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Question regarding color profiles recognition.

Community Beginner ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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 Hello, My question is porting on my tablet display color presets and how photoshop could be recognizing them.

The kamva 24 4K comes with plurial color gamut presets when drawing (labeled as "native" "sRGB" and "AdobeRGB").

 

I lately finished a painting on photoshop, but was unuware that I was using the preset labeled as "native" (with a better color range than the sRGB one if I'm not wrong), I was happy with the thing, all intended colors in the good places, and decided to export it to look at it on another screen. That is when reality catched me back, even if I was using "native" preset it was basically just acting as a preview since photoshop was still painting in it's basic settings aka sRGB color profile, so obviously my colors came out as more washed out than expected.

 

My question then is; is there any way that photoshop may be able to recognize my "native" huion preset as a sort of color profile, and then try to transfer the colors I applied there, to a new sRGB file by some color HEX code close match or something ? Or am I doomed to need to eyeball screen to screen to retrieve my good colors in sRGB by adjustments layers ?

Thanks in advance, I'll be sure to provide any details asked !

 

PS: here are two images for the recreation of my "problem", the first one is a recreation of my "native" colors, and the second is the "sRGB output" when I display the image on any other display than my huion tablet.

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Community Expert ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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Those presets are just for display, how it reproduces the numbers it gets. They have nothing to do with the numbers in the file.

 

If you want the full Adobe RGB gamut, make an Adobe RGB document, and make sure the Adobe RGB profile is embedded. That defines the color numbers in your painting as actual, specific colors. Without a profile they are just numbers without definition.

 

Now, to reproduce those numbers correctly on screen, you need a color managed display pipeline. That means two things:

 

  • One, you need an accurate monitor profile. A calibrator will make that for you, by measuring the display and write a profile that describes its behavior, in detail.
  • Two, you need to use an application that supports color management and will actually read these profiles and convert from one into the other. Photoshop does that, but many consumer-grade image viewers don't. Tell us which one you're using.

 

That's color management 101. You need two profiles, a source and a destination. The color numbers are recalculated, on the fly, to preserve appearance in the target color space (in this case your tablet).

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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Sure, I should have mentionned that the second display I blasted my .png on is a calibrated monitor (Calibrated with a spyder) so no problem on that side, two, I assume that when you say "use an application that supports color management and will actually read these profiles" I suppose we are speaking of the "image reader" such as windows photos. Therefore the visualiser I use usually is the default microsoft photo gallery (windows 10), but for the sake of this problem I also oppened it on a separate photoshop file (like for instance I have the painting opened on my huion, and the same painting opened on my DELL display upper that to compare).

 

Moroever I have a question concerning your first sentence on AdobeRGB embedded because I am unsure if I am correctly getting it, if I start painting on a AdobeRGB profile, wouldn't that cause problems further down the road if later a friend for exemple would open the image on a simple sRGB device such as a smartphone ? Or maybe I am missing something here.

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Community Expert ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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You don't seem to understand what color management does:

 

It converts from the document profile to the monitor profile. This is a perfectly normal profile conversion, just like any other profile conversion, only performed automatically, on the fly, as you work. This way the file is correctly represented on screen. And since it is correctly represented, it will look the same everywhere, on any screen.

 

For this to work, the profile has to describe the display accurately. The profile is a map, and like any map it has to correspond to the actual terrain.

 

This is not to be confused with calibration. The calibrator will first adjust the display (calibration), and then write the profile based on measurement. The profile describes the display in its calibrated state.

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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Thanks, it appears clearer now, I clearly mismatched terminaisons here.

Just to be sure, is it what is labelled as "working spaces" under edit>color settings>RGB ?

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Community Expert ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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quote

My question then is; is there any way that photoshop may be able to recognize my "native" huion preset as a sort of color profile, and then try to transfer the colors I applied there, to a new sRGB file by some color HEX code close match or something ?


By @Nino27415625d0q1

If "native" huion preset is the display profile of the tablet, it does, but ONLY to produce a preview in all color managed applications. 

The display (and profile) is divorced from the color space of the data you edit by design. It is only used to preview the source image data as tagged for a preview. 

See: https://www.adobe.com/digitalimag/pdfs/phscs2ip_colspace.pdf

Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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Okay, more clear now, that was my thought and it permit to phrase myself more clearly now. (english isn't my prime language so I tend to have some difficulties with technical terminaisons sometimes).

So basically, can I applicate the "preview look" to my image data in photoshop ?

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Community Expert ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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quote

So basically, can I applicate the "preview look" to my image data in photoshop ?


By @Nino27415625d0q1

Sorry, I do not understand your new question.

Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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"Native" isn't really the display profile (when we say that we speak about an ICC profile right ?) it's more a preset that I can change on the fly to paint either in Native (huion), sRGB or AdobeRGB (I am linking an image for more clarity), it seems I can't really find a way to phrase it sadly, but when I use the word "preview" it's because as you said, even if the colors of the Huion preset "Native" (richer colors) have no impact on the data I edit on my files, do I have a way to retrieve these richer colors and applicate them elsewhere ?

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Community Expert ,
Dec 03, 2022 Dec 03, 2022

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I don't know what “Native” is but it's lumped in with two other color spaces defined by ICC profiles. If indeed it's a profile, even a “canned or generic” profile, then color managed applications will use it as described in the Adobe white paper. If it isn't an ICC profile then whatever it is isn't used as such. 

Author “Color Management for Photographers" & "Photoshop CC Color Management/pluralsight"

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Community Expert ,
Dec 05, 2022 Dec 05, 2022

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Here's a bit of reading that might help I hope.

Also this piece on ICC profiles.

 

I hope this helps
neil barstow, colourmanagement net :: adobe forum volunteer:: co-author: 'getting colour right'
google me "neil barstow colourmanagement" for lots of free articles on colour management

 

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