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Best Possible Quality [iPhone 7 Plus using Filmic Pro]

Explorer ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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I'm shooting some video in Portland today and I'm looking for the BEST possible quality.

I plan on shooting with my iPhone 7 Plus using Filmic Pro. I will set the bitrate to the highest setting (for 120fps it's 50mbsp and for 4k it's 100mbps).

Here's my question.

I don't know if I should shoot in 4K today then downsize the files using Handbrake (for a constant frame rate) then edit them in Premiere Pro. Or if I should just shoot in 1080p and then run them through Handbrake (for a constant frame rate) and then edit in PrPro. Or if I should shoot in 4K, run the files through Handbrake (for a constant framerate) and do the downsizing in PrPro.

I just hate working with these files in PrPro because the 4K files are SO FREAKING LAGGY. And even the 1080p files that have been run through Handbrake are laggy and it's very hard to work with them. But if I don't get the constant framerate by utilizing Handbrake first, then the video comes out looking horrid. Maybe my Handbrake settings need a tweak so these files are usable in PrPro.

Also, working with different resolutions in PrPro seems difficult as well. I never know what my sequence settings should be. Match the 1080p files? Match the 4k files? Match the 30fps files? The 120fps files?

Thanks for any help as I head out and start shooting today. I'm thinking of shooting 4K, 30fps, and 1080p, 120fps only today. That way I get the highest quality 4K files and can figure out the HB stuff later. The 120fps files can only be shot in 1080p on my phone anyway.

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Adobe Employee ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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If you want "best possible quality" then you need to shoot with something besides an IPhone. No matter how much the processing power increases, quality will always be limited by a tiny phone lens which won't let much light in and is nearly impossible to keep very clean. If you don't have access to a real video device and if you don't mind the quality limitation of your phone, then I say just make it easier on yourself and shoot at 1080p.

Or if you do decide to shoot 4k and then edit it in PrPro, you should consider using a proxy workflow to boost performance.

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Explorer ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Thank you for attempting to reply. I suppose I should have been more clear.  I have other video equipment. But the point of my shoot today is to get the most that I can get out of my iPhone. I want to see what it is capable of.

So I wanted to see if it was better to scale to 1080p in Handbrake or to scale it down in PrPro.

I also asked about a way to make PrPro perform better. It can't even handle 1080p files without a bunch of lag.  I have a $3000 PC with plenty of processing power.  I used to use Sony Vegas ( until they changed hands)  and had no problems with any lag on this computer with the same types of files.  I have recently switched over to the Adobe Cloud platform and I've had nothing but trouble with Premier Pro.  Lag lag lag.  Doesn't seem to matter what my project is.

I asked these questions because I'm not an expert and I want to squeeze the most performance that I can out of my iPhone today.

Thanks again.

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LEGEND ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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So I wanted to see if it was better to scale to 1080p in Handbrake or to scale it down in PrPro.

Why not do a test of your intended workflow?

It can't even handle 1080p files without a bunch of lag.

If your system cant even handle 1080p its kind of academic whatever you do IMHO

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Explorer ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Sure, I could test everything. Or somebody could help me who has more experience in this area. That is the point, after all, of forums.

Your second answer is just plain rude, but maybe that's the type of person you are.  As I said before, my system can handle the files. The problem is with Premiere. 

And now I can predict your next rude answer.  Here it is. Well, why not use a different NLE?  And, as I've said before, I bought into the Adobe cloud system, so I want to be able to use the video editing program that I have paid for. It's supposed to be the best.

So the reason I asked my questions in this forum was because I hoped to find someone that was helpful. Instead, I found you.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Just curious:

What are your computer specs?

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LEGEND ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Rude...Not intended. You got 2 simple straight forward answers.

The problem is with Premiere.

My old system works absolutely fine with 1080p   and Premiere and it does so for thousands of editors.

Yours  doesnt by your own admission yet you blame Premiere! SO maybe its not set up right.

Then you ask others what the best way to edit your iphone footage on a system that cant handle basic 1080p

Not sure how anyone can answer on  that basis ....and you are too lazy too test it and too unprofessional to go out shooting mixed sources untested and with out a post prod plan in place.

Good luck with that.

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Explorer ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Of course it's rude when I ask a question and instead I get, "Why not do a test?" and "If your system can't handle 1080p, then it's kind of academic." How are those two answers helpful to my original question at all? And how are they polite?

As I said before, I have a very nice computer system with a nice graphics card. But you ignored that point and just mocked my equipment. My mom's $800 Dell can easily edit 1080p files. And you also ignored another point I made. I've used Sony Vegas for the past few years and it easily edited 1080p files with never any lagging or strange playback problems. So obviously my computer can handle 1080p files. You say, "Yours doesn't by your own admisssion . . ." I did not admit that; I said quite the opposite. If other programs on my computer can handle 1080p files (which all of them can except for Premiere), then isn't it logical to assume the problem is with Premiere?

And then isn't it also logical to ask questions of a community of experts when I'm not sure of the answer? I think that's logical. I thought perhaps someone would just know whether or not it's better to resize in the NLE or in Handbrake. Maybe nobody knows that and I need to test it. If so, that's not a problem. That's what I'll do.

To call me lazy when you don't know me is another fine example of rudeness and also ignorance (of me). To call me unprofessional when it comes to video editing is definitely true because I'm a high school teacher - not a video expert; and again, it's another fine example of rudeness.

I doubt most people like me make a "prod plan." We just pull out our equipment, try making videos and try learning by joining forums and reading articles. I enjoy making videos in my spare time though, in between being a husband, father and teacher. I'm actually pretty good at it but sometimes I still have questions.

I'm good with WordPress. People ask me all the time how to do things in WordPress. If I know the answer, I tell them. I don't say, "Go play around with all the buttons until you figure it out." I just tell them what I know. After all, that's being helpful. It saves them time and helps me continue learning and staying current.

The only thing you said that is kind of helpful to me is "maybe it's not set up right." My guess is that's the case. So if that's the case, I don't know how to set it up right because I've done a lot of reading about sequence settings, export settings, pre-rendering, etc. I've done plenty of homework on it (again, not lazy). It's just that Premiere is a complicated program and it's not working as smoothly as what I'm used to with Vegas and I've done a lot of reading and I'm frustrated with it. So I asked for help.

And to Jim_Simon, when you say that "I want the best possible quality" and "I'm shooting with my iPhone" are mutually exclusive statements, I suppose if you're being technical, you're right. But I also clearly stated that I'm shooting with my iPhone. I also gave some ideas I had and asked if anyone knew which of those ideas was the best. Then I said in a later post (to clarify), that I have other video equipment, but I was trying to figure out how to get the best possible quality out of my iPhone.

And to Peru Bob, my system is not the newest, but it's a nice powerhouse. Here are the specs:

CPU - i7 quad core 3200MHz,

RAM - 12GB

GTX 285

It's a custom built system. It's very lean, clean and has been well-maintained with high quality parts, including SSD hard drives.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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CPU - i7 quad core 3200MHz,

RAM - 12GB

GTX 285

No wonder its is not smooth, you dont have any MPE hardware as the gtx285 is obsolete according to Adobe.

That makes editing with Premiere very painful.

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Explorer ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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OK then maybe I should upgrade to a new video card. The GTX285 is not new by any means but I have no problems with other software working with these same files. I'm currently using 4K files in my project, converted in Handbrake to CFR, and I've changed the preview codec. I just tried a bunch of different ones until I got it to play more smoothly. Not sure if that's a mistake or not but it seems to be working.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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You have to forget about other software. You are using Premiere now and that is a whole different ballgame.

Your machine cannot handle 4K. You even say 1080p is laggy.

You will have to go the proxy way as already mentioned if you want to get some pleasure out of your work.

Either get a real camera as James suggested (which I second) or get a new machine.

Because if you insist to follow this route you will soon hate it.

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Explorer ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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But the thing is my machine can handle it and has handled it. I have edited and exported lots of 1080p footage from my 70D (in Premiere) and it's very smooth as I'm editing. It's just these Handbrake files from my iPhone. Maybe I'm doing Handbrake wrong, but I don't think so.

Anyway, Premiere is, in fact, working right now on my 4K files from today albeit not perfectly. Having changed the preview files things are much improved although definitely not perfect. I'm working on figuring out the proxy thing as it sounds like that's what i need to do.

As far as the "real" camera, as I said earlier in the thread, I have one. I just wanted to see what my phone is capable of. And I want to show people what the iPhone can do. It has produced incredible results in the hands of folks who know what they're doing. Obviously I'm not one of those. Yet. I'll post my result when I'm done with it. I don't expect it will be anything award-winning.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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Adding more RAM may help, too.

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Community Beginner ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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Yeah, it may be time for a mobo+cpu+ram+video upgrade (a new system)... that i7-960 is coming up on 7 years old. I'd recommend a current-gen i7, 32 or 64GB, and a 1060, 1070 or 1080.

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Explorer ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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Well, maybe my computer's not as "up to par" as I thought it was. I know it's a few years old, but when I bought it, it was state-of-the-art and top of the line. The GTX285 was the fastest single card on the market at the time . . . I guess time has gotten away from me.

I wonder if getting a new video card would be the best single upgrade if I was unable to get a new system at this time.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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I have a simular system with a gtx285.

Died on me few months ago.

Got a second hand 480; up and running again.

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Community Expert ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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>you dont have any MPE hardware as the gtx285 is obsolete according to Adobe

I had a GTX285 in my previous computer PNY GeForce GTX 285 DirectX 10 VCGGTX285XPB 1GB 512-Bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Sup... and it worked just fine with MPE hardware... I can't remember if it was already in the supported cards text file or if I had to add it, but it did work

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Community Expert ,
Nov 13, 2016 Nov 13, 2016

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Why are you posting stuff about the 285. It does not work with Premiere 2015.3 and above. .

it lacks certain architecture: its obsolete.

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Explorer ,
Nov 15, 2016 Nov 15, 2016

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thanks Everyone. The help has been much appreciated. I will be updating my RAM (12 GB more) and my video card. Thinking about the 1080.

As promised, here's a link to my finished video. As I said before, it's not a masterpiece, but it was a fun project. I took a walk on Veteran's Day around downtown Portland and captured what I could with my iPhone 7. I'm no expert, but with each little project I take on, I learn a little more.

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New Here ,
Dec 29, 2016 Dec 29, 2016

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Nice looking video

So what was your workflow that produced this video?

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Explorer ,
Dec 29, 2016 Dec 29, 2016

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LATEST

Hi, let's see if I can remember . . .

I used the iPhone 7 Plus and the DJI Osmo Mobile. I recorded the entire video with the 2x lens (no optical image stabilization) on the iPhone 7 Plus to eliminate the juddering effect (the 28mm lens with the optical image stabilization, when used in the conjunction with the DJI Osmo Mobile, produces a yucky juddering effect on some footage).

I recorded all the clips in 4K at 30fps. I recorded all the clips with FiLMiC Pro at 100mbps. I meant to save them all to the FiLMiC library instead of to the camera roll, but somehow that setting changed while I was out in the field. Not sure how. I have heard that not allowing the videos to be saved to the camera roll eliminates a possible compression. I'm not sure if that's true or not. But in any case, I didn't manage to accomplish that.

I edited in Premiere Pro. My project settings matched the clip size. I had to change my preview settings to VERY low to even be able to edit in real-time. And it was still difficult to edit. I had to pre-render the clips every time I made any sort of change (stabilizing, changing color, splitting clips - anything)! It took forever. I need a new computer.

I exported to 1080p using h.264. I can't remember all the settings but I know I used 2-pass and set everything to the highest level possible. It took FOREVER to render but I was pretty happy with the results.

Hope that helps. Thanks for the kind words!

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Adobe Employee ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Eric English wrote:

I also asked about a way to make PrPro perform better.

I asked these questions because I'm not an expert and I want to squeeze the most performance that I can out of my iPhone today.

Thanks again.

Try the proxy workflow, starting with the helpx article link I shared above.

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Adobe Employee ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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I would concur with James, SLC Eric. Use the proxy workflow.

I recently shot a ton of 4K video using and iPhone 6s Plus with Filmic Pro on a trip to Europe with good success. The only difference is that I shot 30fps. As soon as I got home, I ingested the footage to get proxies. I edited with the proxies and then reconnected for a HEVC 4K output. Worked great! You shouldn't have any stuttering with your proxies. Just be sure to choose a proxy preset that is an editing codec, not something like H.264.

I didn't do any downscaling whatsoever. Filmic Pro allows you to shoot without A/V sync issues so I would not bother transcoding to Handbrake or any other format. Edit with the proxies instead.

Thanks,
Kevin

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Explorer ,
Nov 11, 2016 Nov 11, 2016

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Hi Everyone.

Thanks for the help Kevin, James. I really appreciate it. I will attempt to figure out the proxy workflow. I don't really understand it. I've gone through the article and for a hobbyist like me it's pretty technical to figure out. I will keep plugging away at it, reading, and see if I can figure it out.

One thing I definitely don't understand is that I shot some video in Filmic Pro not long ago and edited it in Premiere (just put up with the lag but got it done) then exported it and it came out really choppy at the end. Another person told me (reference this thread here: How to Export a Mix of Footage ) that iPhone files (even Filmic files) are VFR (variable frame rate) which don't play well in PrPro. I used Handbrake to convert the files to CFR (constant frame rate) and lo and behold the video wasn't choppy when I exported it. So . . . in that sense it was very helpful. Maybe it was because I had a mix of footage (from the DSLR and the phone). For this project I have all 30p 4K files (that's all I shot today). But I always hate to use a program like Handbrake as it degrades the files at least somewhat (right?)

Thanks for your help. I'll do some testing with these ideas.

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Mentor ,
Nov 12, 2016 Nov 12, 2016

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i found the really good post about filmic pro users here

Setting constant frame rate in Filmic Pro

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