Properties panel paragraph styles crashes InDesign

[Tiekerz]

Hi 🙂 We've been having this weird issue since somewhere last week while working on our newspapers. Some here use the properties panel to quickly select a paragraph style. Since last week, this will crash InDesign. Sometimes immediately, sometimes after a few tries, but it will always happen within minutes, when we hit the little arrow to pop out de drop down. What we tried: reset preferences, clear font cache, reinstal indesign, reinstall the entire CC app, reinstal macOS (11.2.3). Thinking it was something in the file we tried using newspaper files 3-6 months old, we cleared out all unused styles, no luck. However, when I start a new document and add some paragraph styles InDesign will keep working. If we use a Paragraph Style panel instead of Properties then it will keep working too. So obviously, our problem is minor, now we've pinpointed what's going wrong we can easily work around it. But some of us are big fans of the property panel and are hoping some of the wizards here know a solution.
 
We haven't tried to delete and redo all the paragraph styles, because we have a lot of very specific styles. As in, a lot a lot. Also, the error message seems to indicate another problem:
 
Application Specific Information:
Crashing on exception: The window has been marked as needing another Display Window pass, but it has already had more Display Window passes than there are views in the window. 
<DVAMacTreeBasedResultFlyoutWindow: 0x7faeebfd1ea0> 0x117 (279) {{129, 57}, {220, 907}}  nl
 
Any ideas? Thanks in advance!
 
 
 

[Laubender]

Hi Tiekerz,

well, that could be a bug in the Properties panel.

I very rarely use it, because I find the combination of the Control panel plus the Paragraph Styles panel free floating or docked more useful. I would report the issue at InDesign UserVoice and provide a sample document where you see the issue: https://indesign.uservoice.com/forums/601180-adobe-indesign-bugs

Hm, one thing you could try, if the issue is document specific:

Export the document to IDML, open the IDML file as document and save to a new name.

Regards,
Uwe Laubender

( ACP )

[Tiekerz]

Hi Uwe. Thanks for the tip, it didn't work but it was a good suggestion!

[Srishti Bali]

Hi there,

Sorry to hear about this trouble. Would you mind sharing a few more details like:

• Exact version of InDesign
• Has it started happening after the recent update?
• Share crash logs by following these steps: https://helpx.adobe.com/in/indesign/kb/submit-crash-reports.html 
  While submitting the crash, report please use the same email address, with which you are signed in on this community. This will help us find the crash report and help accordingly.

If you are using version 16.3 or 16.3.1, I would request you to update the app to latest version 16.3.2 and let us know how it goes

Regards,

Srishti

[Tiekerz]

Hi Shristi, I resubmitted it with my e-mail specifically and the file. Good luck 😉

Where can I find 16.3.2? (We're @16.3.1, I can't find a newer version)

[Randy Hagan]

Can I ask you a dirty question: Do you build a new InDesign file for each of your newspapers every issue?

Then I need to ask a really dirty question: If not, do you use the file from the last issue, throw out all the old stuff and re-do it to build your current one?

And finally, the really scary one: Does each issue consist of only one InDesign file?

I've done a lot of work with community newspapers — weeklies, semi-weeklies and a couple small dailies — and I've found that when erratic problems crop up, they often crop up in old files that get re-used time and time again. I strongly recommend that you try Uwe's tip to save the entire pub out as an IDML file, then open and save the .idml file as an InDesign document .indd file again.

Saving out as a InDesign Markup Language (IDML) file strips out a lot of extraneous information your .indd file uses to define the document, simplifying the file to contain a streamlined definition of the document and placement of the elements contained in it. Whenever I'm working with a busy publication production shop, I strongly recommend this save out/save back shortcut to cure a lot of little unexplained ills.

It's worth a shot. It's easy enough to do, and quick enough to check to see if this fixes the problem.

Good luck,

Randy

[Tiekerz]

Hey Randy,

Hmmm dirty questions! We do recycle our main file, but one issue can consist of many different InDesign files. Adverts, specials/sections,... Those get recycled too, if it's a recurring customer, or a recurring section. Also, multiple people will work on seperate parts of the paper, at some point that will get merged, almost always past deadline time and indeed that's  the time when you'll hear most cursing from people ready to strangle their mac. If there's one thing I've learned working here it's how to fluently curse in 3 languages. Our "master" has been in use for 3 years now. There are several versions of it, with specific monthly sections or advertisements already planned. But they're all based on the same Mother-of-All newspaper layout.

So yeah, I can definitely see what you mean and rebuilding it might well fix everything. The one thing stopping me is time. Stuff needs doing yesterday. Also, the IDML trick didn't work and going back to files 6 months old gives the same problem. But thanks for the tip, it will come in handy in the future!

[Randy Hagan]

After your reply, I'd bet you a nickel this comes to the root of many of your problems.

It sounds like you're a veteran of the production wars, with the appropriate gallows sense of humor. I especially got a chuckle as you discussed the finer points of deadline cussin' in trilingual terms. I understand your position well, and it sounds like you've got a sharp crew that's able to work past the problems. In this case, that's both a blessing and a risk.

Recycling the Mother of All InDesign document files is a shaky foundation for building your pubs. And easy to ignore if you've got a good crew used to working their way around the problems. But it is putting off the problem, and growing increasingly perilous. Because if that file breaks on one production artist's system, you can just about count on it messing up quickly — or worse yet, immediately — on the rest of your systems too. And it's going to happen on deadline, when you're pushing all your work the hardest.

You need a master template — actually a bunch of them — to avert this fate. And I understand how your busy shop is probably just one hour behind where you want to be all week long. So it's hard to find man-hours to fix problems when you're paid to produce pages and you're finding ways to keep on grinding even though there's sand in the gears.

You need to do a couple of small experiments to see how much working from fresh templates may improve your operations. I'd find a couple things I could produce off-deadline, something like classified ads, or obituaries. Build templates for those specific modules, have the artists building those sections produce new files for each new issue and evaluate how that's working through the production schedule. Here's where I'm putting up my nickel: if you do this for a couple of months, you'll find working off fresh files every issue will cure a ton of little ills your staff is spending time and effort to overcome every deadline. And it'll provide information to justify templates for the rest of your pubs.

If you can't find time to build the templates yourself, sub it out to a competent production designer. I'll go double or nothin' that you'll save whatever you spend within 60 days of implementing the new production system. The averting impending disaster part? That's just a bonus.

If you have any other questions, feel free to come back to this thread or message me through the forum.

Hope this helps,

Randy

[Tiekerz]

Thanks Randy, that was a very accurate and very fun description of, basically and sadly, our lives. It's inspiring to read your post and think of how things could be better. Getting things done is a matter of proper planning so I'm definitely gonna give it a shot during the summer. Thanks very much for your shared knowledge

[Randy Hagan]

Absolutely my pleasure.

Good luck. I'm rooting for you.

Randy