Moving to Premier Pro from Davinci

[Wonderlawn]

Hi guys, I'm mainly a Davinci/Vegas user for work. I'd like to move to Premier Pro as I believe it will give me better results when exporting etc.

How different is the workflow from the programs I'm used to to Premier?

Am I starting from scratch, or are there some transferable skills I can use?

[Carlos Ziade]

I can say the basics are the same in between Resolve and Premiere Pro, concerning Vegas I have no idea of that one.

Timeline, project bins, editing tools, how to import and export are a lot identical, some few things differ concerning basic stuff...

When you go for color grading. Lumetri and Davinci Resolve start to look different, where one is node based while the other

works on layers and clips ...

But mainly, it won't be that big issue for you to move to Premiere Pro.... Welcome !

[jasontcox]

Honestly, that's a challenging question to answer as a lot depends on your skill level and comfort in what you were using and your comfort with change. No two video editing applications are the same, but at the same time, there is SOME overlap in all of them. The basic mechanics rarely change. But yes, many keyboard shortcuts are different. Setting up a project and sequence are different. Some terminology is different. Menus are in different places. But the idea of setting in and out points on a clip and dragging into a sequence are very similar from program to program. It's the nitty gritty that starts to vary.

Just curious, why do you think Premiere will give you better results when exporting vs Resolve? Both programs are capable of very high quality out puts as well as very file size efficient outputs.

[rodneyb56060189]

Resolve was basically ( according to my limited understanding ) a color grading program that got bought by Black Magic. Since then Black Magic has been turning it into an NLE. According to some news reports there is a push to make it MORE of an NLE with some color grading aspects that have proven desirable to various professionals in the past.

As you know, Resolve has gain, lift, etc. ( and nodes) while PPro, speedgrade, Lumetri, and vegas, has different nomenclature and to some extent different futures. Resolve will be nits while PPro will be IRE, stuff like that.

Black Magic has deep pockets ( there are beta releases available so users can help them iron out problems between the gazillion different computer platforms out there). But they make good cameras for pro use and will probably continue that. Whereas DSLR companies and go pro stuff and iPhone stuff is fascinating, the pro stuff will drive the pro market in the future.

Adobe has ( since the days of losing it's partnership in pro graphics with Apple and Quark Xpress ) been leaning to the hobby horse market share of pie. Simple marketing stuff. Pretty soon Adobe will introduce the VERTICAL FRAME for movie makers, thinking that will attract yet more subscribers who shoot feature films with their iphones.

In all my years working on film sets ( am retired ) I have NEVER seen a pc clone on set. I have NEVER seen Adobe on set.

Macs, and FCP, yes. Resolve, NO...that is post.

That said, if you have the brain power to remember the menu systems and processes of several different NLE's and grading programs, why not just play around with PPro ??

I personally think it's doomed, but I've thought that for about 15 years and it amazingly keeps attracting users ( subscribers now ).

[R Neil Haugen]

I know a number of major colorists, teaching all over the world besides doing major work for b-cast/films. A good number of them have gone from Mac to PC's in the last 18 months, due to Mac being darn slow at releasing upgraded capabilities ... what, five years between new mobo's on a gazillion dollar machine?

So they've got screaming rigs for working Resolve and the several other apps they also need to use (including PrPro) that are often dual-boot Pc/Linux rigs. One particularly is a notorious gear-head, ended up spending what a Mac would have cost but was thrilled that he got a TON more capability.

A few others I know still are with Macs, because well ... they've been on Macs since middle school. But when the head of the company says "I truly don't know why anyone buys a desktop these days ... " ... well, that ain't good. They'll take your money though. And they've been pushing new OS updates with at times less care on the bug-side than MS. This forum used to be a ton more MS bugs than Macs, and well ... that's at least even if not slightly reversed.

FCPx really broke that hold, when it first came out, a ton of FCP users moved, many to PrPro, some to Avid. Avid is still the big bugger on the block in Hollywood but they've gotten sort of long in the tooth on a number of things and both PrPro and FCPx are getting some traction there. The aisle talks at NAB among editors/video post people on who's grass is greenest are rather fascinating.

You're right on BlackMagic though ... they're a hardware company trying to get people to buy their hardware by producing software that requires their hardware. Got Resolve, wanna do an external box to run monitors? Um ... BM boxes only, note! Being as their profits are built on the hardware sales, the software is just candy to trap a market for hardware. That said, they're trying to run a very interesting trap.

Adobe is a software-only company. So they gotta make their dough only on software. Market share is undoubtedly a higher concern. And they've been actually quite good at keeping their market share moving up. Everything from VR and the YouTube channel folks to some real life Hollywood work. However, a couple major miss-steps, and there's other apps out there gonna want to eat your lunch. It's rather a competitive market.

As to how say Resolve and PrPro run, that's intriguing. For straight and simple editing R can go on a decently small machine, but if you get into the very nice and dense weed patch for color toys ... um, TOOLS! ... lol ... you can suddenly see your computer slog to a near halt. PrPro runs great on some machines, not so good on others, and that can be fun to sort.

The guys from Puget Sound Systems and SafeHarbor computing both say that the choice of mobo is crucial, that most mobo's don't split up the resources to different busses/tracks whatever they call it these days as is needed in video post apps.

For the OP, working in R and PrPro is similar except when it ain't. And really, that's a very informative comment.

PrPro has a much wider & deeper set of presets/effects/functions than Resolve for editing, and is tied into a better fx app than is in Resolve ... or perhaps better stated, a deeper/wider fx app. Audition is a better featured DAW than what's in Resolve.

In color ... yea, I can rag out Lumetri in PrPro. But Resolve is still for many the king of grading apps for most pro work, yea, there's a couple others for "film" guys/gals but realistically Resolve is the major grading app.

For many projects, what's in Resolve for general work is probably good enough. Even for certain workflows, into some major things. As of the two current releases, PrPro is still vastly deeper for editing. For now. And Lumetri is probably easier to learn for many color things than Resolve, even though R has the total tool-set thing locked up.

I think being able to work in both is probably a good thing for longevity of career ...

Neil

[excited_Genie16B8]

PrPro has a much wider & deeper set of...functions than Resolve for editing

I don't think that's true any longer.  15 just went gold.

[R Neil Haugen]

Could be true, Jim.

Neil

[rodneyb56060189]

=========

Everything from VR and the YouTube channel folks to some real life Hollywood work

========

As much as I love you, this is where your logic (rational thought and reality ) falls apart.

This forum (for many years ) has predominantly been trying to prove that the software is up to par with some fiction called " Hollywood". What you mean, specifically, is either

1) TV episodic aired by networks shot in FILM format

or

2) BIG SCREEN theatre release.

That's it. Period.

It's NOT sports, football or any video venue. It's NOT reality TV or Judge Judy or Oprah. Or cooking shows, or documentaries.

It's based on FILM format ( now digital ) and although everyone hates the fact that they never worked on " HOLLYWOOD" productions to make a living ( with health care, pension, etc. ) and sometimes even HATE the fact that they somehow feel like they failed in life because they didn't get to do that ( which is stupid and self defeating ), there's no sense in BLAMING anyone or putting things on a shelf to the extent it makes us blind to what QUALITY IS.  Think of the actors of the past hundred years. Think of those who acted on Broadway AS well as in films. Do you really FAULT that whole talent pool of great individuals just because you didn't work on that stuff ??? That's insane.

REAL LIFE HOLLYWOOD STUFF is NOT some fiction. And it is NOT something to be looked UP to or degenerated based on some personal experience making a living.

Just like YOU can appreciate Bresson's work as a photographer, even if you NEVER shot a photo in your life, you wouldn't DREAM of saying, " photography done by Adobe apps is wonderful even for ( in some cases) FINE ART "

The logic is not there.

Jim Simon, for years, promoted this program on PC like a demon. He wanted to see it become a top notch PRO program for real HOLLYWOOD films. His heart must be broken by now, because we have a melting pot of hobbyists who want to do cat videos and real estate drone footage, and some who really want to push the software further.

I am 67 and I really don't care what happens. I worked on HOLLYWOOD stuff as a worm to get a simple life financed ( free lance) and never ever did editing professionally.

I just wish the rhetoric would get more down to earth and not be so divided re: the value of what people do to be creative.

[rodneyb56060189]

P.S.

I am in touch now with 2 guys who shoot ( DP). One is famous. One worked doing episodic stuff for years on a show YOU and everyone in the world knows.

One uses Resolve ( the episode guy ) for his work ( now retired shooting some log S stuff ).

The other is in the hands of the showrunner and network.

Trust me, Adobe is not in that mix and if they don't get their heads screwed on right they never will be.

[rodneyb56060189]

p.s.

not many know this but you can make an appt. at MOMA to look at the original prints of Bresson and others. You have to wear white cotton gloves and trust you not to hurt the originals.

[R Neil Haugen]

Rodney, for some reason you need to have a point about nothing Adobe being used for serious professional work by anyone ever. Whatever.

Is say PrPro used for the majority of "Hollywood" major film work? Nope ... that seems at this point still primarily Avid. Have some major shows been done on PrPro? Yea. But in general, if you're looking at film studio work, it's still Avid and  couple other at times small-user boutique capability apps. However, PrPro is getting more use each year. Credited. I don't know anyone who says otherwise.

Documentary use ... PrPro has come into more use there also. Is it the "dominant" app there? Oh, no. Still a lot of Avid and again, several other apps. What's the direction? There is more PrPro use.

Trust me, Adobe is not in that mix and if they don't get their heads screwed on right they never will be.

Sorry, but the data doesn't support your comments. You're a couple years older than me. What happened in my 40+ years of pro image career is a massive change. What seemed "stable" for the first twenty started slipping and is now just ... gone. And is completely irrelevant to what is happening now, and how to still make a living at it.

Video production and post have gone through the same process. The multi-hundred-thousand-dollar editing or colorist suites of not more than a decade back are long gone. From so many accounts of those working on major films, parts of their work was done on laptops even. With other parts on hefty rigs running highly specialized fx stuff. Cameras from RED to GoPro. Colorists I know are running "client attended sessions" where the colorist is on the US East Coast, and two clients 'attending' are on different continents. One said essentially that "the only thing still the same is they Fed-exed me a box of drives" ...

Colorists are being involved in more projects from the beginning, testing out camera LUTs to be used for the shoot prior to start of shooting. Well discussed online, talking of the process through from shoot to delivery that they used on X project.

The 'shooting' company may be out of LA, with an editorial staff primarily in London, Fx out of South Africa or Australia or New Zealand, sound done in Germany ... and they were all working on the project at the same time. Heavy use of internet to 'ship' files around.

And some of the biggest viewed material doesn't even come from "major" production companies. Freddy Wong's Rocket Jump is one of them. And if you have a clue what and how ... and how fast those guys/gals work, you know how freaking pro-quality they are. I've watched Wong stun a crowd with his editing moves and the tale of how they produce a weekly 'show'. Where the heck do you put that in terms you and I grew up with? Other than ... certainly profitable.

Adobe is one of several companies producing product that can do the above. And has been used by quite a few productions. But it's a widely competitive market, and anybody screwing up is gonna go down at least a bit. Right now, BM is moving Resolve along very rapidly, and I think Adobe needs to fund PrPro a lot better to match. We'll see what they do.

That said, the PrPro user-base from everything I can see dwarfs everything else. So it's theirs to lose, right?

And naturally, I've had Resolve up on my machine for some time. And some of my projects need to go there, which is fine with me. What works ... well, works.

Neil

[rodneyb56060189]

I am so happy to hear of the recent improvements you've witnessed and experienced with adobe stuff !  How cool is that ? !!

[R Neil Haugen]

Cool, yea ... but they also seem long overdue. Plus & minus all rolled together, which is part & parcel of human endeavors.

Still, I did love the old days. I've often thought if I could snap my fingers and make all digital imaging go away, requiring film again, I'd tick off a LOT of people. Sure wouldn't announce it had been me!

So, you hang on, take what joys you can. BM is really popping stuff into Resolve as a general editing app. How well (and how effectively) will Adobe respond to that? Will be interesting. Avid ... many of the users I've talked with or listened to at NAB say yea, its got a huge took-set and it works but sheesh ... they look at PrPro, Resolve, even FCPx for some of the features there, and go ... when?

It's an unsettled time for many users of the video-post software. And the companies involved perhaps. No clue how this will play out, other than we'll have software to use. I've had to change nearly every software vendor I've ever used over time. I'm still working, some of them are long gone.

Neil

[excited_Genie16B8]

I believe it will give me better results when exporting etc.

I question that idea.  While each program has export options the other doesn't, they do have the majority of options in common.  Additionally, probably the most common export for delivery these days is H.264, and on that front I believe Resolve is the very clear winner on quality.  It's export engine is superior to the MainConcept engine used by Adobe.

[Media Editor]

I do not see any definitive difference in the quality of videos(H.264) created by Resolve or Premiere.  Resolve produces much larger files than Premiere.  Resolve does not have the option to export H.265 as does Premiere. 

[excited_Genie16B8]

For myself, I found the Pixel Peeping quality of Adobe's H.264 options less than satisfactory.  I switched to exporting DI's and using x264 to encode my deliverables, and found noticeable improvement.  That was a while ago.  I haven't tested Adobe's H.264 in a few years.

Using Resolve, I found the High Quality preset nearly indistinguishable from the original and Medium quite sufficient for client delivery.

H.265 would be a good option for C4K/UHD delivery, as I've found that not all devices can read exFAT formatted USB thumb drives, which means I'm limited to FAT32 formatting and 4GB files for client delivery via USB stick.  I'm hoping Resolve will add H.265 in the future.  For now, I still use x265.

[R Neil Haugen]

The Adobe H.264 exports (in my experience) have improved thankfully.

Neil

[excited_Genie16B8]

How different is the workflow from the programs I'm used to to Premier?

There's definitely a leaning curve going either direction.  I recommend anyone using either company's software read the full manuals.  Don't just think you can jump into one because you know the other.

With that said, the most obvious difference is that Resolve can be used to organize, edit, add effects, work on color and mix audio all in one program with very simple, elegant and near flawless switching between tasks, whereas Adobe uses separate programs to accomplish the same work, often with less than perfect results when switching between tasks.

[dutchy_on_a_bike]

If Resolve does what you need then stick with it, unless Premiere has a specific feature you need. I am about to jump from PremPro to Resolve. I have used PremPro for 5 years since I jumped from FCP7. Up until the past 18 months PremPro has been great but somewhere along the way there just seems an awful lot of bugs, on Mac and PC. Most of the bugs do seem to get squashed but for ever bug they fix, new random ones appear. It's quite frustrating, and they take months to fix them, if at all. Just my thoughts. Mark

[Media Editor]

Check out the Davinci Resolve Forum at Black Magic.  Even though Resolve 15 is in Beta 8, users continually report bugs.

[excited_Genie16B8]

Even though Resolve 15 is in Beta 8

It went Gold on Sunday, August 12.

[Media Editor]

Great!!! Out of Beta.  I have now installed Resolve 15 (No Beta).

[R Neil Haugen]

I've been working with the Beta actually, and it worked fine for me. After seeing Jim's comment, did 'up' to the full release.

Neil

[rodneyb56060189]

Jim, what does that mean, " it went gold ," ?

[rodneyb56060189]

oh, how cool !  going gold means it's not in beta anymore !  That was fast …