Collage still does not work

Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Since I have a few days left of my 2021 Elements trial, I thought I would do a few more things to get it to work.

I deleted and reinstalled the program, again.

I deleted all the Catalogs from my hard drive, named a new Catalog, and reinstalled all the images in the new Catalog.

Made sure I selected 4 images with thumbnails connected to the main image - no disconnected images to start.

Ran the collage utility.

Saved it. Done.

The Organizer showed the collage image.  Clicked on the new collage in the Organizer and the "disconnected" screen appeared, again as usual.  I let the "connect" utility run its course, 45-minutes worth.  Twice.  Nothing.

Hints? 

 

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021
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Bug, How to, Organizer, Performance, Problem or error, Windows

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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I am unable to reproduce the 'disconnected' message.

There is a way to follow better the 'collage' process and that might give us something to search.

Before clicking the 'Save Button' on the bottom, look at the 'Advanced Mode' button on the top left.

This brings you to the normal 'expert' mode, the top menu line is restored as well as the left and right panels.

You can click on the 'Layers' icon on the bottom right, and you are presented with the arrangement of layers and masks which produces the collage. Since you have the top menu, you can use it to 'Save as' and specify the .psd format instead of the .pse one, and you choose the destination of the psd.

Note that the 'Advanced mode' switches to 'Basic mode': what is displayed is not the mode you are in, it's the mode you want to get to.

Can you save normally as .psd and reopen the psd without disconnected message?

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Thank you for sticking with me on this.

 

I believe I followed the above sequence. I've attached 3 screenshots

Screenshot 2021-01-18 095631.png

of what transpired:

Screenshot 2021-01-18 095631.png

This is after I selected the images, went to Create, hit Collage and entered "Advanced Mode."

 

Screenshot 2021-01-18 095946.png

This is after I changed .pse to .psd .

 

Screenshot 2021-01-18 100210.png

This is the result in the Organizer.  Note the first image is earlier this morning when I saved the .pse. The image to the right is a few moments ago based on the .psd saved image.

 

I hope you can clean something from all this.

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Sorry for the duplicated first screenshot.  Please disregard that one.

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Hope you can "glean" something, not "clean" something.

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Your last screenshot from the organizer:

Can you read the location for the pse and the psd in the info panel on the right? The full path with drive letter.

That screenshot suggests that your 'Pictures' folder is under your user name in the D : drive. The screenshot from the explorer does not show the full path; I believe you have chosen the Windows option to store your 'User' and 'Pictures' panel on the D : drive.

 

Anyway, what I suggest now is to use the top menu to 'save as', keeping the .pse format, to another temporary folder outside of 'Pictures' or your 'user'. For instance in the F or H drive. If you don't get the errors, that would confirm that the project feature of the organizer is fooled by the 'Pictures' path.

 

In my own experience, by default the pse is saved in my 'Pictures' folder, even if I have taken great care to store all my images outside of that default location, in an external drive. Instead of using the 'Save' button on the bottom, I prefer to use the 'Save as' option in the top menu.

 

 

 

 

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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I "saved as" my collage to the desktop.  The collage now opened in the Organizer as it should. 🙂 🙂

 

So now my questions are:

1. Did I do something wrong in my initial setup?  If so, what?

2. Would changing the location of all "saved" images in the PSE2021 to be at any location OTHER THAN the "pictures" folder be a good idea?  Or is the main idea to keep the saved collage in a different folder from where the individual images are located?

3. Where is the "ideal" permanent location for the "save as" collages - you suggested a different drive, but could it just be a different folder on the same drive?

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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I "saved as" my collage to the desktop.  The collage now opened in the Organizer as it should.

 

So now my questions are:

1. Did I do something wrong in my initial setup?  If so, what?

Nothing wrong. I think you were unlucky to use a Windows feature to store your folders which is not so common. I think the 'default' location was meant for beginners who don't use it. Advanced users use the 'advanced' mode and 'save as', or even do the collage totally manually. I don't think Adobe programmer's considered your option.

2. Would changing the location of all "saved" images in the PSE2021 to be at any location OTHER THAN the "pictures" folder be a good idea?  Or is the main idea to keep the saved collage in a different folder from where the individual images are located?

I always advise and repeat that using the 'Pictures' default drive is a bad idea for the Organizer (and even Lightroom). In your case, simply use the workaround to always save as where you want. It's doubtful that a correction for that bug will come soon.

3. Where is the "ideal" permanent location for the "save as" collages - you suggested a different drive, but could it just be a different folder on the same drive?

There is no preference to set the locatation of collages. You can set a number of preferences but not that one.

My advice to store your library outside of 'Pictures' is more general.

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Thank you for your response.  I am learning. But because I am a "literalist", could you please clarify a couple of things I'm still vague about...

 

1. You said, "I always advise and repeat that using the 'Pictures' default drive is a bad idea for the Organizer."

  • Do you mean that using the default "drive" that contains the pictures folder is a "bad idea" or using the default pictures "folder" is a "bad idea?"
  • Are you referring to keeping only the newly EDITED files out of the 'Pictures' folder/or drive or keeping all newly DOWNLOADED image files out of the 'Pictures' folder/or drive?

2. You said "...simply use the workaround to always 'save as' where you want."

  • Are you referring to using the 'save as' workaround just for "edits" and not for new downloads?
  • Are you referring to use 'save as'  for every kind of routine edit or just for collages? The default save (not 'save as') has worked well for every other photo edit (except collages).
  • Is this a recommendation to always use "save as" for edits to be saved to any location EXCEPT in the default "Pictures" folder (or drive that contains the pictures folder)? I'm not sure if your recommendation refers to keeping a) EVERYTHING out of the 'Pictures' folder or just b) the edits or c) just collages.

Thanks again.  I hope to stifle my barrage of questions soon.

 

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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1. You said, "I always advise and repeat that using the 'Pictures' default drive is a bad idea for the Organizer."

  • Do you mean that using the default "drive" that contains the pictures folder is a "bad idea" or using the default pictures "folder" is a "bad idea?"
  • I mean that you should avoid storing your photos on the 'Pictures' folder. It's better to have the shortest path just under the root folder of  your chosen drive or partition. No ambiguity to browse the ful folder tree under your 'user' folder or under the 'Pictures' shortcut in the tree displayed in the explorer. And mostly to avoid any risk when restoring a backup to the 'original' location (path) which has changed if you have updated to a recent Windows version or if you have migrated under a new user name.
  • Are you referring to keeping only the newly EDITED files out of the 'Pictures' folder/or drive or keeping all newly DOWNLOADED image files out of the 'Pictures' folder/or drive?
  • I mean, all managed photos in the catalog. You can define the default from the downloader or in the preferences for scans.

2. You said "...simply use the workaround to always 'save as' where you want."

  • Are you referring to using the 'save as' workaround just for "edits" and not for new downloads?
  • Are you referring to use 'save as'  for every kind of routine edit or just for collages? The default save (not 'save as') has worked well for every other photo edit (except collages).
  • Only for your present issue with collages.
  • Is this a recommendation to always use "save as" for edits to be saved to any location EXCEPT in the default "Pictures" folder (or drive that contains the pictures folder)? I'm not sure if your recommendation refers to keeping a) EVERYTHING out of the 'Pictures' folder or just b) the edits or c) just collages.
  • As stated above, I don't want to have any photo managed in a catalog in the 'Pictures' folder. There may be other softwares which play well with 'Pictures'. For media files imported from the Web or mail in the downloaded files folder (for instance OneDrive or Dropbox), I copy or move them to my own folder structure before 'importing' them from files or folders. By the way, I have recently moved that 'downloaded files' system folder to my D drive to save space on C as well as my DropBox folder. My choice is to store my own library just under the root of the chosen drive or partition. I also store the catalog folders just under that root folder. Ideal to share my library between two computers.

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Explorer ,
Jan 18, 2021 Jan 18, 2021

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Fantastic!  I think I'm catching on. 🙂

 

Where to go from here:

1. Should I leave all the existing image files where they are and just start a new folder closer to the root for new downloads and edits?

Or

2. Should I move the entire Picture folder to a place one notch down from the root?  If so, what is the best way to do that without screwing things up?

3. And of course I will "save as" my collage creations in a totally different folder from my downloads and other edits. I wonder what other types of Creations in addition to Collages should be saved to a separate folder?  I saved a Perfect Landscape Guided Edit (layered a superior sky) to the 4-levels down Photo file without issue. BTW, that Perfect Landscape feature works PERFECTLY!

 

Just a curiosity, and I understand things change with newer apps, but...

I had no problem creating a catalog and creating, saving, and opening a collage from within that same D:User:Gerald:Pictures file in Elements 9. In fact, the collage I created in Elements 9 actually opened and was viewable fine from in Elements 2021. I've learned it is sometimes a disadvantage to have worked with older versions because we often thoughtlessly apply the techniques that worked fine with the old app only to eventually discover that they don't work that way for the newer apps.

 

Thanks again for saving me from having to rely only on the older, 10-year old apps,  as well as my trial version of the new CyberLink Photo Director 12.  While there are some nice things in that app, there are many features, especially Guided Edits and Search features that are much better in Elements 2021.  All this experimentation has helped me understand why some folks use more than one app.

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 19, 2021 Jan 19, 2021

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Where to go from here:

1. Should I leave all the existing image files where they are and just start a new folder closer to the root for new downloads and edits?

Or

2. Should I move the entire Picture folder to a place one notch down from the root? If so, what is the best way to do that without screwing things up?

To move your photo and videos from the 'Pictures' folder in your user folders to another location, you can use your folders panel in tree mode and drag and drop to another master folder in the same folder panel.

- create your new master folder where you want

- to make that folder visible in the folders panel, there must be at least one photo imported in the catalog. Place a dummy photo there and import it in your catalog.

- select the top folder of a branch you want to move, click and drag to the new folder in the panel and let go the mouse.

 

Note that if you already have all your files under that master folder, the process can move your whole library in a single step. That may take time (without a completion gauge... be very patient). I would always perform a full backup before.

The process is very flexible and more reliable than in Lightroom. If you have many branches to move, that may require a lot of moves, but you can choose what you move and what you want to keep in Pictures.

 

Another global solution is to restore your backup directly under the newly created master folder. You'll have a duplicate version of your catalog and its pictures. The main difference is that the physical folder tree will have the same folder structure, but will only contain files registered in the catalog. You'll still have empty folder steps including Pictures and your user name, but they won't be known as system folders. Then you can use the drag and drop method to bypass such an empty step, you drag the useful folder tree directly to the new master folder.

When you have moved and tested your restored catalog, you'll probably have to delete the previous catalog and its linked files to save space.

 

 

 

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Explorer ,
Jan 19, 2021 Jan 19, 2021

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1. Should I leave all the existing image files where they are and just start a new folder closer to the root for new downloads and edits?

Or

2. Should I move the entire Picture folder to a place one notch down from the root? If so, what is the best way to do that without screwing things up?

1. Which is better to do, 1. or 2., or does it not matter?

2. When you refer to "Master Folder" what is the definition? What's in it? Is it the new folder I create a level below my D drive?  What is the best range of sub-folders within the Master?  I'm thinking a folder for all my existing images, a separate folder for my general edits, and a 3rd sub-folder for Collages and whatever else PSE 2021 rebels against having in the same folder.  Does that make sense, or am I overthinking this?

3. If I "already" have "all my files" in my D:Users:Gerald:Photos file, is the "Photos" file what you are calling the "Master?"

4. So, could I simply drag and drop my existing Photos folder (the one currently located in D:Users:Gerald) into my newly created Photos Folder directly under the D drive (of course all from within the PSE 2021 app folder tree)?

5. What real, noticeable benefits will be realized by moving my existing Photos folder a couple of levels up from where they presently reside? What processes benefit from this move?

You already solved my Collage problem and everything else is speedy - all thumbnails load speedily no matter how fast I scroll, all 8,000+, once things are copied and indexed.Or is it just the convenience of not having to click through a couple more layers when I need to access the photos folder? 

 

Thanks again for sticking with me on all this.

 

 

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 19, 2021 Jan 19, 2021

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1. Should I leave all the existing image files where they are and just start a new folder closer to the root for new downloads and edits?

Or

2. Should I move the entire Picture folder to a place one notch down from the root? If so, what is the best way to do that without screwing things up?

1. Which is better to do, 1. or 2., or does it not matter?

Choice 1 does not help much and 2 is not what I advise. You don't move the 'Pictures' folder which is special folder dedicated by Windows to your pictures and which has special properties working with other programs. You move the contents of the 'Pictures' folder to another folder, which has none of the special properties (acting as a shortcut in the Explorer for instance). If you have created another folder also called 'Pictures' in another drive or partition, it's not a Windows 'Pictures' folder;  if you have restored your backup to another drive, the 'Pictures' folder step will appear below your User name, but it won't be a Windows 'Pictures' folder. What is important is that you move the contents of the folder.

2. When you refer to "Master Folder" what is the definition? What's in it? Is it the new folder I create a level below my D drive? 

It's the top folder you have created under the upper level folder of your drive. Yes, it will be the folder you created under the D drive.

What is the best range of sub-folders within the Master?  I'm thinking a folder for all my existing images, a separate folder for my general edits, and a 3rd sub-folder for Collages and whatever else PSE 2021 rebels against having in the same folder.  Does that make sense, or am I overthinking this?

There are different ways to organize your folder structure. The general consensus is to make it simple, and in most cases to use a chronological structure. The downloader provides an option to automaticall create subfolders with a YYY MM DD template when you import from camera or card reader. That's what I am happy with.

3. If I "already" have "all my files" in my D:Users:Gerald:Photos file, is the "Photos" file what you are calling the "Master?"

For me, the master is the destination folder you have created.

4. So, could I simply drag and drop my existing Photos folder (the one currently located in D:Users:Gerald) into my newly created Photos Folder directly under the D drive (of course all from within the PSE 2021 app folder tree)?

As explained above, I expect you to move the contents (the subfolders tree) of your Photos folder into the newly created (empty) master folder. I would not move the contents directly into the D root drive.

5. What real, noticeable benefits will be realized by moving my existing Photos folder a couple of levels up from where they presently reside? What processes benefit from this move?

If you don't 'clean' the intermediate empty folder levels, you'll be annoyed by the way the folder tree is displayed in the left folder panel and by the very long folder path in various panels (especially in the information panel).

When a user with a classical setup with photo files in 'Pictures' and a catalog in the hidden location of ProgramData restores a backup in his newly created master folder on another drive with the option to keep the original structure, you get those empty folders, but that's not a big issue. The restored catalog folder is also to be found just under the restored master folder.

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Explorer ,
Jan 20, 2021 Jan 20, 2021

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I asked:  "What is the best range of sub-folders within the Master?  I'm thinking a folder for all my existing images, a separate folder for my general edits, and a 3rd sub-folder for Collages and whatever else PSE 2021 rebels against having in the same folder?"

 

You replied: "There are different ways to organize your folder structure. The general consensus is to make it simple, and in most cases to use a chronological structure. The downloader provides an option to automatically create subfolders with a YYY MM DD template when you import from camera or card reader. That's what I am happy with".

 

Clarification needed:  I thought "a) a folder for all my existing images, b) a separate folder for my general edits, and c) a 3rd sub-folder for Collages" made sense because I understood you to advise that "collages" should be saved to a separate "save as" folder, separate from the regular images, some of which might be saved to a separate "edits folder" which would conflict with "collages" if the normal edits were in the same folder as collages.  Or is it just the Windows "Pictures" folder (D:Users:Gerald:Pictures) that created that conflict for collages?

 

Or perhaps you are suggesting to let the program do its thing to automatically create its folder structure, and just have one separate folder - for "save as" -  for collages and other creations that may not work properly (display disconnects) if placed within the standard, automatic folders.

 

Can you clarify this, please?

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jan 21, 2021 Jan 21, 2021

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Collages are 'projects', that is sets of media files grouped into folders with other assets to be able to create a result like a slideshow, a panorama, a collage... You can always go back to those resources to modify and save a result. Depending on the kind of project, the folders are differently structured and located. I a number of cases, project folders are to be found in the catalog folder itself like slideshows; the collages may be stored where you want; I have no preferences except I don't like the defaul location in the Windows 'Pictures' folder.

You can select 'projects' in the organizer (by details, media type) and find easily the location of your .pse file on the properties panel on the right. You'll find a subfolder with the project name containing a single .psd file for a collage. This psd offers an arrangement of  'smart layers' to build your own layout. This psd can be edited and modified to your taste if you switch to advanced mode.

 

My choice for collages would be to store them in my date structure if there is a about the same date or outside the date structure, by existing themes or in a specific collage master folder. I would rather rely on keywords for organizing. There is no reason to fear disconnections whether if using a folder structure or keywords within the organizer.

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Explorer ,
Jan 21, 2021 Jan 21, 2021

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I moved all my photo files into a new 'Photos' folder under D drive.  I created a separate 'Photos - collages' folder also under D drive. I don't expect to ever have more than a few dozen collages, each uniquely named pusuant to your recomnended 'save as' protocol.

 

Everything is working well.  Even the "duplicate image via USB cable import" issue has been resolved.

 

Thanks for your help.

________________________________________________________________________________________ Fuji HS50EXR, Samsung S9+. Nikon Coolpix P950. Just transitioned from PSE and PE 9 to 2021

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