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Camera Raw/Lightroom Classic: Fuji X-Trans Support?

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Contributor ,
Jul 02, 2014 Jul 02, 2014

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Is Fuji X-Trans support being worked on?I appreciate that the support is better now than it was, but the reality is that Lightroom is still a long way behind other RAW developers, all of which are less well funded and with smaller teams working on the software.Lightroom has been the leader in RAW processing an image cataloging as far back as I can recall; but with the Fuji X-Trans files many people I know are leaving Adobe Lightroom for one of the many other developers, all of which are producing far better results than Adobe Lightroom.Ones I have personally tested are as follows: Iridient DeveloperPhoto NinjaLightZoneCapture OneApertureSilkyPixRaw TherapeeIridient is very good, and this is a piece of software made by a single man.My question is, if he can get it right, why can't Adobe? They have been leaders in innovation for many years but it seems in some areas now they are falling behind - I have never seen so many people leave a major developer for smaller independent ones, but to Fuji users (both enthusiasts and professionals) it's a pretty simple decision when you compare results.So all I'd like to know is if my patience sticking with Lightroom is justified, and whether a solution is being worked on - or will always be worked on. Or is it a case that the users wanting such a change are not enough to support such work.
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Adobe Employee , Feb 12, 2019 Feb 12, 2019
Hi Everyone, We are happy to announce the release of Lightroom Classic CC 8.2. With this release, we’ve introduced a new feature called Enhanced Details. Photographers using cameras featuring X-Trans sensors should see an improved rendering of their Fuji raw files. To learn more about how this new feature works check out the blog post:  https://theblog.adobe.com/enhance-details/ Cheers, Carissa

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Participant ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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fujirumors.com within the past year published a comparison of several photo editors for X-trans files. The conclusion was that the differences were all up to personal preferences. None of them were clearly superior. 

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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Yeah, honestly I have been thinking this too. I think Fuji is really messing up by insisting on using X-Trans sensors.

But if I say that in a forum like r/fujix or r/fujifilm people get so defensive. Some blame me for pixel peeping (I sell prints, so pixel peeping is important IMO) and some say they don’t see the issues. 

I am willing to bet most people who say they don’t see the issues have never tried a Fujifilm camera with a normal sensor. And maybe not much experience with other cameras with normal sensors.

Also, I bet Fuji knows that X-Trans is not good. Why else would they not make X-Trans sensors for their medium format cameras.

Seriously, think about it. X-Trans is supposed to be amazing, it’s why they use them in their highest end X cameras. If they truly believed that, WHY wouldn’t they make medium format X-Trans sensors?

They know it’s not good. I just wish more Fuji users also knew.

Btw, I HAVE compared X-Trans to normal. I have an X-T2 and an X-T100. The 100 gives me MUCH nicer files. And they are smaller. Smh 

I hope people start contacting Fujifilm about this. Like, go to the website, go to where you can contact them and send an email to their headquarters. Tell them you wish they would stop using X-Trans. I hope people also start doing this on social media. I’ve tried. But I’m just one person, easy to ignore. 

(Sorry, that became a rant...)

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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That tells me that none of the RAW editors knows what to do with X-Trans files.

I have compared X-Trans to a normal sensor (as if I needed to compare to see the artifacts and washed out colors) and X-Trans DOES look worse than normal.

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Participant ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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Except for their instant cameras, Fuji imaging hasn't been profitable in the digital era. Now that digital cameras are only profitable at the professional level, which for Fuji means medium format, they have some tough decisions to make. 

 

I originally went from a Olympus OM-D E-M1 to a X-T1 and noticed that Oly images were cleaner and the gap widened as the ISO increased. 

 

So back to Oly until the X-T4 was announced without any IQ improvements (over the X-T3) so bought the X-T3. Made the decision after downloading a range of raw images that I processed in Lightroom. I was quite satisfied with the results I was able to achieve and they were superior to what I could get from my Olympus. 

 

I was still a little disappointed that DxO couldn't handle the images (as a Lightroom plug in) but have finally realized that Lightroom's implementation of U-Point is superior. Well, more accurately, I prefer it. 

 

My only concern with Lightroom Classic is how long it is going to continue to exist and be supported. Adobe has too many Lightroom products. We need a clear statement of direction with a timeline. Add  in multiple versions of full Photoshop and even Photoshop Elements; Adobe has a deep hole to dig themselves out of. 

  

Like Apple, Fuji doesn't listen to its customers so complaints are useless. Fortunately we have forums like this one where we can share useful Lightroom X-trans processing tips. 

 

BTW I plan to switch from Fuji to the Samsung S21 Ultra (or S22 depending when I can start shooting again). Because Samsung uses standard DNG as its raw format, we haven't had to wait for Lightroom to support the camera. (Well, other than the bug in either the files or Lightroom.) Voting with my wallet. 

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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You're switching from a dedicated camera to phone? Not saying that is wrong or anything, it just sounds odd to me. A camera has so many advantages.

Where did you hear about how profitable their cameras are? I never heard about that.

Also, if enough people complain, I think they WOULD listen. 

If Fuji ever makes a camera with a normal sensor AND 2 card slots, I would be SO happy! Anything from an X-T300 to an X-T5 would do.

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Participant ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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A dedicated camera is just a smartphone without computational processing or multiple lenses or connectivity... The S21 Ultra has 4 built-in prime lenses from 13 to 240mm.  

 

My son did some comparison low light shooting with his X-T3 and an iPhone 11, handheld the iPhone won hands down. It was no contest. 

 

The computers in a modern medium to high end smartphone are a decade ahead of anything provided in any camera at any price. 

 

While you're changing lenses, I'm taking pictures. 

  

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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I did not mean to challenge your choice. And its not a competition. If this is a switch that works for you then I'm happy that you get to take photos the way you want. 🙂

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Participant ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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My apologies, I did not take your comment as a challenge but rather as an observation. Will it work for me? Who knows until I try it. I've been unable to find any raw images to download and evaluate in Lightroom which is a requirement before I purchase. With the tiny sensor, I'm sure raw processing will be required for me for other than snapshots to share. I'm hoping that we'll see a raw sample library from DPreview before long. 

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2021 Feb 22, 2021

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Maybe there is a Samsung subreddit where you can ask politely if anyone are willing to share any raw files with you. 
Just an idea. 

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Contributor ,
Feb 23, 2021 Feb 23, 2021

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A dedicated camera is just a smartphone without computational processing or multiple lenses or connectivity

I'm sorry but that is the most stupid thing I have ever read.

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Explorer ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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@Adobe @LIghtroom @anyone?
Can anyone confirm if this ACTUALLY is being worked on? This thread is basically dead, but when you contact Adobe support on twitter about the X-Trans issue they send people to this thread. They do say that they are working on it, but its very hard to believe.

Its hard to believe because its been YEARS and its still not fixed. 

Its hard to believe because Adobe has so much money and resources, so it SHOULD have been fixed years ago. 

It's hard to believe because this thread is dead and no one from Adobe is responding.

But still, I will share some comparisons from a Fujifilm camera that has a normal sensor to one that has an X-Trans sensor. Just to show how photos should look. I'll include the RAW files too. Who knows, maybe they could be useful in some way.

The raw files:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1TaouEUmnoIOwshGcO9ZXgb8aTrHeP_7y/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1zye5uuCE3vfLnIgOumCTyoN-DBgz8l_D/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ux5G_TyRVPJ565F_oqX6eU6LwOTjXMbn/view?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/19cL3h7T_Vk5a26OgoQCuk4oIroemEPvi/view?usp=sharing

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New Here ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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I gave up this topic about 2 years ago and change to C1. But you could try the plugin of X-transformer for Ligthroom if you don't want to change the Adobe plataform.

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Explorer ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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Its very hard for me to switch away from LR because the way it lets me stitch raw files and edit them is so good. I do a lot of stitching.

I have tried the Iridient X-Transformer, and I did not like it. I did not really understand all the options and leaving them at the defaults did not give me very good results. 

I like the Enhance Detail feature much more. But the files you get from that are very big and it takes extra time. It takes more time if you then delete those files later.

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New Here ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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My workflow for stitching is:

1.- C1 for developing to ROMM TIFF 16-Bits

2.- Hugin for stitching.

3.-Back to C1 and/or Phoshop/Affinity for final retouch.

More steps but better results for detail developing from X-Trans sensors. 

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Explorer ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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Cool, thanks for the suggestion. 

Adobe REALLY should get it together though. This is ridicules. The thread says "in progress" and Adobe support on Twitter sends people here when they ask.

I get the feeling that Adobe is straight up lying. I dont believe them when they say they are working on it. How could I at this point=

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Community Beginner ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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I find X Transformer is good, and runs better on my machine than "enhance details".

Of course these sort of workarounds should not be needed.

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Engaged ,
Feb 25, 2021 Feb 25, 2021

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I agree. I am no pixel peeper but the worms are quite clear and make the overall picture look "mushy". I have stayed with lightroom though because of the many many hours learning it and try to put up with these artefacts. I do use irident x transformer but it's workaround and adds time when having to decide whether to use it etc. Enhance detail doesn't seem to make much difference to me and is also a pain as described. Enhance detail feels like an acceptance of the problem but an attempt to sort it out after the problem has occured. So surely the solution would be to have lightroom recognise its a fuji file (or you tell it) on import and process it correctly then.  In conclusion, lightroom is a fantastic program but occasionally i do think about leaving lightroom. 

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Explorer ,
Feb 26, 2021 Feb 26, 2021

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Yeah I agree, LR should just recognize and prosess x-trans files correctly from the start without using enhance detail.

The reason I like enhance detail more than the transformer is that (from my limited "testing") it brings back color definition in small details. The transformer did not do that.

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New Here ,
Feb 26, 2021 Feb 26, 2021

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Ohh, try messing around with the option of color noise reduction in X-transformer. I would leave it as low or not at all.

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Explorer ,
Mar 04, 2021 Mar 04, 2021

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In progress (profanity deleted) 6 years not enough for Adobe? I think they keep this thread here just to pacify us so that we don't keep asking about it. Adobe treats us like dirt because they have more than enough users. The few of us who are bothered by this and leaves won't make a dent in their income. They are ignoring us cause its easy. 

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Participant ,
Mar 04, 2021 Mar 04, 2021

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There have been significant improvements over the years. The only difference between Lightroom/AdobeRAW and others comes down to personal preference. So either build yourself a profile on switch to some other tool. X-Trans (like Foveon) should have never left the research lab, interesting but useless concepts. 

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Contributor ,
Mar 05, 2021 Mar 05, 2021

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@Eirik Honestly Fuji are just as culpable. Adobe are not up to scratch to other RAW editors, they are 100% at fault for that, but Fuji are the ones who used a dodgy new sensor for no good reason. I wish they stuck to bayer...

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Explorer ,
Mar 05, 2021 Mar 05, 2021

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@jimkit

I totally agree! I've been complaining about the X-Trans sensor for a while now. A little further up on this page I have examples of how a normal sensor compares to X-Trans. I intended that to show how Lightroom is failing, but it also shows how Fujifilm is failing.

Edit: I dont know how to tag someone. I thought @ + name was enough...


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