No audio speed controls!? That's it, I'm quitting Adobe for good.

[warwickj52349404]

How does a "professional" video editing software not have speed controls for audio!?

So many bugs, so many janky half-arsed features, so much headache and so little optimisation on my very expensive computer. I'm done. I'm absolutely without a doubt dumping Adobe for good after I export this next project.

BYE!

[R Neil Haugen]

It seems you have not a lot of knowledge of using the program. There are speed controls available whether audio or video. I run FOUR monitors, and use extensive custom keyboard shortcuts. Warp ... an especially heavy effect for its demands on hardware ... is best used sparingly and then as noted, nested before applying other effects.

I don't see that any of your current complaints actually are valid.

Which is not to say that there aren't a lot of very valid complaints to be made about this or any other program. For certain, there are ... and I've had my share of rants about things here.

Neil

[Warwick5E2C]

If you're genuinely interested in the issues I've described (as well as a few more), feel free to read about them here:

Custom Keyboard shortcuts:
https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-beta-discussions/keyboard-shortcuts-are-disabled-on-seco...

Warp stabilizer w/ proxies:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-discussions/warp-stabilizer-disables-proxies/m-p/8756488

Reverse clip choppy playback:

https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-discussions/premier-pro-cc-reverse-clip-choppy/m-p/65943...

https://community.adobe.com/t5/premiere-pro-discussions/choppy-playback-with-reverse-speed-clip/m-p/...

Audio speed ramping totally absent:

https://adobe-video.uservoice.com/forums/911233-premiere-pro/suggestions/38914384-audio-speed-time-r...

The list goes on and on and on. I don't know how you manage not to tear your hair out. I'm going back to FCP, and long term plan to move to Blackmagic's ecosystem.

[R Neil Haugen]

Yes ... the keyboard shorts issue in the public beta, only with floating panels, that was also listed as having been fixed months ago. I was on that discussion, you might note ...

And Warp with proxies ... rather a minor thing, really. Warp is such an intensive effect, the best use is easily to get the clip "fixed", then do a full Render & Replace operation to get full media in to replace the file and get the Warp outta the project.

There's so many potential issues with 'leaving' a Warp'd clip on a sequence, from any time remapping or significant color corrections. And any further resizing. I simply don't understand leaving a time bomb on your sequence. And ... that is SUCH a heavy effect, that isn't going to become less of a time bomb.

And reversed clips that were (first case) interlaced or (second case) drone 4k H.264 ... saved by rendering the timeline. Um ... not big issues, easily fixed actually.

The audio speed remapping is something probably better handled in Audition then.

And no matter where you go, you're going to find issues. I'm a regular user of Resolve, I even teach Resolve users how to work in Premiere. And those colorists ... even the ones that love Resolve ... can still give a list of issues they deal with.

As does the BlackMagic and LGG forums.

It's ... software. NLEs. All it seems now built trying to do all things for all people on all software with nearly all media. And all of them strugging with bits here and there.

They're tools. Fancy hammers. That's all.

Neil

[Warwick5E2C]

No idea what your role is at Adobe, but that kind of mentality will eventually see people leave Adobe for software that actually works.

I bought a $5k computer so that I DON'T have to deal with this kind of ridiculous twelve-step workaround every time I want to put a tiny bit of stabilisation on a 3 second clip. It's very telling that Adobe employees look at this problem and think "it's your fault for using the program as advertised. We advise you spend a couple of extra hours in your edit rendering out the effect you applied to that clip, losing the ability to make changes without then re-rendering, re-importing, and re-organising the changes every time".

Again, Apple and Blackmagic DO NOT HAVE THIS ISSUE. I can stabilise a five minute clip with multiple speed ramps (audio included) and it renders in seconds, on the proxy if I have them, without a hiccup. Don't condescend to your customers about their experience using your janky workarounds, or act disingenuous and try to gaslight them about what's technically possible in a modern NLE.

A bit of humility and attentiveness would go a long way in the developers room, and would prevent the inevitable mass exidus Adobe are staring down the barrel of at the moment.

[R Neil Haugen]

A little bit of willingness to learn how X product works is also a good thing, no?

Or organizations? Like the difference between Adobe's profit model and BlackMagic's, for instance. Which require they handle their applications differently.

And also, I'm a user. Like you ... that's all.  Ain't nobody paying me to help you, I'm volunteering to help you. Largely because when I started out, very frustrated with so many things, some experienced users here put me to rights. So it's sorta paying back, you know?

But you jumped in at the start with some pretty hostile comments, rather than simply asking how to do something. That doesn't tend to get the gentlest responses anywhere.

I'm a regular user of Resolve too ... and I teach pro colorists who have to do something in Premiere when they come out of Resolve or Baselight how to do it. As much as they can, of course. So I'm familiar with having to learn how to function, to work within different apps. (And though I totally dislike Resolve's UI, I know how to work within it ... everyone's mileage always varies ... )

One of the biggest problems long-time users of say Premiere have when going into Resolve is being ticked that it doesn't behave and seem to have the options that Premiere did. And if you go to the BlackMagic forums to complain, the first thing you're going to get told is a very non-gentle comment to the effect that this ain't Premiere, lose the Premiere dreams. Learn how Resolve works.

Which is of course, excellent advice. But it works all ways. When coming 'here' from Resolve, Avid, whatever, you need to learn how Premiere works. And simply accept it works differently. And be willing to just ask, and learn.

They're all simply tools, for crying out loud. Used to do something. But you gotta learn how each tool actually works.

And finally ... I've been seeing this sort of comment ever since I really jumped into using the Adobe software what, eight years back? ...

"and {X} would prevent the inevitable mass exidus Adobe are staring down the barrel of at the moment."

In those years, the Adobe DVAs (digital video apps) have gone through the roof for users. Adobe has an outright majority of the films screened at Sundance cut in Premiere, with Avid & Resolve way behind ... and yea, that amazes me too. But true. That always-promised "mass exit" never happens. Quite the reverse.

There's a lot of things I complain about the Premiere/Adobe-app stuff. I've posted some truly epic rants here myself. But I also know I'm only one user, and no matter how passionately I argure for or against something, I'm only one user of several hundred thousand. I ain't gonna prevail very often, you know?

Neil

[warwickj52349404]

Apologies then for jumping down your throat and accusing you of being an Adobe employee. You have been very diplomatifc considering my vitriolic rage at the situation. (I guess Adobe intentionally hide their actual employees under the same moniker as pro users on these forums then? Totally bizarre.)

I can see Adobe's usership has only been going up in recent years, but literally every single friend of mine (at least eight) that work in Adobe software is begging for a change because of bugs, and bugs, and janky workarounds that haven't been fixed for years, despite being mentioned on these community forums. The only thing keeping them in Adobe's ecosystem is that it's required by their employer. That's same with me. And I've now asked my employer to accept that I will be using FCP from hereon out. Never had any stablity issues in FCP, and even the heaviest of codecs playback smoothly, even while jumping around my timeline like a madman.

Full disclosure I only ever use Resolve for colour. But my god FCP just works for simple things like stabalisation (which got a huge improvement in the past few months, and looks better than warp stabaliser now IMO).

You may be just one user, but you're clearly respected in these forums. I don't see why we should accept that Adobe's customer acquisition and retention strategy is to retrofit new features onto their blundering lemon of a program rather than improving the stability and functionality of their core features, and optimising (or rebuilding if need be) their code for modern machines.

I'll leave this here for anyone that's interested. 

[Warren Heaton]

---

In those years, the Adobe DVAs (digital video apps) have gone through the roof for users. Adobe has an outright majority of the films screened at Sundance cut in Premiere, with Avid & Resolve way behind ... and yea, that amazes me too. But true. That always-promised "mass exit" never happens. Quite the reverse.

---

Something that makes Premiere Pro so much easier to use at the feature film level is that the post-production team consists of the editor, assistant editors, apprentice editors, software technicians, and hardware technicians _and_ using a CODEC that's good for editing (i.e. ProRes).   In many other workflows, one person is wearing all of those hats and, in some cases, being stubborn about the transcoding to a ProRes.

-Warren

[Kevin-Monahan]

Hi Warwick5E2C,

Audition will do this effect. Would it be OK to hop over to that app to get your audio done?

Thanks,
Kevin

[warwickj52349404]

To be honest I'd rather "hop over" to FCP. It's just not worth the headache for me anymore.

[Harold SIlva B.]

Hola creo que antes de darte por vencido con un programa deberias haber investigado un poco mas al respecto, modificar la velocidd del audio es una de las cientos de funcionalidades del programa. es tan igual que como hacerlo con el video.

Salu2

[warwickj52349404]

Feels good to be vindicated by a well-known industry pro.

I honestly think Adobe will see their comeuppance very soon. If I had spare capital I would short Adobe shares. I've never been more confident that an industry standard tool is totally and utterly ratshit, and as soon as there's a critical mass of people switching over it will fall like a house of cards.

[R Neil Haugen]

These apps are all tools ... fancy hammers, so lose the emotions and simply use what works for you. Don't worry about who has what market share or is used by anyone else. And let everyone else get on with work also.

I use both Premiere and Resolve daily. And I teach how to work color in Premiere for those colorists based in Resolve or Baselight that for some reason have to work a project in Premiere.

Personally, I HATE  Resolve's UI ... but I have friends who LOVE the Resolve UI. And the way they locked that UI down so it's not customizable much, and they completely lock down all 3rd party tools like my Tangent Elements panel. Because of course, their profit model is to provide a free or cheap software (Resolve) to get you to buy hardware.

And BlackMagic makes their profit on hardware, not software.

But it's all absolutely awesome ... no matter whether you prefer Premiere, Avid, or Resolve, we can each have something we like to work in that works for us.

And at the moment, Premiere is screaming along on both my 24 core Ryzen desktop and 4-year old Acer laptop. Wonderful performance.

And given that both Premiere and Resolve are getting new users every day, I don't think either is in fear of going away. Yea, we all win!

Neil

[warwickj52349404]

Soooo much wrong with this:

1. Users have choice, therefore Adobe need not lift a finger to their product? Some people don't have a choice about what software they use because of production-wide compatability. I'm entitled to be express emotion when making substantial complaint about a tool I'm forced to use day-in, day-out to make a living, especially when you consider its well within Adobe's capacity to fix every single one of these issues.

2. BlackMagic make money from their hardware? So what? They've proven that it's possible to build better software that's more stable and is packed with more features that are integrated into a single UI using less money... Adobe has 25,000 employees and recieves as much as US$250/year from every person that uses Premiere Pro. That's likely close to a billion dollars a year in revenue... WHERE DOES IT ALL GO!? How are we even having this conversation if they have that kind of money flying around?

3. I strongly disagree that Adobe will continue to see the success they're seeing if they don't get their act together and fix these issues. Maybe you don't talk to the people in the industry I talk to, or watch the same YouTubers I watch, or join the Facebook groups I join... But I see a growing trend of people renouncing Premiere Pro because it's too unstable and too buggy, interrupts their creative flow and stifles their enjoyment of the craft. I spend half my day Googling how to get around bugs and it's insane.

[R Neil Haugen]

A fair number of fallacies there, basically because you read X and jumped to galaxy Z ... making such jumps in assumptions is often done, but rarely correct nor adds to a discussion.

Users have choice, therefore Adobe need not lift a finger to their product?  

No idea where that statement came from whatsoever. Just ... weird thought pattern, to me. I simply stated if their product doesn't float your boat, there are other options. And you jump to this, of the what, maybe 50,000 possible assumptions? Huh.

And ranting is fine ... just understand, you're talking here with other users like me ...  so your rant is only useful as a way to vent and not as a way to get changes made. That's always done via their Premiere Pro UserVoice service, which does get monitored by the devs and the all-important M&E people, who exist well above the mere product teams, and who are the ones making the important decisions.

In a company the size of Adobe, the devs are really quite low level employees. 

2) As a regular user of BlackMagic hardware and software, and totally linked with a ton of colorists daily, BlackMagic has pursued the Adobe 'dream' of one app to do everything for everyone on every gear with every media.

And is now having more of the problems that Adobe's products have. From more bugs that haven't been resolved through several versions to instablity to odd functions on one computer while another works perfectly. Yea, I routinley participate on the BM forums as well as LGG and others. And interact with colorists who may or may not love Resolve, but all have a list of the bugs they want fixed there too.

I don't think one app doing everything on everything will work out perfectly for everyone.

Baselight is the most stable probably of any video post app. But it is still a turn-key system. You buy one of three computers from them ... the $12,000, $15,000, or $18,000 computer .... that comes setup with Baselight loaded. You never EVER add any software to that computer.

AND ... you pay around $1500/year for a license and support to use Baselight. And yea, I've got friends running it. Awesome stuff, really.

3) I've been around these apps for many years now, and ... THE ENTIRE TIME ... there has been the continual comment that sentiment "across the user base" is building that EVERYONE is gonna leave Premiere.

And during that time, the number of licensed users has continually changed ... dramatically upward.

Why the dichotomy? Easy.

The vast majority of users are getting adequate to very good performance, and they never come on here or elsewhere to complain! And the ones that are complaining come here, the Cow, whereever, to 1) rant and 2) maybe get help.

So what you're hearing are naturally the ones that are having troubles. But as that's a small percentage of the overall user base, well ... it's a skewed sampling.

Neil