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Character styles broken?

Engaged ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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This is the first time I'm trying to use the character styles, but it seems that this is not working the way it should... am I doing something wrong here?

Please see the animated gif below (it has 2-3 secs that nothing is happening, so be patient haha).

 

Some issues here:

- It's not applying the previously saved style. Instead it's applying the current text style to the other text that I used to creat the style.

- When I hit UNDO, it actually converts both texts to the style I wanted to use initially

- Even though the text is formated a certain way, when I click the layers while having the Text Tool selected, you can see on top that the color, font, etc, is not coherent with what it's showing. If I then try to edit that text, it converts back to that bold and white font...

 

What a mess... am I missing something or is this really broken?

Photoshop 21.0.3

MacBookPro with macOS 10.13.6

 

Kapture 2020-05-22 at 15.16.27.gif

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correct answers 1 Correct answer

Community Expert , May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

"What do you think?"

 

Since you ask, I will tell you. Sit down first, though. 😊

 

I use styles in InDesign, Illustrator, Photoshop, Word, and Excel. Keeping the discussion to Adobe, they work extremely well in InDesign, moderately well in Illustrator, and are finicky in Photoshop.

 

Photoshop, at its core, is an image editor.  When I started using it, the Type tool created pixels on the current layer. While text has gotten better in PS, it is years behind Illustrator and Light Years behind InD

...

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Engaged ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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Another bug... wow...

So when I create the new style based on the selected text it saves everything, but the font size is completely wrong and when I try to add the one I want, the old text updates to a huge text...

 

Kapture 2020-05-22 at 15.36.33.gif

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Community Expert ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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Hi

One step I don't see you doing is to clear the overrides after applying your Character Style to your formatted text. When you see a + sign in the styles panel, it indicates an override. Highlight your text and click the first button at the bottom of the panel.

66.png

~ Jane

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Engaged ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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Here's why I think this is kinda confusing, even though I'm starting to understand certain things:

You create a red text and save it as "Red Text" as your style. SO now you have None and Red Text.

Now you create a new text layer but you don't change it to None so the Red Text style is selected. You change the style and now the Red Text has the + sign. If you click Clearn Override, it applies the Red Text syle. Perfect.

But if you go to None and click Clear Override, it goes to this style that I can't even change so I will always have the + sign no matter what. That's a bit confusing...

 

Here's how I think it should work (let me know if that makes any sense):

Every time you create a new text layer (and then hit the Accept check mark at the top), it creates a new "Default" style so whenever you want to go back to whatever you created initially, you know where to find it. 

The None would be some kind of default for the whole document (I'm still trying to figure out how to change it and get rid of the + sign there.

Then you would be able to create new styles, the way it is now...

 

What do you think? 

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Community Expert ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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"What do you think?"

 

Since you ask, I will tell you. Sit down first, though. 😊

 

I use styles in InDesign, Illustrator, Photoshop, Word, and Excel. Keeping the discussion to Adobe, they work extremely well in InDesign, moderately well in Illustrator, and are finicky in Photoshop.

 

Photoshop, at its core, is an image editor.  When I started using it, the Type tool created pixels on the current layer. While text has gotten better in PS, it is years behind Illustrator and Light Years behind InDesign.

 

There are two kinds of styles: Paragraph and Character. In your case, where you have one word per layer, I would use only Paragraph styles and set the Character style to None. The paragraph style is intended for the entire paragraph, and Character styles are intended for the characters that need to be different from the rest of the paragraph.

 

"None" as a Character style means: use the Paragraph style. I use Character styles for Bold, Italics, Bold Italic, SMALL CAPS, etc., which need to have different formatting for part of a paragraph — never for the entire paragraph. 

 

By default, Photoshop comes with one Paragraph style called Basic, which can be redefined. When you choose "None" for the Character style, it means use the Paragraph style it has been assigned to. That's why "None" in Character styles cannot have Style Options and will not ever do what you want it to do in your document.

 

The beauty of using styles to format text is that if you remove the overrides first, then editing the style will change all text using the style. 

 

Bottom line for this document: select your text and set the Character Style to None. Use Paragraph Styles instead. And don't use Transform — that will mess things up.

 

Let me know if this helps,

Jane

 

 

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Engaged ,
May 23, 2020 May 23, 2020

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Hi Jane,

 

Thank SO MUCH for your kind and detailed explanation. I will definitely take that into consideration (using Paragraph for the whole text and Character just for certain words).

 

I will also start avoiding the Transform tool for sure. In a way I now understand the idea behind it and the Styles. Basically it keeps the proportion of the text, which in a way, makes sense. It's just a matter of getting used to it and knowing what to use and the consequences of that 😊

 

Again, I really appreciate your time and help. It was extremely helpful!

 

Enjoy your weekend 🙂

 

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Community Expert ,
May 23, 2020 May 23, 2020

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You're welcome, Danny. I hope this helps! 

 ~ Jane

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Community Expert ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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With your second question, I notice the type sizes are showing up with fractions. The first question, then, is did you use Transform to change the size at one point? What happens when you apply the style to fresh text that you type in?

~ Jane

 

jane-e_2-1590159616544.png

jane-e_3-1590159647992.png

 

 

 

 

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Engaged ,
May 22, 2020 May 22, 2020

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Hi Jane,

 

Thank you so much for your replies.

I don't remember using the Transform to change the size, to be honest, but it makes sense, the fractions suggest that I did. Does that affect the behavior? Regardless of using the Transform, wouldn't it go to the size I picked?

 

After posting this I went back and I think I kinda understand how it works... kinda... haha

The + after the names is kinda confusing. Also the check mark button is kinda confusing, because it almost tells us like "ok, apply the style", right? At least that's what I thought. Apparently what it does is that it applies the current text or selection changes to the current selected style, correct? It's all so confusing, because on each selected layer, that panel changes. If I have a "Title" style, selecting layer 1 will have the + next to the style name, but layer 2 doesn't...

What is weird is that if I have the style "None" selected and I make some changes, the + shows up next to the name, but the check mark is no longer clickable... is this normal? Can you explain this behavior? In a new document the None has a different font, color, size, etc.

 

I would assume that "override" is the custom format we pick when using the normal Character panel, right?

 

I just tried with another document and here's what's happening (it's applying the style, but ajusting the size proportionally):

Kapture 2020-05-22 at 16.07.49.gif

 

 

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Explorer ,
Jul 26, 2023 Jul 26, 2023

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"Finicky" is being very diplomatic. If a type layer has been transformed (and for this scenario, let's assume it is a single line of type with one paragraph style applied to the entire line), the style should have a plus because...the type no longer is conforming to the specifications of the style. But not so! Note in the image attached that the duplicated layer, scaled at 200%, does not reflect that it has been changed in the Paragraph Styles. Why not? If this were InDesign, I could redefine the style, or duplicate it and redefine the copy and keep the original. And to make matters worse, if you accidentally redefine a style, you cannot undo that...the new style options persist even if you go backward in the history.

 

In my opinion, the point at which a typical PS user is using styles, is to make a systematic guide for applying those styles to future alterations to the document. For example, if you're setting up a layered PSD file so that another team member can faithfully apply those styles for, say, an image with new wording over an image for the web, etc. Therefore, when you remove overrides, it should revert to the original style that was created...not be a moving target which makes the existence of paragraph styles almost useless.

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