Your disk copy of image was changed since last opened or saved (Mac OS)

Explorer ,
Mar 11, 2011

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I am  occasionally getting a message that "the disk copy of image  was changed since the file was last opened or saved". The OS is 10.6.6 and I am using CS5. It happens on no specific file. All of my files are pretty big. The current one that this is happening on is a psb that is 3.26 G unflattened. I have from  ignorance always ignored the message and saved anyway. I have never detected any damage or discernible changes to the files after ignoring the warning, but after searching Adobe forum and reading a thread about this happening in CS4, I guess I should be more cautious and do a save as and change the file name. I started this thread because no one has reported the issue happening in CS5.

The files were all given to me by ftp as either psd, tiff or camera raw files.  I work on duplicates of the originals in no other program but photoshop and opened and closed the files a few times before getting the message about the disk copy being changed. All of my files are saved to an internal harddrive and  backed up on a time capsule device. I am on a network, but am the sole user of the network. The files are  worked on and saved to an internal hard drive on the same computer. They are never opened on another computer which is usually turned off. I am running no virus protection software except what ever is native to the OS. The only other applications I am running when getting this message are safari, mail and sometimes bridge.

Why am I getting this message and what is causing changes (that I can't detect) to the disk copy?

The mesage means what it says:  something outside of Photoshop has modified your file on disk since the time that Photoshop saved the file.

We don't know what might be changing them -- just that the OS returns a different modification time for the file than what it was when Photoshop saved the file.

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Explorer ,
Feb 22, 2012

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I started having this problem several months ago - after an OS update on snow leopard.  I've since uprgaded to Lion and re-installed my CS5.5 --- and the problem is still there.  I've given up troubleshooting at this point, and just click to save the file!

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Feb 22, 2012

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Please read the previous replies.  Photoshop is just informing you of changes made to the file outside of Photoshop.

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New Here ,
Mar 05, 2012

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I have this problem too, I am on Lion OS X, I do not have time machine active or suitcase installed. I do use Dropbox, but it is not part of my PS workflow. Images are usually from lightroom being "editing in PS". Just posting for others in case this helps troubleshoot.

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Community Beginner ,
Mar 08, 2012

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Just want to chime in that I too have been having this problem. I am using CS5.5 on OS X Lion 10.7.3. I started noticing the problem since installing Lion, so it's been about a year, and I finally looked it up and found this thread.

Sometimes, I open a file, make one small change, save it, and get the error. Other times, it happens to files I have been working on for a longer time. Sometimes, when I am working, it happens every time I save as I work.

Until reading this thread, I thought the issue was purely Lion-related. (Time Machine local backups also seem to be chewing up disk space, and I suspect there is a connection.) However, I see here that many people are having the problem on earlier versions of CS as well as OS X.

I do not use Suitcase or Fusion. I do use Topaz plug-ins. I did change my scratch disk preferences a while back, and also suspect it could be something to do with that. The problem occurs when Bridge is open, and also when it isn't.

My system is old and full of crud. I haven't done a clean install for years, thought I do try and clean it up from time to time.

So... not very helpful, I know, but another voice saying, "Hey, there may be more of us than you think!"

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New Here ,
Mar 08, 2012

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If it's any help, I'm still on OS 10.6.8, CS4 and I don't run Time Machine, Suitcase or Extensis and I get the message occasionally, but only on the rare occasion when I'm saving large document files.  I don't know why some third party thing would only target those files so I'm not buying adobe's claim that it's not responsible.  But there isn't any real world problem, save as works, the files aren't broken or anything, it's just a minor nuisance.

Dave

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New Here ,
Mar 12, 2012

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I know it's maddeninly unhelpful, but I have this problem as well. It happens most often when I'm working on a file that's 50MB or more, and most of the work I do in Photoshop CS5 easily swells past 100MB (large illustrations will do that to ya before you flatten them). I started noticing it after reformatting my hard drive this December, which had originally been partitioned into a Boot section and a User Data section. My scratch disk settings use my external hard drive as the primary and my internal hard drive as the secondary. I am running 10.6.8, Snow Leopard, no Suitcase or Fusion or anything. Time Machine is inactive. I have 4GB of ram. Whenever the message pops up, my computer begins to run slower as well, and for the past few weeks Photoshop has needed to be force quit because it freezes when I quit out of the application. Does anyone think reinstalling the program would help? This is my second install of this disc onto this machine, but when I got it reformatted, I missed a few programs during the uninstall. Will that impact my ability to reinstall?

To everyone in this thread, it's little comfort, but you aren't alone. Maybe Adobe will figure this out soon.

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Participant ,
Mar 12, 2012

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(A side comment first that these forums would benefit from being able to make a general reply, rather than to a specific post...unless I'm missing it somewhere.)

Since my earlier post confirming that the "Suitcase fix" resolved the problem, it has cropped up again, but only rarely. Given the widespread nature of the problem affecting different users with different configurations, it appears that the Photoshop behavior described by Chris can be triggered by any number of scenarios. Adobe may not consider it to be a problem, and in fact may view it as a feature, even though for many users it is nothing but a nuisance. It appears to be something we have to live with until such time that Adobe either improves or fixes the "feature" and/or makes it something you can turn off.

That's my pragmatic take on it at this point, with the real purpose of this post being to confirm that the Suitcase fix is not a complete fix, nor apparently even close to being one. It just removes one of the more common triggers.

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Explorer ,
Mar 12, 2012

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I also want to confirm that the issue has never completely gone away for me.  I am the original poster. The issue has occured on both Lion and Snow Leopard.  A clean install of the OS, reinstall of PS and replacing bad memory and risers all  helped, but occasionally, although much less frequently, I will get a disc copy error message. It doesn't matter what size the file is or how long the file has been open for me. I don't have Suitcase or fusion.

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New Here ,
Mar 19, 2012

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Marian Driscoll & Chris Cox should take the same amount of time they have spent replying to all these posts and DO SOMETHING about this problem. Instead Ms. Driscoll likes to quote people's posts and make fun of them. I have been having this same problem since I upgraded my OS to 10.7 I hate this error! I run into it 10-20 times a day. It is up to Adobe to fix this problem! Do something please. I am not running a font suitcase or dropbox. FIX THIS!

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Mar 19, 2012

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Adobe has done everything we can.  Every single time we've looking into this, we've found a cause outside of Photoshop.

Not once have we found that this was caused by Photoshop.

Unless you come up with a reproducable case that involves only Photoshop changing the files -- then there is nothing Adobe can do about this problem.

The files are being changed outside of Photoshop, and the user needs to know that when saving to avoid losing work.

Photoshop is doing the right thing here in telling you about an external change to your file.

Something else on your system is doing something wrong by changing the file when you do not expect it to be changed.

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New Here ,
Mar 19, 2012

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I think you have to trust that it is in Adobe's best interest to make the end users experience a positive one. Not addressing bugs in software works against that which ultimately leaves a bad taste in users mouths that negatively impacts Adobe's brand and product.

If you look at several of Chris's posts, they have made an effort to try and reproduce the problem (eg see post 142) and so far haven't been able to where Photoshop has caused the error. You have to assume in good faith that if Photoshop was causing an error, Adobe would in good faith take responsibility and say "Yes, that's a problem, we are fixing it and we will update the software soon" because it's in their best interest to do so in order to create a positive experience for their end user.

I can understand Adobes logic - if they can't find an error caused by Photoshop after faithfully testing and trying to reproduce the problem - and some people still have it - the next logical place is to look outside of Photoshop to see what might be causing the issue.

My experience is that I started getting this error when I upgraded Suitcase. I removed the Plugin from Photoshop and haven't had the error since - and I use Photoshop daily. However I totally appreciate the frustration of those who continue to have this problem - it's annoying!

I'm no mac expert but for those who have upgraded their OS or are experiencing disk related write errors, perhaps look at using a disk tool to check disk permissions and disk integrity first before posting to make sure none of those are at fault. I usually use Apple's 'Disk Utility' after booting from an external MacOS DVD to check permissions  - but others might be able to suggest a better practical piece of software for this task?

Some people have also indicated RAM might be an issue for them as well. A google search indicates that Memtest is a solid programme for testing that - which I have never used - but again, others may be able to suggest other software for this task.

Failing that - perhaps Apple has introduced something in OS 10.6 and 10.7 that violates file permissions that needs resolving? How can we explore that avenue to see if there is not an issue there? I assume Chris that you have already explored this avenue as part of Photoshop testing procedures? What outcomes have you found please?

Does anybody else have suggestions for ways we might be able to test external influences for the cause? Chris - can you help with this? Are you able to bring your testing  experience to the table please. It might help alleviate some frustrated users and most certainly would bring a positive reflection on yourself and Adobe if you can help out at this level thanks. All help is appreciated and I'm sure would be rewarded in positive feedback to yourself and Adobe.

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Mar 19, 2012

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Short of borrowing someone's system who sees this regularly and debugging it there, I'm not sure what else we can do.

(and we've done that in the past - which is how we found some of the known third party culprits)

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New Here ,
Mar 20, 2012

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I'd say the best you can do Chris is post any results from your findings that may be helpful.

But also, from a practical point of view, if you have any further suggestions in terms of 3rd part utilities that might help others isolate and resolve some of the more common issues before they post - such as network tools, disk utilities or whatever, those things could help?

The other thing I'd request is that if during debugging you do see that it is a MacOS related issue - can you say so please as this will help re-focus direction towards meeting a resolve from that end of things. Some of your earlier posts suggested you saw OS activities that seemed like they shouldn't be happening (post 64) and the number of folks posting that say they experienced the issue after upgrading to Mac OS 10.6 or 10.7 supports possible OS issues, so if it is confirmed - it dictates the next course of action. Saves people reinstalling a fresh system only to find the same thing happens again as some have already done.

What else do you want/need from us users that might help find the cause?

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LEGEND ,
Mar 20, 2012

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Marian Driscoll & Chris Cox should take the same amount of time they have spent replying to all these posts and DO SOMETHING about this problem.

And what is Marian supposed to do? Have I missed her having become an Adobe employee?

And you seem to have failed to understand what Mr.Cox has graciously taken the time to state – just because you think Adobe is at fault that may not be the case.

That you are having this problem since upgrading the OS might have served as a clue in that regard …

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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LonnieSlowrider wrote:

Marian Driscoll & Chris Cox should take the same amount of time they have spent replying to all these posts and DO SOMETHING about this problem. Instead Ms. Driscoll likes to quote people's posts and make fun of them. I have been having this same problem since I upgraded my OS to 10.7 I hate this error! I run into it 10-20 times a day. It is up to Adobe to fix this problem! Do something please. I am not running a font suitcase or dropbox. FIX THIS!

And now here I am making fun of your silliness for failing to fully read and comprehend this discussion and the many other discussions that have appeared on this forum regarding OS X's silly way of meddling with files.

How is it that you did not encounter this error prior to 10.7? Why is it that others experienced it on earlier systems? Is this because Chris and others are entirely correct in saying that the problem involves unique settings to your system?

Why do you assume it is Adobe's fault now that you have upgraded Apple's software? It is this kind of detachment from reason that makes Adobe's job that much harder in trying to help you troubleshoot your problem.

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LEGEND ,
Mar 20, 2012

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Are you asking the person to process information even if it is at odds with their preconceived notions?

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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Yes. I am the world's biggest fool for assuming that others might think intelligently. 

lizard.jpgAt least in the US, schools no longer teach the scientific method. There's not enough time in the day after teaching about Jesus riding dinosaurs.

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LEGEND ,
Mar 20, 2012

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I have to ask … did you do the montage or are there really publications of that kind somewhere out there?

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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It is not my own work. We US hillbillies sell t-shirts with Jesus riding a T-Rex.

http://www.zazzle.com/jesus+riding+a+dinosaur+tshirts

We even devote entire museums to lunacy:

https://krishashok.wordpress.com/2010/08/18/kentucky-fried-creation/

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Explorer ,
Mar 20, 2012

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I get a similar message, not in Photoshop or in Lion (I'm still on Snow Leopard), but it is entirely Adobe generated, reproducible and may possibly have a related cause, so I'll relate it FWIW.

I get the message (somthing to the effect of 'file has been modified by an external application' etc) in Lightroom after using Photoshop Elements as an external editor to edit the file - in one particular circumstance.

Normally there is no problem, the two programs talk to each other properly and the file is saved in Lightroom OK, with no message.

The problem arises when I quit Photoshop Elements while the photo in question is open and unsaved. I then am prompted to save, which I do, and Elements immediately closes. But apparently there isn't time for it to talk to Lightroom with all the info, and that's when I get the message when I return to LR. I usually accept the changed file if I can decipher which version the one I was just editing was.

I have a relatively old computer (2006 iMac) and wouldn't be surprised if the speed of writing to disk had something to do with this, so am not looking for a solution or "helpful advice" for my problem here! I'm just chipping in in case other people may be using Lightroom or hitting close/quit then save.

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Engaged ,
Mar 20, 2012

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I can recreate the problem if I alter the metadata in Bridge, for example "starring" an image, but I wouldn't consider this a problem, it's doing what it should be doing.

for those people that see this problem often and it's a problem, can you simply "save as" the file that you have open in PS and then inspect both files? other than the obvious changes to the modification dates/time, image changes etc, wouldn't this point you in a direction to see what has changed?

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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The file change can be as subtle as a preview icon being added in Finder.

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New Here ,
Mar 20, 2012

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That's exactly the problem. It's routine, innocuous stuff like that that is 'at fault.' the kind of stuff that scores of good software developers have been able to work around. The kind of stuff that keeps track of your backups and shows you a current snapshot of your work, the kind of stuff that actually enhances a user's experience.

Heaven forbid you would try to use Photoshop in a professional setting where you have to share files with other people... If they look at a folder containing a file you have open, Finder touches the file to generate a preview and you get that error. There still exists no stable solution for users sharing files. Adobe abandoned their pathetic excuse of a solution known as Version Cue, so now their support is laughably non-existent.

Personally, I'm going to have my retouching staff experiment with different file formats-- tiff has numerous advantages over PSD-- perhaps it will yield fewer errors. Anyone gone down that road?

//iPhone

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Engaged ,
Mar 20, 2012

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>The file change can be as subtle as a preview icon being added in Finder.

I understand, but why not rule out what they can, if we make too many assumptions we will only know, what we already know.... back to your original request for scientific method of observation. The following is likely to be flawed and not capture all possibilities but it's an attempt.

1. create 2 identical PSD files

2. work on the original

3. if you haven't saved the file since you have created the duplicate file and you get a "file has changed..." message, do a "save-as".

this should yield 3 files, your original, the duplicate and the save-as version.... compare everything

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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james_mckenzie wrote:

That's exactly the problem. It's routine, innocuous stuff like that that is 'at fault.' the kind of stuff that scores of good software developers have been able to work around...

Adobe did demonstrate the ability to work around this in regards to Windows when they stopped shipping the DLL that handled PSD previews in Explorer. This happened several versions back. While there were different reasons involved, it illustrates a difference in how Explorer and Finder handle image previews within the OS. It is not so easy to tell Finder to stop making previews. People like to see those icons.

And to further critique Apple's Finder nonsense... Check out this illustration of the Finder going wonky with filesizes. There is only so much a developer can work around.

http://forums.adobe.com/message/3638147#3638147

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New Here ,
Mar 20, 2012

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We actually do agree on something-- people do like those icons. They're a crucial part of a good user experience. But I think your approach is all wrong-- which is exactly what I've been trying to illustrate. The answer is not to have photoshop prevent Finder from making previews-- that's a lose/lose. The answer is to accept the fact that other programs, in fact core services WILL touch those files. And move FORWARD. Good developers will adapt to that. Adobe's monopoly in this market has made them somewhat big and lazy, and it's turning them into bad software developers.

//iPhone

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Explorer ,
Mar 20, 2012

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Personally, I'm going to have my retouching staff experiment with different file formats-- tiff has numerous advantages over PSD-- perhaps it will yield fewer errors. Anyone gone down that road?

I have gotten the error with tifs, psds and psbs. File type doesn't make a difference for me.

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Valorous Hero ,
Mar 20, 2012

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james_mckenzie wrote:

...The answer is to accept the fact that other programs, in fact core services WILL touch those files. And move FORWARD....

There is the engineering problem. We pass graphics files between multiple programs. A PSD file will be linked and updated through integration with InDesign... or Illustrator... or After Effects. A PSD file will be linked and updated as a smart object even within Photoshop. We absolutely need these checks to alert us when a linked file has been changed. So it is an engineering problem to turn off (or develop some workaround to) this alert prompt. The prompt is useful. The choice in the one platform that is affected by this may not be so useful.

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LEGEND ,
Mar 20, 2012

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Who deemed it okay for an operating system to modify a user's files?

I was in a discussion just the other day about how Windows now feels it's okay to delete icons off the user's desktop if it feels they're broken.  Trouble is, broken right now, at this moment, doesn't equal not broken when the laptop was plugged-into the corporate net, or whatever.

It's just the next step toward us becoming slaves to computers.

-Noel

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New Here ,
Mar 20, 2012

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The OS has no business interfering with content.  If that's what's happening that'd be pretty disappointing, but somehow it doesn't surprise me.  With this love on the market has for apple they probably think they can't do any wrong. Still, users shouldn't be expected to have to figure this out, how hard can this be to solve?

Dave

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New Here ,
Mar 21, 2012

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I'd have to agree with you there. If the MacOS is modifying files for whatever purposes that's causing a change to the actual file - then really the MacOS needs to be functioning impartially towards files with the creation of any data associated to the file, not embedding it. In which case that would be one explanation as to why Photoshop gives the warning that the file has been modified. And rightfully so.

Chris - in the testing you mentioned (post 176) are you able to isolate that as a possible cause? If so, we are in a position to present fact to Apple so they can look at alternative methods in terms of how files are managed within the OS.

As a flip side to that - Marian's Link in post 189 would suggest that the OS lies about document size values in which case the actual file is supposedly not modified (at least that's how I read it). Is it possible that Photoshop is currently picking upon MacOS finder data that can essentially be ignored so as to give a true representation of the file size and creation date?

One thing I'd say about your post Marian is that the way it was presented suggested that the Finder is somewhat 'random' in what if does and does not add file size to. sometimes it behaves, some times it doesn't. That being the case it may explain why some users get the error and others don't (for whatever reason that might be??!!). Just a theory though. we need facts really to be able to move forward on this issue. Chis, can you help please?

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Mar 21, 2012

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We haven't seen MacOS change the dates on files -- but then we haven't reproduced the problem ourselves without the presence of third party software causing the changes.

We suspect that some configuration of the OS might do that, but we haven't seen it.

Photoshop doesn't read Finder data, but calls the lower level file access APIs to get file information.  If those aren't correct then something is really, really busted.

Yes, if there was something that triggers the OS to get out of sync on file information - that could possibly explain the problem. We do know that MacOS 10.6 and above have problems with inode structure management that leads to disk corruption and crashing on some systems (usually fixed with Disk Utility) -- but we don't know the full details, so can't tie that directly to this.

Really, we need a reproduceable case to figure out what's going on.

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