P: Frame substitution attempt aborting error - .MXF Files

[Anthony LV]

UPDATE 8-30-24:  

We have released an update in beta that is a potential fix for these frame recursion errors.  

Please download 25 beta and see if that helps your issue?   

You can find Premiere Pro version 25 beta in the creative cloud desktop app in the sidebar under beta apps.  Thank You!

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I've seen a number of posts about this, and am now running into the problem myself. Although there are a few differences I'd like to share that I'm hoping may shed more light on what appears to be a longstanding issue.

Specs: M3 Max Macbook Pro (64GB RAM), Sonoma 14.3.1, Premiere Pro 24.1.0

The .MXF files were shot XAVC-I from the Sony FX6 shot on a V90 card. I copied the entire memory card structure to my internal drive, and imported the clips using the media browser. The clips are 59.94 fps and 23.976 fps on a 23.976 timeline.

As I perform regular editing tasks (slowing 59.94 clips to 40%, adding clips to timeline, scrolling through), I get these error messages.

BUT, here's the kicker: I'm not actually seeing dropped frames yet. For one of the clips I received the error on, I decided to go to the source window and scroll through frame by frame. I didn't see any black frames, but scrolling through did create 9 new error messages at different frames.

Aside from the error popups being annoying, this is a project that many people are depending on. If these dropped frames actually do end up showing, I'll be in a bad spot. It seems as though with every new project, I have to factor in at least a day to deal with errors or bugs in Premiere. I shouldn't have to be constantly fighting with the tools that allow me to do my job. Moreover, the C70 and FX6 both shoot in .MXF and are fixtures of video production. Frankly, I'm taken aback that there hasn't been more meaningful support from Adobe on this.

I'm currently creating ProRes Proxies to see if that may solve the issue, but I'm concerned that this will only solve the problem in editing, and the error (dropped frames) may show up once exported.

Does anyone have thoughts on why this may be happening? Is it time to switch to Resolve like everyone seems to be saying, or could this be a workflow issue on my end?

Many thanks!

[Justin Opinion]

I have also been having this problem for some time - maybe since two updates ago. Now, with the latest update 24.4.1 the MXF files are completely black, as if there is no support for them at all. Adobe is literally killing my ability to work and meet deadlines. Might be time to jump off this sinking ship.

[Justin Opinion]

Premiere Pro was just updated to 24.4.1 and now I cannot work at all due to the horrific performance with MXF files from Sony. Performance got worse when version 24 came along, but now it is unusable. I literally cannot produce any work and am at a standstill. This is on Windows platform. 

[Terry37641153sxh2]

The issue I get with MXF files is PP quits unexpectely, no warning or error - program just closes. When I reboot I get the option of recovering session. I edited the same camera footage 2 weeks ago without issues. It auto updated to 24.4.1 yesterday and now this issue. 

Solution is to save every 5 seconds so when it crashes you only lose 5 seconds of work! Second solution is to activate my free Resolve license which came with my camera. Have been too stubborn to jump ship since I've been on PP for 20yrs. This issue is the final straw! 

[Averdahl]

The issue I get with MXF files is PP quits unexpectely, no warning or error - program just closes. When I reboot I get the option of recovering session. I edited the same camera footage 2 weeks ago without issues. It auto updated to 24.4.1 yesterday and now this issue. 

By @Terry37641153sxh2 

Yes, i got the very same problem yesterday. I am back on 24.3 yet again...

[telecam2]

[telecam2]

Getting tons of "Frame Substitution Recursion Attempt..." errors, black video on many clips in bin on a project that was working fine and smoothly under previous versions.  Media is mainly 4K UHD 29.97P Sony AVC-L codec from Sony FX6 and FX9 cameras.  Reverting to previous version.

[Christiaan1]

Same with me

[Christiaan1]

Besides that, footage that I use the Warp stabilizer on, can start to lose color detail like it is less colors or something.
Gradients start to become banding with warp stabiliser i think.

Does this also have to do with this bug?

[Christiaan1]

I just wanted to let you know. They are working on a fix.
I have sent original Sony footage file to the team because they asked me.

[Christiaan1]

Sure. Done. I have sent two video files.

[Flix_799]

Same with me

[telecam2]

That is where I am now. My project was unusable under 24.4.1 🥴

[jamieclarke]

Hi Telecam - I'm sorry your having issues with these MXF files.  Are you using markers in your workflow by chance?

[jamieclarke]

Hi default57aj5n25tml2 - What camera are you using?  What type of MXF files are you working with?

[markh19434597]

I'm experiencing exactly the same problems running Premiere Pro 2024 - currently upgraded it to 24.4.1 in the hopes it would fix it, but it hasn't. I've shot a multi-camera shoot on Canon cameras all shooting MXF. Multiple dropped frames during import. The only way of playing the footage on the timeline without Premiere grinding to a halt is to make Proxie files. But then exporting the video takes 5 times longer and the video glitches and pulses on playback. Reverting back to a previous version of Premiere isn't doable without starting the whole project again from scratch, as I can't open this file in an older version. Which probably means I have to start the whole thing again, which is hugely frustrating as I'm 3 days into the edit. I don't understand how a new version plays these files worse than older versions of the programme. Especially as the newer version claims to have a 'faster timeline.' This current version is totally broken in it's present state.

[telecam2]

Very rarely. There may be one or two in my timeline or one of the hundreds of clouds in the project. Troubling also is that many clips in my bins are showing black and that everything loads super sluggish.  Project unusable under 24.4.1, works great under previous version. 

[Averdahl]

Reverting back to a previous version of Premiere isn't doable without starting the whole project again from scratch, as I can't open this file in an older version.

By @markh19434597 

I could open projects created in version 24.4/24.4.1 without problems in version 24.3. If you go back to version 23.x it won´t be possible.

[markh19434597]

Thank you. I've literally just installed Premiere Pro Beta and it's fixed all the issues. MXF footage plays and exports perfectly! Such a relief! Hope Adobe keep this version active!

[jamieclarke]

Thank you for the info telecam can you try going to Preferences > Media < and uncheck the box "enable hardware accelerated decoding".  Then restart your project and see if that helps.

[Justin Opinion]

Likewise, I tried PP Beta and it appears to have resolved the issues with the MXF files. I have been able to work in the existing project smoothly. I have not yet tried an export but am hopeful. 

[jamieclarke]

Can you try deleting your media cache.  If you hold down shift key while launching premiere you should get the option.  

[HealthFirst]

I am also having the same issue. I just downgraded to v 24.41, I was in 24.4. A project that I have been working on with minimal issues, started having major issues reading a 4K clip. It stopped reading the 4k clip altogether. 

File Path: C:\Users\DA395670\Desktop\Projects\05_14_2024 Terry Forde\A012C002_240514FS_H1STH.MXF
Type: MXF
File Size: 31.12 GB
Image Size: 3840 x 2160
Frame Rate: 29.97
Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 24-bit - 4 Channels
Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - 4 Channels
Total Duration: 00;28;34;22
Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.0
Alpha: None
Color Space: Rec. 709
Color Space Override: Off
Input LUT: None

MXF File details:
Wrapper type: MXF OP1a (type: SingleItem SinglePackage MultiTrack Stream Internal)
File generated by: CANON, XA40 (1.00)
H.264/MPEG-4 AVC Long GOP High Profile 4:2:0 Unconstrained Coding

The clip was in a 1080HD sequence sca;e at 60%. Static shot as B cam on an interview. I have previous not had issues with 4K on this system: 
Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-9850H CPU @ 2.60GHz 2.59 GHz
Installed RAM 32.0 GB (31.8 GB usable)
Device ID 6989CD21-A6FB-46DF-AADB-6FD9FC58C116
Product ID 00329-00000-00003-AA803
System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor
Pen and touch No pen or touch input is available for this display

No issues with my A cam:

Type: MPEG Movie
File Size: 3.89 GB
Image Size: 1920 x 1080
Frame Rate: 29.97
Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - Compressed - Stereo
Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - Stereo
Total Duration: 00:23:16:00
Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.0
Alpha: None
Color Space: Rec. 709
Color Space Override: Off
Input LUT: None
Video Codec Type: AVCHD H.264 4:2:0

I know the system is underpowered, but this is what I have to work with. And they want me to be at the most current upgrade because of security issues.

Thanks

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hello @telecam2,

Thanks for the bug report. Please respond to @jamieclarke's post for further help on this issue. I hope we can help you solve this problem ASAP.

Thanks.
Kevin

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi @HealthFirst,

Thank you for the response. Have you tried deleting the media cache, as @jamieclarke suggested?

Cheers,
Kevin

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hello @Justin Opinion,

We appreciate your bug report. Have you tried deleting media cache as @jamieclarke suggested? Is there any more info you can provide as outlined in the following post? How do I write a bug report? Please let us know.

Cheers,
Kevin