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InDesign

New Here ,
Sep 09, 2020

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I have an InDesign file from the 2018 and it is a label I want to print. I just check that a few elements on this label are saved in LAB color pallets. So when I try to change them to CMYK they not as bright as my client would like to have. When I convert a whole document to CMYK it looks also different. It is any option to save it to print and keep bright LAB colors? Thanks for the help in advanced.

 

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Piotr

Adobe Community Professional
Correct answer by rob day | Adobe Community Professional

The blue in your sample is well outside of the typical CMYK color gamut, so it isn’t possible to match that color with process inks.

 

The Color panel displays a yellow warning triangle next to the closest printable color when a color is not inside of the document’s assigned CMYK space.

 

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InDesign

New Here ,
Sep 09, 2020

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I have an InDesign file from the 2018 and it is a label I want to print. I just check that a few elements on this label are saved in LAB color pallets. So when I try to change them to CMYK they not as bright as my client would like to have. When I convert a whole document to CMYK it looks also different. It is any option to save it to print and keep bright LAB colors? Thanks for the help in advanced.

 

Regards

Piotr

Adobe Community Professional
Correct answer by rob day | Adobe Community Professional

The blue in your sample is well outside of the typical CMYK color gamut, so it isn’t possible to match that color with process inks.

 

The Color panel displays a yellow warning triangle next to the closest printable color when a color is not inside of the document’s assigned CMYK space.

 

Screen Shot 9.png

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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The blue in your sample is well outside of the typical CMYK color gamut, so it isn’t possible to match that color with process inks.

 

The Color panel displays a yellow warning triangle next to the closest printable color when a color is not inside of the document’s assigned CMYK space.

 

Screen Shot 9.png

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Sep 09, 2020 1
New Here ,
Sep 09, 2020

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Thanks for the answer, so it is impossible to have the same color in CMYK pallet? So the solution is to make this label with CMYK color, will not be the same but printable? Is that correct? 

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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Likely, yes.

 

But rather than be surprised by the end result, I'd suggest going to your local Staples/Office Depot/FedEx Office and run a color copy from a PDF created with your file.

 

I recommend that because it's generally the most indifferent color reproduction you're going to get from that file. Not only will most any printer do a better four-color job, but it'll inexpensively identify any problem areas/colors you may want to correct for small stakes off a $2-5 color copy rather than hundreds or thousands of dollars at the end of a large print run.

 

Good luck,

 

Randy

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Sep 09, 2020 0
New Here ,
Sep 09, 2020

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Thank you Randy,

 

The problem is that my client send to the printing company saved by my PDF without color changed, and he received feedback taht the colors are not the same and they need CMYK file. I am surprise and I try to explain to my client that we should change this blue to CMYK pallet. But don't you think that the printer should actually be able to print it in good colors? I have that problem first time.

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Sep 09, 2020

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The printer can print it with excellent colours, but the buckets of cyan, magenta, yellow and black ink that every printer uses cannot make bright colours like bright blue or green. This is a universal limitation, though the exact colours will depend on the kind of ink and paper used. If you want brighter colours, it is possible, using buckets of bright ink. These spot colours are not available in every workflow.

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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The only way you can print a color that is outside of the process CMYK gamut is by using a solid ink spot color on an offset press, but even with the Pantone solid ink system, the bright blue you are showing would be difficult to match.

 

Some composite Inkjet printers are capable of printing a wider gamut of colors, but I still don’t think you would get the full saturation of your Lab blue.

 

Also, most standard RGB monitors can’t display the full cyan/blue of a typical offset CMYK space, so the displayed blue is probably a bit more subdued than the color would print, but you would never get the full saturation of the color.

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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Not every color can be recreated out of the four inks used in CMYK printing. 

To help your client choose an acceptable CMYK color, it would be useful to buy Pantone CMYK color guides

 

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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"Good colors" is a very relative thing. That little yellow triangle with the exclamation point in it is not.

 

When you see that "Out of Gamut" alert, it's not lying to you. InDesign is telling you, in no uncertain terms, that color cannot be printed with the CMYK process. If you can wave a printed card with that color under your printer's nose and say "This can be printed, see?" that's one thing. When you're asking him to hit a color from your computer screen that's outside of the range of colors that possibly can be printed, it's quite another. You're asking him to sweat milk for you. As the kids say today, that's un-possible.

 

The only way I could give you better news here would be to lie to you. And I can't do that. Your printer isn't lying to you either. I'd believe him.

 

Good luck,

 

Randy

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Sep 09, 2020 0
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Sep 09, 2020

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The printer can only print blues that are in gamut. If they are a good printer, they have a good Colour Management workflow in place and should be able to get as close as they can get, but as Scotty would say, you can't change the laws of physics!

 

Your client will have to accept that they can't get what they want. Their best bet is to have the blue printed as a spot Pantone colour which may get you closer to what they desire, but that means you are paying for a 5-colour printing job. As far as getting brighter blues in CMYK, well, you can't. I suggest you invest in a Pantone swatch book that shows CMYK matches so your client can see what is and what is not possible.

 

Here's the deal. The conversion fron LAB to CMYK can be wildly different in practically every scenario, depending on the Color Management settings used along the way, as well as the actual printing process used by your printer, etc.  If it this was printed before from the same file, the CMYK mix that was previously printed WILL be different today if the profiles assigned to them then were different. It will be impossible to give your printer a new CMYK file with values that create that previous blue if you don't know what the values ended up being! It also depends on where the conversion happens. If you created a PDF that converts the colours at your end, then you've already baked in a CMYK mix for that blue based on the colour profiles you have in your OWN workflow. If the PDF was created where the colours are left as is, then the CMYK conversion will happen in your printer's workflow.

 

Going forward, you should always select colours that are in gamut of your intended printing process, or accept the fact that there will be differences. e.g. If you are working with Pantone colours (e.g. Spot Coated swatches, which are LAB), many of these are also out of gamut as they were always intended to be an actual ink used in printing (mixed using several base inks other than CMYK (there's about 15 of them) that create a wide vibrant set of colours).  Pantone has attempted many solutions over the years to help out the current digital workflows and the latest is a set of ink swatches called Color Bridge that are based in CMYK, so if you use those, you should be able to see and keep a consistent colour match.

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Sep 09, 2020 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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There’s really not a Pantone Solid spot color that matches either. Photoshop’s Color Picker will show the closest Pantone color to a chosen Lab color:

 

Screen Shot 13.png

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Sep 09, 2020 0
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Sep 09, 2020

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Indeed. I was just suggesting what he could offer the client to get a brighter blue in print.

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Sep 09, 2020 0
rob day LATEST
Adobe Community Professional ,
Sep 09, 2020

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I think it is worth noting that both CMYK and RGB have gamut limits. Usually gamut discussions are about RGB colors that can’t be printed, but on a typical sRGB monitor, there are also CMYK colors that can’t be displayed—mostly in the blue/cyan/green range. That makes color managing the saturated blue part of the spectrum very difficult—impossible on a standard RGB display. In the end if the client is fussy about color they need to see a printed contract proof.

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