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Lightroom Classic: Save Metadata To File doesn't change metadata status, Read Metadata From File doesn't always work

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 17, 2020 Dec 17, 2020

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Ever since upgrading to the latest version I've had Metadata conflicts - little exclamation mark in Grid view. I even deleted my catalog of more than 200k images and started again to no avail.  I also synched all of my folders and no difference.

When I click on the exclamation mark I get the message that says that metadata has been changed by another program and Lightroom, even when I have only used Lightroom. When I click to upate the metadata the exclamtion dissapears but comes back very quickly. I made a Quick Collection of all metadata conflict shots - over 6000 - and syched them. The number dropped by a third but then came back to the original total within minutes.

I have lost all of the displayed colored flags in Grid View but can still select various colors in the Metadata panel at the top and get the appropriate shots. When clicking on an individial cell in Grid View I get a thin colored line around the shot which then dissapears when I click on another shot. I get the correct color but no flag.

I have auto save xmp on. I'm also at my wits end. anyone have any ideas? Thanks

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76 Comments
Engaged ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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When the development of a photo consists solely of a horizontal adjustment the change can not be written to the metadata of a JPG.  The metadata status remains "has been changed". I guess that behaviour is not as it is supposed to be?

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Participant ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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Seems to be working fine here in LrC 10.0/Win10.

- What version of LrC & OS are you using?

- Can you be more specific with what you mean by "consists solely of a horizontal adjustment"?  What are the exact steps you're taking?

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Engaged ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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Thank you for your immediate reply.

Yes, I am using the same versions (LRC 10 and Win10). 

The steps have been: import, develop, change angle, crop, and after some tries, say done. I came upon two photos in my catalogue with this problem.

Now, I repeated the process with another picture and everything worked fine. There is a difference, though: The problematic photos show only the cropped sign in the lower right corner. The newer one also has the marker for the development adjustments. Maybe that's the reason behind this?

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Participant ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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What happens if you select the file(s) and press Ctrl+S (keyboard shortcut to save metadata to the file)?

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Engaged ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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It seems that nothing happens, i. e. after the confirmation that the metadata really should be saved, the confirmation window closes and the down arrow showing that the meta data has changed, is remaining.

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Engaged ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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Apparently the problem occurs, if the angle is provided manually. In this case there is only information about the cropping and the saving fails.

When using "Auto" instead, there are both symbols, "Photo has been cropped" and "Photo has Develop adjustments" and the saving just works  fine.

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Participant ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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I can't replicate exactly what you're describing, but I am beginning to think you've tripped over something here.

In my case, there's no indication of a problem, but LrC does not appear to be writing the cropping info to the file consistently when that's the only change that's been made.

With "Include Develop settings in metadata inside JPEG, TIFF, PNG, and PSD files" and "Automatically write changes to XMP" checked, my steps to reproduce were - 

  1. Import file.
  2. Press R to access the crop tool and change only the horizontal and/or vertical crop.
  3. Go back to Library and remove the image from LrC.
  4. Re-import the image to LrC.
  5. Image comes back without the cropping changes applied in step 2.

Variations -

  • It appears if I make any other change along with the crop in step 2 - change the angle, up the color temp by 1, etc. - when the image is re-imported in step 5, the cropping changes are there.
  • If I explicitly save the metadata using the menu or Ctrl+S in between step 2 and 3, when the image is re-imported in step 5, the cropping changes are there.
  • Behavior is similar with files already in LrC that have a crop applied to them.  If I reset the crop without changing anything else, remove the image from LrC, and re-import, it comes in with the original crop applied

I tested with a number of jpg & png files.

A new catalog made no difference.

Resetting preferences made no difference.

We'll have to wait and see if anybody else chimes in here, but something appears to be misbehaving.

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Engaged ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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Thank you for your thorough testing and detailed reply. So, for the time being it might be best to work around it...

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Participant ,
Oct 30, 2020 Oct 30, 2020

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*Irma_VG7 , @TomM I have been trying this and have found a problem, but before I go further with it, can you tell me what Import Build Previews setting you are using?

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Engaged ,
Oct 31, 2020 Oct 31, 2020

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LRVersion-68facc75-ada8-463f-acaa-aac76c5f7a3c-768106867.PNG

Does this help? Or, if you need something else, where can I find the information?

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Participant ,
Oct 31, 2020 Oct 31, 2020

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No, not the software build. When you Import into Lightroom Classic, the Import Dialog  has an option in the upper left called Build Previews with choices of Minimal, Embedded & Sidecar, Standard and 1:1.

Which option are you using for Build Previews?

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LEGEND ,
Oct 31, 2020 Oct 31, 2020

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[Update: Another symptom is that converting a raw with a non-zero crop angle to DNG loses the crop angle:

https://feedback.photoshop.com/conversations/lightroom-classic/lightroom-classic-save-metadata-to-fi... 

- JRE]

[Update: LR 10.2 fixes the problem with black & white but not with crop angle. -JRE]

After changing a raw to black & white or changing its crop angle, the Save Metadata To File command writes a .xmp sidecar but the photo's Metadata Status remains Has Been Changed.  Only after doing Metadata > Read Metadata From File does the status change to Up To Date.  In addition, Read Metadata From File doesn't correctly read in a changed crop angle that exists in the sidecar.

 

To reproduce:

 

1. Make a new catalog and import one raw that currently doesn't have a .xmp sidecar.

 

2. Edit the raw in Develop and click Treatment: Black & White.

 

3. In grid view observe that Metadata Status is Has Been Changed and the badge on the thumbnail is the down-arrow.

 

4. Do Metadata > Save Metadata To File and observe that Metadata Status hasn't changed.

 

5. Open the .xmp sidecar in a text editor and observe that it records the black & white setting.

 

6. Do Metadata > Read Metadata From File and observe that the photo remains black & white but Metadata Status is now Up To Date.

 

7. Remove the photo from the catalog and delete its .xmp sidecar.

 

8. Import the photo again into the catalog.

 

9. Edit the photo and in the Crop tool type in an angle of 25.

 

10.  In grid view observe that Metadata Status is Has Been Changed and the badge on the thumbnail is the down-arrow.

 

11. Do Metadata > Save Metadata To File and observe that Metadata Status hasn't changed.

 

12. Open the .xmp sidecar in a text editor and observe that it records the crop angle of 25.

 

13. Do Metadata > Read Metadata From File and observe that the crop angle has been lost, but the Metadata Status is now Up To Date.

 

Screen recording: https://www.dropbox.com/s/fi0scv3vauqj5hu/metadata-save-read-bug.2020.10.31.mov?dl=0 

 

Someone else reported that metadata status wasn't updating after saving:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic/metadata-badge-is-not-updated-after-the-metadata-is... 

 

Tested on LR 10.0 / Mac OS 10.15.5.

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LEGEND ,
Oct 31, 2020 Oct 31, 2020

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I encountered similar symptoms -- I'll merge the two conversations.

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Participant ,
Oct 31, 2020 Oct 31, 2020

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@John_R_Ellis, Confirming all of this on my Windows 10 system.

In addition, upon executing step 13, I note that in Develop a Reset Settings has been added to the History, which is obviously wrong.

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Adobe Employee ,
Nov 01, 2020 Nov 01, 2020

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Thanks for reporting this.

We have been able to reproduce this and logged a bug for the same.

Thanks,
Smit K
Lightroom Classic team

Smit
Lightroom Classic team

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Engaged ,
Nov 02, 2020 Nov 02, 2020

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@anthony_blackett Thank you. It's the Standard Build Previews.

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Participant ,
Nov 02, 2020 Nov 02, 2020

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*Irma_VG7 Thanks, I have another problem that is related to Embedded & Sidecar previews which I will report separately.

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Contributor ,
Nov 27, 2020 Nov 27, 2020

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Here's another case in point.....

Lightroom Version 10.0

Operating System Windows 10


In some (not all) cases where I have a DNG file where LrC shows the down-arrow icon indicating that the metadata in LrC has changed and the change has not been copied to the file, when I click the icon (or use the menu to save metadata to file). The date/time shown in Windows/10 file manager is not updated and the icon in LrC does not clear. (LR.10.0)

1) Note "metadata in Lrc Has changed" icon

Image is not available



2) click icon circled above. Click "Save" in ensuing pop up box

Image is not available



3) Saving Metadata progress bar appears for a few seconds then goes away. However, the icon on the image remains and the date/time on the file in File manager does not update

Image is not available



The DNG metadata on some images is empty (just says unknown) , but on others with same problem it is filled in. Here is an example of one that is filled in

Image is not available


But, the metadata date in LrC gets updated

Image is not available


I've disabled all plugin's which didn't help?
Addendum:  After saving Metadata to disk as described above, If I read metadata from disk the tag gets reset (and the image is removed from my smart collection which is based on metadata status)

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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This is an old problem that continues to plague me in Lightroom. I'm currently running Build [202008061458-dbb2971e] under Windows 10, but the same issue occurred in earlier versions and under Windows 7. There have been other threads about the issue going back at least to 2011.

 

Routinely, for some (but not all) images, the "Metadata file needs to be updated" icon does not disappear after writing the metadata to the XMP sidecar file by either pressing Ctrl-S or clicking on the icon. I can confirm that the XMP file was updated by checking the timestamp in Windows file explorer.

 

Screenshot20201209093217-6be1a7f6-a17a-4042-ac58-7d2250d021bb-1236823563.png
Screenshot20201209093352-558763d9-8be7-4a93-a73c-55ca1b7669ea-239420883.png

In these two screenshots you can see that image 0504952.cr2, the selected one, shows the metadata needs to be updated icon, while the file exlorer snippet shows the timestamp of the XMP file to be current today (12/9/2020).

 

It appears the metadata is being updated, but the icon is not. I can examine the contents of the plain-text XMP file in Notepad++ and see that the item I'd updated in Lightroom metadata has indeed been written to the file.

 

It doesn't seem to matter whether I select one image to write out the metadata or several hundred. Sometimes the icon gets updated (going away) and sometimes it doesn't.

Closing, then re-launching LR still shows that the metadata needs to be written to the file.

In my workflow, I'll make changes to one or many image in Lightroom and then manually use Ctrl-S to write out the metadata changes (rather than have LR do it automatically with every edit).

In case it helps someone at Adobe figure this out, here's my System Info report:

 

Lightroom Classic version: 9.4 [ 202008061458-dbb2971e ]
License: Creative Cloud
Language setting: en
Operating system: Windows 10 - Business Edition
Version: 10.0.18363
Application architecture: x64
System architecture: x64
Logical processor count: 4
Processor speed: 3.3 GHz
SqLite Version: 3.30.1
Built-in memory: 24551.0 MB
Real memory available to Lightroom: 24551.0 MB
Real memory used by Lightroom: 2582.5 MB (10.5%)
Virtual memory used by Lightroom: 2561.8 MB
GDI objects count: 762
USER objects count: 2636
Process handles count: 1916
Memory cache size: 205.0MB
Internal Camera Raw version: 12.4 [ 555 ]
Maximum thread count used by Camera Raw: 3
Camera Raw SIMD optimization: SSE2,AVX
Camera Raw virtual memory: 207MB / 12275MB (1%)
Camera Raw real memory: 208MB / 24551MB (0%)
System DPI setting: 96 DPI
Desktop composition enabled: Yes
Displays: 1) 1920x1200
Input types: Multitouch: No, Integrated touch: No, Integrated pen: Yes, External touch: No, External pen: Yes, Keyboard: No

Graphics Processor Info: 
DirectX: NVIDIA GeForce GT 630 (23.21.13.8813)

 

Application folder: C:\Program Files\Adobe\Adobe Lightroom Classic
Library Path: I:\Turner_LR5_Catalog\Turner_LR5_Catalog-3-2.lrcat
Settings Folder: C:\Users\Mark\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\Lightroom

Installed Plugins: 
1) AdobeStock
2) Animoto
3) Any Filter
4) Aurora HDR
5) ColorChecker Passport
6) Export to Photomatix Pro
7) Facebook
8) Flickr
9) HDR Efex Pro 2
10) jb Search Replace Transfer
11) jf Collection Publisher
12) LR/Enfuse
13) LR/Instagram
14) LR/Mogrify 2
15) LR/Transporter
16) Luminar 4
17) Magic Export
18) MyKeyworder for Lr
19) Nikon Tether Plugin
20) Perfectly Clear Complete v3
21) ProSelect Album Builder

Config.lua flags: None

Adapter #1: Vendor : 10de
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 Subsystem : 35441458
 Revision : a1
 Video Memory : 2000
Adapter #2: Vendor : 1414
 Device : 8c
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 Revision : 0
 Video Memory : 0
AudioDeviceIOBlockSize: 1024
AudioDeviceName: Speakers (Realtek High Definition Audio)
AudioDeviceNumberOfChannels: 2
AudioDeviceSampleRate: 48000
Build: LR5x42
Direct2DEnabled: false
GL_ACCUM_ALPHA_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_BLUE_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_GREEN_BITS: 16
GL_ACCUM_RED_BITS: 16
GL_ALPHA_BITS: 0
GL_BLUE_BITS: 8
GL_DEPTH_BITS: 24
GL_GREEN_BITS: 8
GL_MAX_3D_TEXTURE_SIZE: 2048
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE: 16384
GL_MAX_TEXTURE_UNITS: 4
GL_MAX_VIEWPORT_DIMS: 16384,16384
GL_RED_BITS: 8
GL_RENDERER: GeForce GT 630/PCIe/SSE2
GL_SHADING_LANGUAGE_VERSION: 4.60 NVIDIA
GL_STENCIL_BITS: 8
GL_VENDOR: NVIDIA Corporation
GL_VERSION: 4.6.0 NVIDIA 388.13
GPUDeviceEnabled: false
OGLEnabled: true
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GL_ARB_fragment_program GL_ARB_fragment_program_shadow GL_ARB_fragment_shader GL_ARB_framebuffer_no_attachments GL_ARB_framebuffer_object GL_ARB_framebuffer_sRGB GL_ARB_geometry_shader4 GL_ARB_get_program_binary GL_ARB_get_texture_sub_image GL_ARB_gl_spirv GL_ARB_gpu_shader5 GL_ARB_gpu_shader_fp64 GL_ARB_gpu_shader_int64 GL_ARB_half_float_pixel GL_ARB_half_float_vertex GL_ARB_imaging GL_ARB_indirect_parameters GL_ARB_instanced_arrays GL_ARB_internalformat_query GL_ARB_internalformat_query2 GL_ARB_invalidate_subdata GL_ARB_map_buffer_alignment GL_ARB_map_buffer_range GL_ARB_multi_bind GL_ARB_multi_draw_indirect GL_ARB_multisample GL_ARB_multitexture GL_ARB_occlusion_query GL_ARB_occlusion_query2 GL_ARB_parallel_shader_compile GL_ARB_pipeline_statistics_query GL_ARB_pixel_buffer_object GL_ARB_point_parameters GL_ARB_point_sprite GL_ARB_polygon_offset_clamp GL_ARB_program_interface_query GL_ARB_provoking_vertex GL_ARB_query_buffer_object GL_ARB_robust_buffer_access_behavior 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GL_NV_half_float GL_NV_light_max_exponent GL_NV_multisample_coverage GL_NV_multisample_filter_hint GL_NV_occlusion_query GL_NV_packed_depth_stencil GL_NV_parameter_buffer_object GL_NV_parameter_buffer_object2 GL_NV_path_rendering GL_NV_pixel_data_range GL_NV_point_sprite GL_NV_primitive_restart GL_NV_query_resource GL_NV_query_resource_tag GL_NV_register_combiners GL_NV_register_combiners2 GL_NV_shader_atomic_counters GL_NV_shader_atomic_float GL_NV_shader_buffer_load GL_NV_shader_storage_buffer_object GL_NV_texgen_reflection GL_NV_texture_barrier GL_NV_texture_compression_vtc GL_NV_texture_env_combine4 GL_NV_texture_multisample GL_NV_texture_rectangle GL_NV_texture_rectangle_compressed GL_NV_texture_shader GL_NV_texture_shader2 GL_NV_texture_shader3 GL_NV_transform_feedback GL_NV_transform_feedback2 GL_NV_uniform_buffer_unified_memory GL_NV_vertex_array_range GL_NV_vertex_array_range2 GL_NV_vertex_attrib_integer_64bit GL_NV_vertex_buffer_unified_memory GL_NV_vertex_program GL_NV_vertex_program1_1 GL_NV_vertex_program2 GL_NV_vertex_program2_option GL_NV_vertex_program3 GL_NVX_conditional_render GL_NVX_gpu_memory_info GL_NVX_multigpu_info GL_NV_shader_thread_group GL_KHR_blend_equation_advanced GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap GL_SGIS_texture_lod GL_SGIX_depth_texture GL_SGIX_shadow GL_SUN_slice_accum GL_WIN_swap_hint WGL_EXT_swap_control 

 

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Contributor ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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I have this problem as well but not limited to files with XMP side cars.  also happens to files with embedded XMP data such as JPG's

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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Also happens with PSD files.

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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This problem can appear if the file are on a NAS. in fact there is small difference between the time recorded in LR and the time on the NAS because of read/write buffers. This was existing with Synology and there was a post explaining how to solve it but I don't remember were it was. You should check not h/m but seconds in the property of the file and compare to the second recorded in LR

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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That's not my issue. All my photo files are on internal hard drives inside my Windows box. I use a NAS for backup, but that's not what LR is looking at.

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Engaged ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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I'm having the same problem! The progress bar appears, but the 'needs to be updated' icon reappears. This is with a <ctrl><s> or clicking on that icon.

This is a long shot, but I noticed this the same time as I ran across that lovely problem with the new camera raw and 3rd party LUTs when opening a LRC developed file in PS.

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Contributor ,
Dec 09, 2020 Dec 09, 2020

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Mine are on a WD external hard drive (not a NAS)

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