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Jerky panning after rendering.

Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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I am using APE15. I have a fairly good cam, a Panasonic AG-AC30. I record in MP4 1920 x 1080 at 50 fps. Bitrate is 49790kbps. Playing the MP4 on my PC seems to be fine. There is a very slight stuttering on panning but this I believe to be normal, the faster the pan, the worse stutter, but perfectly watchable.

After I have completed editing I render and save to MP4 H264 1920 x 1080 25fps bitrate 15Mbps. Playing the resulting video either on monitor or TV, there is a very uncomfortable chopping on horizontal and vertical pans and zooms. The faster the pan or zoom, the worse it gets. Unlike the original MP4, the stutter is unacceptable. It is as if several frames are being dropped every second.

Am I doing something wrong? I have never noticed this on previous cams but I'm sure it is not the cam because the original files play OK. I wondered if it was something to do with the 50fps recording versus the 25fps render but not sure. Is it the recording settings at fault, or the APE settings? The recording cannot be repeated so I hope there is something that can be done between capture and render.

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Jerky panning after rendering.

Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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I am using APE15. I have a fairly good cam, a Panasonic AG-AC30. I record in MP4 1920 x 1080 at 50 fps. Bitrate is 49790kbps. Playing the MP4 on my PC seems to be fine. There is a very slight stuttering on panning but this I believe to be normal, the faster the pan, the worse stutter, but perfectly watchable.

After I have completed editing I render and save to MP4 H264 1920 x 1080 25fps bitrate 15Mbps. Playing the resulting video either on monitor or TV, there is a very uncomfortable chopping on horizontal and vertical pans and zooms. The faster the pan or zoom, the worse it gets. Unlike the original MP4, the stutter is unacceptable. It is as if several frames are being dropped every second.

Am I doing something wrong? I have never noticed this on previous cams but I'm sure it is not the cam because the original files play OK. I wondered if it was something to do with the 50fps recording versus the 25fps render but not sure. Is it the recording settings at fault, or the APE settings? The recording cannot be repeated so I hope there is something that can be done between capture and render.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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If you look under the Edit menu in Premiere Elements, what is listed on the General page under Project Settings?

Also, are you shooting your video in 50i (interlaced frames) or 50p (progressive frames)? It makes a HUGE difference.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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Capture.JPG

Just checked the cam and I am shooting in 50.00p.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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Everything is set up as it should be.

You are, as you know, down-stepping from 50 fps to 25 fps, so action and movement won't be as smooth in your output as it is in your original video. But that's the nature of down-stepping.

You can create a custom 50 fps output and see if it makes a difference.

Under Export & Share/Devices go to the Custom tab and click Advanced Settings. In the Export Settings panel that opens, select Quicktime as the Format and, on the Video tab, click the Match Source button. This should create a preset that is 1920x1080 with a Frame Rate of 50 and a Progressive field order. Click OK and name the preset for future use.

I also recommend you play back your videos on the excellent VLC Media Player rather than the meh Windows Media Player. It will give you much smoother playback.

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Jul 26, 2018 1
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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I have a Panasonic camcorder that shoots 1080p60.  With stabilization on, it tries hard to make my camera movements steady.  And that includes pans.  In other words, with me panning and the stabilization on the clip will be jerky every time.  There is a setting to reduce the horizontal stabilization to improve panning.  It works best having it off if I have to pan a shot.

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Jul 26, 2018 1
Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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I understand your suggestion but if this was the case, the original MP4 would be jerky which it is not. Well just a little bit but not a problem for viewing. The problem develops after the file has gone through APE. I am about to try Steve's suggestion above. I did wonder if there was a problem going from 50fps to 25fps. I will see what the output in Quicktime is like. In the future I may try setting the cam to 1080p25 but it seems a shame. It's a pity there is no MP4 50fps output.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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sydhsydh  wrote

It's a pity there is no MP4 50fps output.

There is a MP4 50fps output.  Steve's "Match Source" will get you there.  Once you have used Match Source you get a preset for future use.  You can also get to 50fps manually. 

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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Steve - just tried your suggestion but I received this:

Capture.JPG

I tried DV50PAL and NTSC 24p. What codec should be set?

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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For the Quicktime codec, select H.264.

Although this will produce an MOV file, it will actually be an MP4. Or Quicktime's version.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 26, 2018

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Hi Steve. When Quicktime is selected, I do not have an H264 option, only those I tried and DV options and uncompressed options.

I have found that staying in H264 and then Match Source will change the output to 50fps. I am running this as we speak but it will take around 3 hours. (It is 2hr 25 min video). I will let you know the outcome. Thanks for your assistance. (I'll be back).

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 26, 2018

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You are correct. I'm sorry. This option is not available under  Quicktime settings in version 15.

I'm not sure what to recommend instead.

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Jul 26, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 27, 2018

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Here is a clip of the problem. I tried selecting H264 and then Match Source. This output in 50fps but the resolution was terrible. Very pixelly with blurred motion.

Any more ideas anyone? It has to be something in APE causing this as the original footage is fine.

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Jul 27, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 28, 2018

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I did wonder if there was a problem going from 50fps to 25fps

That is for sure and the fact that the panning is way too fast.

Best is to leave everything 50p don't downgrade the framerate to 25.

Next time when moving fast try to film at an angle of 135 degrees. Subject moving away from you tend to have less motion issues.

Also when making a pan or tilt do it very very slow.

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Jul 28, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 28, 2018

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Can you upload this clip so I can see if any can be done to it.

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Jul 28, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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It is attached to a previous post. Thanks.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 29, 2018

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I mean the original clip.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Anne. That all makes sense even though not always possible. Will certainly keep that in mind in the future.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 29, 2018

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I mean uploading the original/raw clip to say dropbox for me to download.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Understood. Here it is. Got a feeling the problem may lie with frame rates.

NIK_2424.MOV - Google Drive

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Yes it is a framerate "issue"

The clip is 29.97 (30p) and not 50p.

In your first post you mentioned a mp4 but this clip is a mov.

Looking at the codec: Nokia?

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Bad choice of clip. That is from a Nikon DSLR which has little choice of formats. However this has made me check through all the cameras I was using in Europe. Panasonic AG-AC3, Nikon DSLR, Sony compact and even Samsung S6 phone. Most clips are OK even from the other cams but the one I am most concerned with for the future is the Panny being the main videocam. The jerky footage is not as bad from the Panny so I am assuming it was as you suggested, panning too fast for the angle, certainly in this case for 30fps. As for the jerky clips with the Panny at 50fps, I thought fast panning would have been OK. I can understand it with the lesser cams but not with the Panny.

Thanks for your assistance and I shall take on board your suggestions. I don't like panning anyway but when it is the cam that is moving there is no way to avoid it other than using the angle you suggest.

I asked another question in another thread - MP4 or AVCHD? Would you also use MP4 with the higher Bit rate?

Capture.JPG

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Nope I would stick to avchd.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Community Beginner ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Why? Then I will leave you in peace

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy smartphone.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Ann Bens LATEST
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 29, 2018

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Maybe you are right by choosing mp4.

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Jul 29, 2018 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 27, 2018

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Yes, I'm definitely seeing it in your video, syd. I just don't know what to recommend.

However, you may want to post at the free Community Forum at my web site Muvipix.com. There's a worldwide community of very knowledgeable photographers and videomakers there, and I'm sure they will have some good ideas.

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Jul 27, 2018 0