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P: Photo moves to Modified Photos to Re-Publish for no reason

Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2022 Jan 18, 2022

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Hope I am posting this is the correct place....

This BUG (marking images a needing to be "re-published") is driving me nuts and really making LRC loose some of it value to me.   For a long while I have experienced this "bug" not really realizing the severity of it (more LRC editedphotos now than before).   Everytime I open LRC (ver 11.1 now) I find more and more photos needing to be "re-published".  

I can understand and accept a bug is s/w as long as it is fixed, but looking at all the postings this bug goes way back to to 2016 or ealier (think I read on posting from 2015) with LRC ver. 2015.6 - we are now on LRC ver 11.1 and 5-6 years later with no fix.  NOT fixing something like this after so long really does not have an excuse.   What is worse, one does not even know if images are being affected in other ways when being constantly marked for replublising.

I can have folders not show images needing to be republished and then turn around the next day/hour/week, etc. and then they will show up as needing to be replushing.   What is even worse I can have 1 or several images needing to be replushed and then "republish" them and get and according affect of images needing to be republished while updating.  It can just from a few images to a large number and back down and back up before completing.

I can mark the image as "Mark as up-to-date" and then will change their status - for this time period.  Open up LRC again, and the same (or some of the same) images are flagged as "Modified Photos to Re-Publish" again.

Needless to say, this is getting very, very tiring and wasting a lot of timeon managing one LRC catalogue.  MORE IMPORTANTLY - it is making one loose faith in LRC and almost looking for alternatives to managing/editing my photo catalogues - as much as I like the Adobe Photography package plan.

PLEASE, PLEASE FIX THIS ONCE AND FOR ALL .....

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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I will add my concern about this bug, as it has happened to me.

 

The last time it happened was when the catalog was upgraded from the Lightroom Classic version 10 catalog to the Lightroom Classic version 11 catalog. Suddenly, virtually every publish service I had showed all photos "Modified Photos to Re-Publish" when in fact none of the photos had been modified in any way (edits or metadata), the photos in some of these publish services had not been touched for years.

 

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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Assuming the system is actually making some sort of random change to the file which sets the flag, is there any way to lock the photos in a collection so that they can't be changed without unlocking?

Regards,

Dana

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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"Assuming the system is actually making some sort of random change to the file which sets the flag, is there any way to lock the photos in a collection so that they can't be changed without unlocking?"

 

My understanding of the problem based on years of experience with LR, writing plugins, and dealing with this class of bugs: LR has a background task that checks for photos in published collections that might have changed since they were last published. The task has a comparison function that compares the current develop settings with the settings at the time the photo was published (it probably compares hashes).  The comparison function gets confused by new releases of LR that add new develop settings (e.g. Guided Upright Transform in 2015.6, masking in 11.0). 

 

This process appears "random" for two reasons:

 

- We don't know the heuristics the background task uses for scheduling its checks.

- Photos get updated incrementally to the new internal representations of develop settings as they are re-rendered, e.g. to build previews for Library (e.g. 100% zooming) or for exporting or sometimes just for scrolling through Grid view thumbnails, if the preview cache has lost their previews for some reason.

 

With the 2015.6 instance, you could permanently clear the "edited" flag by doing Save Metadata To File, Read Metadata From File, Mark As Up-To-Date.  But in 11.1, that only temporarily clears the edited flag. Apparently, the background process eventually gets around to rechecking the photo again and still thinks the develop settings have changed.

 

I wrote a plugin script that invoked publishedPhoto:setEditedFlag (false), on the hypothesis that perhaps there was a problem at the user-interface level with the Mark As Up-To-Date command.  But that script had the same problem -- the photos would get moved to Published and then sometime after get moved back to Modified.

 

So as of now, the only known way to permanently mark these photos as Published is to actually publish them.  (That's what I've been doing with about 7K photos about once a year, having given up after LR 2015.6 on getting Adobe to fix the bug.)

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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"So as of now, the only known way to permanently mark these photos as Published is to actually publish them. (That's what I've been doing with about 7K photos about once a year, having given up after LR 2015.6 on getting Adobe to fix the bug.)"

Am I missing something? Publishing them to my hard drive has no effect on the issue; it simply flags them again as needing to be republished.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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"Publishing them to my hard drive has no effect on the issue; it simply flags them again as needing to be republished."

 

That's a good detail to know. I publish to Flickr (Adobe plugin) and Zenfolio (Friedl plugin), and republishing is working for me at clearing the modified flag.

 

Though the different publish services can determine which metadata changes trigger "modified", a couple of us determined that in 2016, at least then, changes to develop settings always triggered "modified", regardless of the plugin.

 

But it sounds like there may be a relevant difference here between the hard-drive service and the Flickr and Zenfolio services.

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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Just to be very clear, all I need to do is open LR in the library module and click on a published folder and the mayhem ensues, even when I'm not in LR.

Regards,

Dana

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Community Expert ,
Jan 20, 2022 Jan 20, 2022

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Is it possible that the flow of info e.g comments by viewers does not happen automatically? Hence the necessity to republish so it can be viewed in LrC?

 

Regards, Denis: iMac mid-2015, 5K 27”, GPU 2GB, Ram 24GB, HDD 3TB, macOS 11.7.1 BigSur,; LrC 12.0.1, Lr 6.0, Ps 24.0, ACR 15.0,; Camera OM-D E-M1

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LEGEND ,
Jan 21, 2022 Jan 21, 2022

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Here's a recipe for reproducing some of the symptoms -- upgrading a LR 10.4 catalog to LR 11.1 causes published photos with the old masking applied to be incorrectly marked as Modified. But this recipe doesn't reproduce other symptoms multiple people (including me) have observed:

 

- Published photos without the old masking applied get marked as Modified.

 

- Doing Mark As Up-To-Date only works temporarily -- marked photos move back to Modified, sometimes immediately, sometimes within a day.

 

If Adobe wants to debug these two symptoms, they'll need a copy of my catalog.

 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1. In LR 10.4, make a new catalog, with Catalog Settings > Standard Preview Size = 1024.

 

2. Import two raws.

 

3. Add a Graduated Filter to one raw and an Adjustment Brush to the other.

 

4. Set up the Hard Drive publishing service to publish to a local folder, with Image Sizing set to Resize To Fit: Long Edge = 1000.

 

5. Drag the two raws to the publish service destination.

 

6. Select the publish service and do Publish.

 

7. Exit LR 10.4.

 

8. Start LR 11.1 and open the catalog created in step 1, upgrading it.

 

9. Select the two photos and do Library > Previews > Build 1:1 Previews.

 

10. Observe that the two photos now incorrectly appear in Modified Photos To Re-Publish.

 

11. Right-click the two photos and do Mark As Up-To-Date.  Observe that they don't move back again to Modified Photos.

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 22, 2022 Jan 22, 2022

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Funny as I don't have a recipe other than starting up LR. Without even going into published collections, they change.

Regards,

Dana

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LEGEND ,
Jan 22, 2022 Jan 22, 2022

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"Funny as I don't have a recipe other than starting up LR. Without even going into published collections, they change."

 

Yes, of course, those are the symptoms I'm experiencing too.  The goal of providing a recipe is to narrow down the conditions that are triggering the bug and make it easier for Adobe to reproduce and diagnose it, making it more likely the bug will get fixed sooner.

 

I've already expressed my opinion (twice) that it would be best if Adobe engineers took copies of our catalogs and debugged the problem, considering that the recipe above doesn't reproduce all the symptoms being observed. But unfortunately, Adobe usually does that only for hard-to-reproduce bugs that many more people are reporting or bugs that severely corrupt catalog data.  So even though I would prefer that Adobe devote more resources to quality assurance, for problems I care about I'm still going to post information and recipes that might accelerate getting the bugs fixed.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 27, 2022 Jan 27, 2022

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I installed LR 10.4 and 11.1 on a new Macbook Pro (2021) that never had Creative Cloud on it before.  The recipe I posted above also reproduces the problem on this system. Here's a screen recording:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/q7lwcc4tt9f2cof/Publish-bug.2022.01.27.mov?dl=0 

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 28, 2022 Jan 28, 2022

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Distilling this down further:

 

"9. Select the two photos and do Library > Previews > Build 1:1 Previews.

 

10. Observe that the two photos now incorrectly appear in Modified Photos To Re-Publish."

 

This is where the disconnect is occurring.  Should the rebuild of a preview when there has been an underlying change with the masking tools used initiate a Republish? I could argue yes. The preview is now current, but the published file was rendered under the previous masking toolset and out of date.

 

Or am I missing something here?

Rikk Flohr - Customer Advocacy: Adobe Photography Products

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 28, 2022 Jan 28, 2022

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Clearly, there are different degrees of severity with this issue as you are teasing out some small element of a suspected recipe to make it happen on a particular machine and I just need to go into LR and do NOTHING, to have the issue. While I appreciate the effort, if the root cause is the same, then it seems unlikely that teasing out a flaw in this recipe will make any difference at least certainly in my case.

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LEGEND ,
Jan 28, 2022 Jan 28, 2022

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"Should the rebuild of a preview when there has been an underlying change with the masking tools used initiate a Republish? I could argue yes. The preview is now current, but the published file was rendered under the previous masking toolset and out of date."

 

Upgrading from 10 to 11 preserves the exact appearance and settings of individual graduated filters, radial filters, and adjustment brushes (unless they use color or luminance range masks). Re-rendering a photo that uses these produces the same exact result. Since the settings and visual appearance haven't changed, upgrading shouldn't trigger Modified.

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Adobe Employee ,
Jan 28, 2022 Jan 28, 2022

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I've got the team looking at this thread and have also asked them to chime in on whether a preview re-render triggering a Republish is as designed behavior or not. 

 

I've been running an experiment for a couple of weeks on my home catalog and have yet to see an untouched image show up for Republish. 

Rikk Flohr - Customer Advocacy: Adobe Photography Products

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LEGEND ,
Jan 28, 2022 Jan 28, 2022

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Another way to think about this: LR/Camera Raw maintain the invariant that for a given process version and settings, a photo should always render exactly the same.  They promise the user that a cataloged, developed photo will always re-render the same, until the user explicitly changes the photo (e.g. changes the process version).   That's why we don't need to export rendered JPEGs back into our catalogs.

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Community Beginner ,
Jan 30, 2022 Jan 30, 2022

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As much as I now hate the idea of even going into my published collections because of this issue, I needed to go in an remove some photos. Once I selected a shot, it took about 30 seconds for the system to flag 55 photos for replublishing. What a PITA especially when I actually do edit a few shots as I have to remember the onces that did indeed change. I never left the Library module.

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New Here ,
May 17, 2022 May 17, 2022

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I have this issue too. It has only started happening recently but I note that many of you have had this issue for a long time. It is very annoying.

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Explorer ,
May 17, 2022 May 17, 2022

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Annoying is an understatement.   I finally quit worrying about it after long attempts to fix, repeated republishes and trying (as loggested by a LRC site) the "Mark as Up-To-Date" option - which did not seem to fix the issue.

HOWEVER using the current version of LRC 11.3.1 with Camera Rawe 14.3  - the problem has seems to gone away for the most part - I really cannot say for sure since the large amounts of photos with issues seems to have gone away, howeve had a few straglers that needed to be re-published (maybe less than 5% of what I had before) so not sure if these were something I opened and maybe made a change to or something along those lines.  Bottom line - don't have the issue happening enough now to even notice.   

Never received or saw any notice about this being fixed, so this is just an observation of recent changes I have seen.

Hope this helps you. 

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Participant ,
Aug 27, 2022 Aug 27, 2022

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I have a number of photos in publish collections that I use to update a web site. The collections have been created by my own Publish Service plugin. Sometimes, but not always, selecting photos that are up to date in one of these collections causes the photos to be marked as requiring updating. There is no new entry in the dev history list when this happens. Has anyone seen anything like this?

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Community Expert ,
Aug 27, 2022 Aug 27, 2022

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Yes, there are several threads about this. One thing that seems to trigger this is when the thumbnail is out-of-date. Selecting the image will trigger an update of the thumbnail, and that triggers the update in the publishing service. Other cases are a mystery.

 

-- Johan W. Elzenga

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Participant ,
Aug 27, 2022 Aug 27, 2022

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Annoying. Thanks.

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LEGEND ,
Aug 31, 2022 Aug 31, 2022

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A frequent cause of this problem: When Adobe changes the internal representation of develop settings (without changing the process version), LR gets confused and thinks a photo as been "changed" and needs to be republished.  This happened in LR 2015.6 when Guided Upright was added, and again in LR 11.0 when the new masking was introduced.   Adobe has declined to fix this issue because there wasn't an easy-to-reproduce bug recipe and they didn't want to ask for people's catalogs to debug.

 

You can try these steps:

 

1. Select all the photos in a published collection.

 

2. Do Library > Previews > Build 1:1 Previews (to force LR to convert the internal develop settings to the new representation, which it normally does incrementally).

 

3. Select all the photos, right-click, and do Mark Up-To-Date.

 

This often didn't work with LR 11.0 and 11.1 -- there seemed to be a bug with Mark Up-To-Date. If it doesn't, your only option is to republish.

 

See this post for more details:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-discussions/photo-moves-to-modified-photos-to-re-pu... 

 

See these two threads:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-discussions/photo-moves-to-modified-photos-to-re-pu...

https://community.adobe.com/t5/lightroom-classic-bugs/p-photos-incorrectly-considered-as-quot-change... 

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LEGEND ,
Aug 31, 2022 Aug 31, 2022

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Community Beginner ,
Sep 03, 2022 Sep 03, 2022

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worked for me

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