Can't move radial filter together with its brushed mask

[eye=art]

I'm using LR Classic 10.4 on a Mac OSX 10.14.6 and can't upgrade right now so please don't tell me that's the answer.

I've never encountered this problem before.

When I create an adjustment with the Radial filter and use the brush to mask some of it out, I cannot move that filter (the round circle) together with the brushed mask to a new location.

What happens is the filter (the round circle) moves but the brushed mask stays put and doesn't move with it. It's very bizarre but also very frustrating. I'm creating this mask to darken an area behind a subject. I'm masking out his face. When he moves his head in subsequent images, I need to be able to move or nudge the radial filter with the brushed mask accordingly. But the brushed out part of the mask stays glued or stuck to wherever it first was, no matter where I move the filter to. The 2 -- filter and mask -- separate!!!

I have no idea why this is happening all of a sudden. Is there something i'm not thinking of?

I can't update to the newest version of LR Classic right now because that will require an update of my Mojave OSX, and I can't stop the work I'm doing to do this major overhaul.

I hope there's a quick and easy fix for this, as this was a long shoot and I do not cherish the thought of having to create a new radial mask for each image. I've never had a problem moving a masked radial filter before.

Thanks in advance for your input.

[Rob_Cullen]

I don't know this is an answer, but-  Which Brush did you use to modify the Radial Gradient?

a) The Brush available at the top of the Radial adjustments panel

b) The Brush available from the regular Brush Tool icon.

[eye=art]

I used the brush available in the Radial panel.

If I'd used the regular brush, I'd have another pin for that brush. There is no other pin.

The brush is embedded in the radial adjustment. But the whole thing doesn't move together. The brush part doesn't move at all.

I can't figure it out. Don't know if it's a bug. Very disappointing. Especially after spending a lot of time getting that brushed mask just right.

Thanks for pursuing this.

[Bob Somrak]

I don't have LrC10 installed but I don't think the brush modifier in the Radial ever did move with the Radial.  I  am sure it is by design but even if it is a bug it will not be fixed in LrC10.  This all works very nicely in the recently released LrC11.2 where Adobe has added multi component move in a mask.  

[eye=art]

Well, that makes no sense at all. If one's building a mask, one wants to move the whole mask. It's a ridiculous flaw!

In any case, I had no idea and am shocked to discover this. Maybe this is the first time I'm trying this. I usually use the brush adjustment and that has no trouble being moved, even with erased parts. Oh well....

Thanks so much for letting me know. Still disappointed but at least I can stop hitting my head against a wall.

Hopefully, I'll be able to upgrade to the new LR Classic soon.

[Bob Somrak]

There are situations where you don't want to move the modifier brush with a Radial/Linear.  An example is a Linear in the sky with a mountain sticking up into the linear. You brush the mountain out and then want to move the linear.  In this case you definately do not want the modifier brush to move.  In other examples like yours you do want it to move.  This is all fixed finally in 11.2 to make both situations availabe.  Update as soon as you can and after the initial learning curve of the new masks (I personally found it fairly easy and quick) you will probably be very happy.  

[richardplondon]

Just to check - you may be moving the Radial ellipse/circle itself around - but, is it possible to instead move the related 'pin'? It may be necessary to change the visibility settings for that, in the Toolbar.

Another suggestion: make your round area for darkening the background with the Brush set to a large radius, rather than using the Radial tool. Then erase the person's head out of this same Brush adjustment. Now the two are guaranteed to move together since they are one thing. You'll lose easy and independent editability of the size and shape of the circle / ellipse this way.

[eye=art]

Nah, I'm moving the pin and the mask stays put. As I replied to someone else, it's a huge flaw in the radial filter. I can't believe no one has flagged this before and had Adobe change it. I gather this has been addressed in the new version? Fully?

[richardplondon]

Yes, full control now. Much richer functionality. E.g. a radial plus brushed additions or subtractions plus whatever else can be combined as sub-layers of a single adjustment, then each one can be independently moved, reversed, switched in its effect, hidden, deleted, renamed.

What you cannot do AFAICT is to "link" these sub-layers for position, in the same way that you could do in e.g. PS. Thus you cannot move an entire complex mask around in one go. Only move, or not move, each component as desired. Typically this independence is what is wanted: for example if you have painted out some trees from a radial local adjustment affecting part of the sky, you may decide to move to adjust a different part of the sky instead, but since the trees have not moved meanwhile, their painting-out ought in that case to stay still by default.

I think this may have been the thinking behind the functionality you describe. It's admittedly inconvenient for your particular use case, but mostly convenient for more typical use cases.

That doesn't really excuse the brushed additions to the radial not being movable at all, of course. I agree it seems a little surprising though I'd never considereed it - I had presumed this would be so picture specific in practice, as not to need to be moved ever.

I am sure Adobe would resist putting effort into changing the functionality of superseded versions, only addressing egregious bugs and security issues - and even that, only for a certain period of support. But if they take the position of "works as designed" there is little chance of change without much persistent user pressure.

[Bob Somrak]

@richardplondon 

You CAN move all the component at the same time in LrC11.2

[Bob Somrak]

Adobe is not going to any work on superceded versions, bugs or otherwise, which is the correct decision.  

[richardplondon]

Thanks for the info, I didn't know since I am still on 11.1 for now. Didn't mean to confuse anyone!

[Bob Somrak]

@richardplondon 

Works great,  Just select the Mask, not a component, and drag one of the pins and they all move.  Well worth the time to update!!

[eye=art]

Good to know, and thanks so much for your thorough response. It's clear I have to upgrade and will do so as soon as I'm done with my deadlines. 
Btw, the moves I wanted to make with the radial filter are minimal, rather like nudges, in accordance with the subject's slight head movements while standing in the same place. Would be such a time-saver, if it worked. 
Thanks! 

[GoldingD]

Perhaps a viseo of your problem would help.

[eye=art]

I would, if there a solution. But it's been made clear that this is the way it works in this older version, and that it's been fixed in the new one, So I'm not going to let it go and endeavor to update my system as soon as I can. 
Thanks!

[richardplondon]

When you upgrade to the new version your Catalog will be updated, and as part of that the current local adjustments on each picture will convert to the new method - but still showing the identical result.

Hence a Radial grad which has some brushed exceptions and/or additions, will convert into a new Mask grouping which contains the same Radial plus brush layer(s) overlaid, set to Add or Subtract mode appropriately. And each of those will thus become separately controllable, with no work needed on your part (except, to learn how the new interface works, which is IMO easy).