Boycott Creative Cloud?

[Mike Wickham]

If you haven't heard, CS6 is the last CS version. From now on, you have to rent your applications via the Creative Cloud. I don't like the new subscription model. I have bought every CS upgrade since version 1, but it looks like CS6 is the end for me, even if it means keeping an old computer around just to run CS6 applications.

Perhaps Adobe would change its mind in a few months if most everyone avoided signing up for the subscription. In any case, they've created a real opportunity for competitors.

[bababongatwo]

Exactly.
Nearby 32.000 signers at change.org is a great number (if you know how difficult it is to bring people to activity).
But the better number are the only - not overwhelming - 500.000 subscripers.
And I take every bet: Most of them (see the questions at help-forums) are newcomers with low budget, who think the "low fees" are a good base (entrance). People, who mostly not invest into a solution of a few thousand $. Wait, how long they stay, when fee-prices have to rise.
For professionals, there are so many lacks and horrible boarders, that they HAVE TO FORCE them.

Let´s see, how succesfull their solution was, at the end of the year.
The amount of subscribers dictates the price of fees in future. As there is no other income for Adobe from thereon.
Let´s wait and see.
My sugestion: Keep CS6 alive as long as you can (they let you - for the momnet they can´t lose that income, without losing face at stock-markets), search for alternatives!!!

In my eyes it´s a great risk for Adobe. And their Image already has been damaged (They are ranking below MS in my list - and it´s difficult to get that position).
Time will tell.

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CC = Cash Cow = Terminating the word "Archive" in digital future = Lifelong dependency = NoGo = Never

[rob_ashcroft]

I'm getting confused about all of this. Adobe say on their FAQ ...

While Adobe Creative Suite® 6 products will continue to be available for purchase, Adobe has no plans for future releases of Creative Suite or other CS products.

Does that mean that if I don't sign up to Cloud I will not get any future updates to my CS6 copy even though PS in Cloud may be updated? If so, is that not just a way of Adobe forcing users to sign up to Cloud?

[Brad_Trent]

Yes Rob...that's exactly what it means.

[uhanepono]

No, you WILL get updates!!!  You will get maintainence updates to your full licence copy of CS6 (There was just a camera raw update the other day) but you will not get not get updated to any of the new features that have been added to CC since May (Think of CC as a version upgrade but for rent not own). So don't worry, your copy of CS6 will be viable for some time to come. It reamains to be seen what adobe will do after the 6 month periond of time they have been given to convince their money people this is a good idea. So look for further developments on the issue around mov/dec. The fewer people subscribe to the cloud the harder it will be for them to convince them and they might come out with a CS7. We can dream. In the meantime do some research into plugins and other apps that can do the things that the newer updates do. For example you can use the even better "perfect focus" plugin for nondestructive blur gallery effects. It's part of onone's "perfect photo suite" and also can be used as a stand-alone app. The lens jitter-fix thingey will soon be obsolete with the new STM lens coming out so no point in investing there. straighten is already a standard tool elsewhere in CS6 ... Well you get the idea. Be proactive and go get what you want. 

rob_ashcroft wrote:

I'm getting confused about all of this. Adobe say on their FAQ ...

While Adobe Creative Suite® 6 products will continue to be available for purchase, Adobe has no plans for future releases of Creative Suite or other CS products.

Does that mean that if I don't sign up to Cloud I will not get any future updates to my CS6 copy even though PS in Cloud may be updated? If so, is that not just a way of Adobe forcing users to sign up to Cloud?

[gator soup]

don't worry, your copy of CS6 will be viable for some time to come.

unless you move to a new GUI (video card), unsupported camera, or OS bugs that Adobe will no longer workaround (on discontinued products)

just look at the new Mac Pros

how do you expect CS6 (CS5) will run on one of these under 10.8 (if it is even possible), or 10.9

progress is inevitable...

PS:

TAKE THE TOUR on the link (click on the white down arrow graphic below the tower to see what's around the corner)...

[Trevor.Dennis]

gator soup wrote:

unless you move to a new GUI (video card), unsupported camera, or OS bugs that Adobe will no longer workaround (on discontinued products)

[image clipped]

progress is inevitable... PS:TAKE THE TOUR on the link (click on the white down arrow graphic below the tower to see what's around the corner)...

Wow. A good point, and one I hadn't thought of.  And not so far fetched either, if you think in terms of ten or twenty years.

[gator soup]

if you think in terms of ten or twenty years.

i am thinking in terms months when the new Mac Pro ships with 10.9.0

just look at the problems (especially Apple OS-X GPU issues) Ps had with 10.5.0, 10.6.0, 10.7.0 and 10.8.0, some never will get fixed

but the people who find themselves in a hard place will be those who buy new machines (my example, the new Mac Pro)

i would bet against Ps CS6 running reliabley on new Mac computers in 2-3 years, and can't imagine trying to run CS6 on a new machine 10-20 years from now so i am not sure your point

[Trevor.Dennis]

gator soup wrote:

i would bet against Ps CS6 running reliabley on new Mac computers in 2-3 years, and can't imagine trying to run CS6 on a new machine 10-20 years from now so i am not sure your point

Sorry gator.  I wasn't being funny, but as Noel says, as a PC user I'd need to think long term before expecting the sort of incompatability problems you are referring to with OS-X.#.   If I was making a point, it is that, in all probability Adobe will never change their minds over perpetual licences, so the huge raft of people who swear they will never move beyond CS6, are sooner or later going to run into problems.  (Windows XP is coming up to 12 years old, and we know that CS6 is going to be the last version of Photoshop to run on that OS. [1] )  Twelve years is a fair old time when it comes to computer hardware, and even operating systems, but I am assuming that most of the CC detractors would hope to be around a 'lot' longer than that?

[1] Do we know for sure that Photoshop CC will not run with Windows XP?

Blimey. I have been following, but resisting the urge to add to this thread in the hope that it would fade away and die, but it still has legs.  So much for 'don't feed the trolls'

[gator soup]

crikey, are me calling a troll

i can't imagine trying to knock work out in Ps CS6 on a 10-year-old Mac system, i guess we are working in two different worlds, but more power to you and all Windows users

[Trevor.Dennis]

I have no idea what the situation is now, but 18 months ago when I built my present system with info and advice from the Premiere Pro Hardware forum, Macs were not in the running performance wise for NLE hardware.   I've noticed that 'The Photoshop Guys' on Kirby TV all use Mac Book Pros for Photoshop, and apparently, for most of them, it is the only computer they own.  But there is a world of difference between Photoshop and Premeire Pro.

Bugger.  You just trolled me.

[gator soup]

Bugger.  You just trolled me.

sorry, but you only got tangled up in your own rigging

[bluesmokebloke]

I didn't read the entire thread, but a survey seems to show that a lot of hobbyists & students are TO'd about this. I'd like to chime in as a designer at an agency - we have no intention of moving to the cloud. We upgrade every other cycle on average, and are currently on CS5 - no big deal. As some wise posters have stated, Adobe's byzantine feature set becomes ever less useful with each release. The sky will not fall if we choose to not subscribe (for us, anyway.) Of course the industry will evolve as ever, but frankly I've seen a 20-year shift from print to web, and Adobe products have never figured less prominently in my workflow.

Anyway, sorry to ramble. Just wanted to share that this agency will not be subscribing, and I strongly doubt we're alone.

[Brad_Trent]

bluesmokebloke theorized: "...I didn't read the entire thread, but a survey seems to show that a lot of hobbyists & students are TO'd about this....."

It ain't exactly limited to hobbyists! I haven't spoken to a single professional photographer in my rather large circle of influence (I'm the current secretary of the Editorial Photographers group, a standaolne chapter of APA) who is jazzed about 'The Cloud' and none say they intend to join, but they all worry about just how long CS5/6 will be truly usable, especially in light of Apple's newly announced Mac Pro this week. Besides the obvious hardware differences over current Mac Pro systems, it will be coming loaded with OS10.9, whatever the Hell that is! And with every new iteration of the Mac OS, more and more software gets left behind. I have no idea what the Mac engineers will be doing with 10.9, but whether its that OS or one that gets introduced a few years down the road, eventually all those guys still hanging onto CS6 as their Photoshop of choice will one day have no choice but to upgrade, and unless things change at Adobe, that will only mean they will hafta join 'The Cloud'.

And now I'll just sit back and wait to see how long it takes for power-poster Noel Carboni to chime in wondering why us Mac users stick with such a sh¡tty platform......

[Jeff Schewe]

Brad_Trent wrote:

...worry about just how long CS5/6 will be truly usable, especially in light of Apple's newly announced Mac Pro this week. Besides the obvious hardware differences over current Mac Pro systems, it will be coming loaded with OS10.9, whatever the Hell that is! And with every new iteration of the Mac OS, more and more software gets left behind.

Just to be clear, Adobe has stated that there will be Photoshop CS6 updates for OS compatibilities so I'm sure CS6 will run on 10.9 and Windows Blue when it comes out. Not sure about CS5, but I can run all the way back to CS3 on 10.8.4. So, I really don't think 10.9 is going to be a major problem.

[Greg_Bohn]

> Just to be clear, Adobe has stated that there will be Photoshop CS6 updates for OS compatibilities.

  My recollection is that they  only committed to CS6 updates for compatibility with the "Next releases". I didn't get the impression that they committed to ongoing OS updates after that...

  Unless I missed something...

[Brad_Trent]

Jeff...no disrespect intended, but you have connections at Adobe that might allow you to trust them one Hell of a lot more than I do right now. And whether they 'update' CS6 as they see fit or not, that still won't address the inevitable hardware changes that will happen over the next 5-10 years that will undoubtedly make the application about as much fun to use as driving a Ferrari in the sand!

[Lundberg02]

I have PSCS5.   I could spend my money for a BluRayburner and some 50 gB disks, or a home theater receiver, or charging my 22 yr old Toyota a/c, or Capture One Pro 7, or Perfect Photo, or 16 GB RAM, I need some more physics books from Kindle, OR I could up grade to PSCS6.  Maybe Painter 13 will come out this year and have a lot of nice stuff.  I just bought a Thunderbolt 4 TB drive which nearly busted my budget, so I have to think about what to do with my acquisitions money.  I'm pretty tired of emptying my 8 GB RAM with iFreeMem all the time. BluRay can wait til 50GB disks are cheaper.  The Toyota cools for an hour and it hasn't been serviced in 15 years.  I think Capture One is an excellent bet for major feature upgrades.  Perfect  Photo I need to check out as a trial maybe.I haven't read half the Kindles I just got yet.  I have Bose speakers on my TV thru a audio receiver already and don't use them very often   I don't think PSCS6 is offering anything I really need, because Focus Magic for ML will be out soon.

Another thing: Is DNG Converter going to the Cloud? Elements? Lightroom? Will Aperture suddenly become less clunky? Is PDF going to the Cloud? When will full 10 bit support arrive in PS?

Just thinking out loud, but I am damn sure I'm not renting any f********* software.

[Trevor.Dennis]

Lundberg02 wrote:

   The Toyota cools for an hour and it hasn't been serviced in 15 years. 

[clip]

Did you have to say that? It's freezing down here!   Well 12° outside at least, but whoever invented winters needs shooting. 

[Lundberg02]

You know what they say in Tierra Del Fuego: Adapt or die!

[Trevor.Dennis]

I guess we get used to whatever is normal for our parts of the world.  I visited the Florida Everglades once, and while the tourists wore shorts and t-shirts, the locals wore long pants and sweatshirts.  I didn't see Noel, unless he was a) moonlighting as a swamp boat pilot, or b) wearing a fancy dress aligator costume.   in winter we have warm days and cold nights, which is apparently good for the grape vines, but not so flash on people.

Last year I dared to complain that the cold was getting into my bones after a cold wet afternoon watching our Classic Fighters.  A huntin'/fishin' Kiwi buddy said 'that'll be the Brit in you!'  Well that told me all right.

Better get the thread back on topic.

[Lundberg02]

I checked on 16 GB of RAM from OWC and it dropped 73 bucks from a few months ago. It's now less than half what it was when I got my mini 16 months ago.  I can get PSCS6 for 155, or 16 GB for 149. 16 GB would help me lots more than a few features I'll never use.

Blu-Ray disks are quite a bit cheaper now, too, but burners have not dropped appreciably.

[Noel Carboni]

Trevor.Dennis wrote:

I didn't see Noel, unless he was a) moonlighting as a swamp boat pilot, or b) wearing a fancy dress aligator costume.

Very perceptive.  Not that many folks know I have one.

-Noel

[Trevor.Dennis]

Blooming heck Noel.  Not sure as I'd like one of those in my back garden.  I'm guessing you took that with one of your astronomical telescopes, so you could keep a decent distance.  This will be where you come back with a picture of yourself taking Ali for walkies with studded collar and heavy chain gata lead.  Now that ‘would’ be cool. 

[EDIT]  Looking at my clock, it is just two hours to CC day in NZ.  I wish I knew exactly what time, and in what zone, the launch goes live.

[gerryFX]

I agree. I'm not a hobbyist or a student. I've been working as a professional for over 30 years. I will not be subscribing to CC. I think the whole idea of moving to the cloud is to hide the fact that the software has matured and finding ways to upgrade it has been difficult. I think the subscribers will be paying full upgrade prices every year for relatively few upgrades.

[bababongatwo]

CashCow is no accepptable solution for me. Losing full editable access to my archive is the main concern and the absolute knock-out for this. I also lost all my trust to that company (I once liked). So I will use two MAC PRO G5 (2 x 6 Core) to hold CS6 MasterCollections and my archive the next years beside new and alternative workflows. We have already configured them, and I hope they will do that job beside some other tasks for the next 2-3 years. I also think (when I have a look to all that pis.ed of professionals between my business partners), that there will come up competitors in the next years. Since May 6, we already using more and more alternatives to Adobe in case of video-editing, classical 2D design and most parts of web-publishing. The only thing that really hurts is PS. But I think, CS6 is good for the next 1-3 years. My hope is, that there will come up good alternatives, as Adobe forces exactly that. The Apps have reached a quality, where it is still very difficult to offer real innovation (where are the great features within all upgrades last years? Featuring out an new GUI-color???). An VIP from Adobe also said, that there will be more and more cloud-functionalities and other similar stuff in future updates (and not so much innovation/add ons in core-apps). Good for those, who think, they can´t live without that stuff - but not for me. And if: I can buy seperately (as long as Adobe doesn´t buy them all to hold it´s monopoly-state as in the past).
So I also think: The great show/coming out on June 17 will be the last very big upgrade for a long, long period. They must catch as many Cloudies as possible. And so, they concentrated all that new stuff to this point. From thereon (and till the point where there are no longer advantages for old CS6 users to change) they are payed wether they innovate or not (would be glad to be in a similar situation).
Adobes leader board is selling out it´s stock (Do they realy trust into their own business model? They trust into rising stock prices?). I wonder how prices for the CashCow (CC) will rise after the "Catching Cloudies" period ends. Getting into dependency means: It´s not easy to jump off the cloud BS, after a couple of years (lose of fully editable archive = catastrophe for professionals).
After this "Catching Cloudies" period (and no longer income of CS users) - Cloud is the only income for Adobe. Be aware!
With the new MAC Pro, it´s like with Adobe Upgrades: We first have to see, how good they will fit into workflows before to be established. There where many workflow-breaking upgrades in the last years. BtW: The new MP seams not to be the great thing. I´m very disapointed of that. Especialy by the missing upgrade-ability. It´s more a BigMacMini (Realtime 3D editing graphic card?). Apple is a little bit similar to Adobe: Seems they ignore the needs of real professionals. Looking more to hype-trends and funware.
Also: Never had a problem to pay good money for good solutions.
But I´m against to be forced into dependency. No matter if it´s with drugs or software.
My point behind Adobe is made.
Thanks to your programmers for creating my brushes and tools trough the last decades. Great work.
To your leader-borad: Enough is enough. Fly away on your cloud.

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CC = Cash Cow = Terminating the word "Archive" in digital future = Lifelong dependency = NoGo = Never