Peter Spier]

I'm a very small one-man shop, and I've yet to see an upgrade to InDesign that wasn't able to pay for itself many times over in very short order from increased productivity, not to mention some of the things that each version has brought that expand the repertoire of what's possible.

I was a heavy Quark user until 2002, but I've never looked back since the release of ID 2.0, and I've never felt an upgrade was merely window dressing. Some have had more new features than others, and CS5 seems more geared to multimedia people than print guys like me, but there's pleny of stuff there that makes my work go faster. The faster I get the paying stuff done, the more time I have to spend here, and I spend A LOT of time here.

[BJN3]

(Eyes rolling) Good for you and your 14K posts. Glad you have time to make this work to your advantage and evangelize for big A too. I'm just tired of you happy campers telling others with real workflow issues that we should be just as gleeful as you.

[Peter Spier]

I'm sorry you have issues. What makes you think I don't?

I upgrade when I can afford it, by budgeting, and I leave previous versions installed so I don't have backward compatibility issues. I still have clients who need CS3 files and some will need CS4. This is not rocket science.

[BobLevine]

BJN3 wrote:

I'm just tired of you happy campers telling others with real workflow issues that we should be just as gleeful as you.

Nobody's telling anyone to be happy about anything. It's been explained over and over.

If you need a CS3 file, work in CS3. If you need CS4, work in CS4.

It's so simple I fail to grasp the complaints or the problem.

Bob

[BJN3]

Thanks, I appreciate condescention in lieu of helpful advice

and consideration.

[BobLevine]

It's very useful advice. The fact that you don't see it that way doesn't change a thing.

Bob

[Edgard_Melara]

I simply cannot understand how somebody who is in business for themselves can claim that they're not turning over enough money that they can't afford an upgrade every 18 months or so. I do know there's more to an upgrade than the $199 cost for the box of software, but what are you in business for if you don't want the new tools that can give you a competitive edge?

I'm always on the edge of my seat waiting for "The Next Big Thing", whether software or hardware... even getting burned using beta software.

I'm 63 and have run my own graphic design and advertising agency businesses all my working life, in Australia and here in the US. With a positive attitude you can make a lot of money in this business.

Do I miss cutting Rubylith? Not likely. But, please, forget being a Luddite and enjoy this exciting business and its wonderful new creative tools.

[peterpica]

Yes, of course--about as much as I miss opaqueing (sp?) negs on a

light table!

[BobLevine]

Doing what on who? 🙂

Bob

[Jongware]

Hey, my very first job!

The special red ink pens alone costed my first boss a couple of $100 a year. He sometimes complained me using too much of them, but if he needed to re-make a costly printing plate because of a missed dot I'd really done it.

[Michael_Gianino]

And don't forget if your hand slipped and you opaqued part of the film that you weren't supposed to, you had to scrape it off with an X-acto knife.

[peterpica]

Who's hand ever slipped?

My biggest problem was keeping cigarette ashes from dropping and

burning the film!

[Jongware]

It taught me to read mirrored and upside down text as easy as anything. Not something I can use in everyday life, though -- I don't spend much time standing on my head behind shop windows.

[peterpica]

Was great being able to read quotation summation sheets and/or

purchase orders from the other side of the desk too... so you could

see what you were up against.

[Peter Spier]

BJN3 wrote:

I've been working with InDesign CS5 and have yet to see a feature that suggests a new file format was necessary for this version. I suppose it's the dynamic/interactive content enhancements that are behind the format change.

I suspect multiple page sizes and span/split columns had a lot to do with changes, too, and those were very frequently requested features from ordinary users. Nobody here or at Adobe is holding a gun to your head and saying you must buy or use CS5. You say your clients have no reason to upgrade, so maybe you shouldn't either.

And lack of backsaving is neither limited to ID or a new issue. I'm not even sure that Publisher <shudder> is able to backsave more than one version, and Quark certainly can't -- and they won't let you keep the earlier versions installed anymore.

[Sreedh]

If you are working with InDesignCS5, and you want to send your layout for review, then CS5 has a new feature available, CSLIVE. Sending by this route your clients can review the layout online at Acrobat.com without needing to open any version of InDesign. Does it help in your client workflow?

[Cynthia_Ryan_Graphic]

No it doesn't. I can already send (and do) a PDF for client review. The problem is that my clients archive all of the ads I do for them in the application files and they also have in house staff resize and repurpose the designs that I do frequently, so the final files must be provided as CS3 files. It's obvious from all of the postings that the only solution I have is to continue to work in CS3 for these clients. Whether or not I will shell out the money to upgrade at this point is something I will have to decide separately from the CS3 question. It does put a real damper on the excitement I felt around the new release. Up until 21 months ago, when I purchased CS3, I had always worked for someone else and was provided software updates their schedule (and there were also no outside conditions upon which version of the software I used.) I really had no idea when I posted this that there was no backwards compatibility past one version. It's been a wake-up call.

[Mr. Met]

Cynthia: why don't you just do all your work in CS3 for that client? SW evolves. And the upgrades in PS and AI make it imperative that I upgrade. Smart fill is brilliant. And yes it's expensive to upgrade, especially in a bad economy. While back saving is a PITA, you have to figure out how work around it.

I have two workstations and I skipped CS4 on one of them. We work 50/50 in CS3 and CS4. I plan on only upgrading CS3 machine to CS5 in a month or two when the bugs get sorted out. I do a lot of work for other small agencies and freelance art directors. Quite a few of them didn't buy CS4. So I do all their work in 3 and hand the files off. For my own clients, I work in 4.

While I understand the frustration with backsaving, how do people think Adobe underwrites improvements to the suite? I'm guessing they expect to be paid for their efforts. It's the cost of doing business and yes it can be extremely difficult at times to afford it in a tight economy.

[BobLevine]

Cynthia, even one version is one version too many to be using in a collaborative workflow. So this whole argument is moot. You need to be working in the same version as your clients.

NEVER send a different version file to a client. What happens six months  from now when you get a new client with CS4? How do you work with them?  Will you tell this new client you think Adobe's policies are ridiculous  so you won't be able to work with them unless they jump through hoops  for you?

So allow me to again make a suggestion. Not only should you go to CS5 but you should upgrade to CS4 NOW. You can still get CS4 Design Premium upgrade from CS3 at Amazon for less  than $600 http://amzn.to/bGV8ID. Then check out this article: http://bit.ly/c9HLKf to see how you can get  a free upgrade to CS5.

Time's running out on that window of opportunity,

Bob