Thanks in advance for any help you can offer. I have been troubleshooting this problem since October and have spent countless hours trying to figure out what is wrong. When I edit with Adobe Premiere, which is 90% of what I use my computer for as a full-time video editor, my computer shuts off unexpectedly with no error message either before or after powering back up. Everything worked great for 9 1/2 months, then the power-offs began. I didn't make any software changes prior to the start of the power-offs because I was editing a feature and the team was all working on the same OS and same version of Premiere.
I am editing on an iMac: Retina 5K, 27 inch, 2017, 4.2 GHz Intel Core i7, 32 GB RAM, Radeon Pro 580 8 GB VRAM, Mac OS Mojave, 10.14.2
I am running Adobe Premiere Pro CC2019, doing pretty simple offline editing on multiple projects. Editing 1080 HD, nothing taxing.
The power offs happen during basic editing functions, play, stop, overwrite, navigating through the sequence with the arrow keys, copy and paste. It's not happening during render or any specific editing function.
I have worked with Apple Support, three techs on the phone so far, plus the local Apple store took my iMac for a week and ran tests in November. All diagnostics that I have run and that Apple has run show that there are no problems with the iMac. I worked with two Adobe support people. I wish I could say that they were helpful. One had me change some permissions and told me that my computer wouldn't crash anymore. As soon as we got off the phone, it powered off. I called back and the next Adobe tech had me launch Premiere in Safe Mode, which disabled my audio monitoring and made it so I could only see about 25% of the picture in the monitor. She had me make edits (where I couldn't hear or see what I was doing) and said that Adobe was working in Safe Mode, therefore it must be the iMac. That was a pretty disappointing phone call.
The power offs began on OS High Sierra and Premiere Pro 2018. I upgraded both to the newest version in hopes that would solve the problem. It did not.
I've done all the basic troubleshooting for kernel panics: reset the SMC, reset the PRAM, unplugged peripherals, ran Disk Utility, ran Malwarebytes Anti-Malware. No malware was found, Disk is ok.
I've tried different power sources. I am usually plugged into a UPS, but I also tried plugging directly into a wall outlet, a different surge protector, a different room. It powers off when I'm editing, no matter what.
I erased my iMac, did a clean install of OS Mojave and a clean install of Premiere Pro 2019. I have no other software or files on this iMac. I removed all peripherals and put all the media on the internal drive so I could test it with no peripherals. It still powers off when I edit. Sometimes it will power off within minutes. Sometimes I can edit for an hour or two before it powers off.
I turned off iCloud sync and Adobe Creative Cloud sync to see if syncing was causing the power offs. Creative cloud sync doesn't seem to make a difference. It still powers off whether sync is on or off. I tried editing on the iMac on Thursday so I could Capture Data for the Apple engineers and it crashed 6 times in 90 minutes. I got about 4 edits done in that time.
I have tried a new project with new, never before used media. I've opened older projects that worked before the crashes began. It doesn't seem to matter what media or what project, the power offs persist.
I tried erasing my computer and restoring it with Time Machine to a backup before the crashes began. Still powers off.
My laptop is still working (knock on wood) and that's how I am getting work done right now. The laptop edits the same projects with the same media, no problem.
I am officially out of ideas, but I am definitely open to ideas from any of you good people. Thanks for reading my tale of woe.
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Did you do a PRAM and SMC reset?
Yes I did a PRAM and SMC reset...it was the first thing I tried. Seems to make no difference. iMac still unexpectedly shuts down.
Premiere Pro can affect the hardware. It was making the fans on PC run at full throttle.
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I suspect overheating. Let's rule it out if we can. I think there is a free App called "Fanny" (lol).
Try to monitor your CPU's Temperature while running premiere.
I had all types of crashes in the past on both PC and Mac. Sudden shut off used to be overheating, and system freeze or BSOD used to be a Ram problem (most of the time)
Let's try to rule out the first suspect.
Unexpected shutdowns of the iMac often happen within a few minutes of booting up, I'm 99% sure it's not heat related. The actual iMac is cool to the touch. I did install the Fanny widget, so next time I'm troubleshooting I'll be sure to monitor the results. Thanks for the tip. Shirley
I've been editing for about half an hour and during that time the CPU temp went up to 51.81 degrees Celsius, but quickly dropped down to 43.62 while I took a moment to type this (according to the Fanny widget). What temp should it be? 51 C = about 125 F which seems a tad warm. Presently it's a pleasant 74 degrees Fahrenheit in the edit room.
Hey Shirley, seems pretty normal to me. However, you want to know what the temperature was at the time of shutdown. Usually, Intel chips would shut down at 100 C.
Also, what Meg said makes sense as well. the GPU itself might be overheating and/or drawing more power from the power supply which might cause the shutdown. I am not sure if Fanny monitors the GPU as well, if it does not you can try "Macs fan control".
You want to keep it open in front of you while editing.
Just to rule couple more things out, have you done any sort of hardware update (added some RAM), or overclocked your CPU or GPU recently? Also, have you tried changing the power cable?
Just to update anyone who is following this sad saga, today makes 99 days since the first day I contacted Apple with this problem. I have been without my iMac for editing since November 27...nearly two months. (Read original post for details).
This week Apple support had me remove the following files from my computer, saying that they are in conflict with the OS. They are apparently part of the Adobe Premiere Pro installation:
I removed the files, restarted, launched Premiere Pro and tried editing (on iMac that only has the most current OS and most current Premiere). It shut down unexpectedly 6 times in 40 minutes. It's impossible to edit with it. Apple insists it is not a hardware problem. Adobe referred me to Apple saying it's not a software problem.
So...I still can't get Adobe to work on this iMac, and nobody can figure out what the conflict is.
Any help or ideas would sure be appreciated...I'm at a loss.
Out of curiosity, can you fire up Premiere and go to File > Project Settings > General and switch the renderer to software only?
The application will run slower but test and see if the time between shut downs improve.
This is testing to see if removing some of the load from the graphics card will help.
Thanks Meg, trying it now. I just changed the render settings to software only. So far I've edited 15 minutes without a crash. But I won't get too excited yet...I'll report back. Warmly, Shirley
Gee Meg, I just edited for almost an hour without a crash. What might this mean? I'm running a Radeon Pro 580 with 8 GB of VRAM. Should be able to handle my simple little 1080 HD edits...I bought this iMac to handle 4K feature length sequences.
Aside, From monitoring the GPU's temp mentioned above, You can download Heaven to stress test your GPU.
If you can prove that your GPU is somewhat faulty, Take back your iMac to the same Apple rep and have them facepalm as hard as they can in front of you.
The graphics card may be suspect.
If you get several hours of repeatably stable performance in Software only - then switch to using the graphic card to render and start crashing again - the case would look strong to me.
I'm not a hardware expert, I don't know if Apple has a way to test the viability of the graphics card/VRAM independently from the rest of the hardware.
If this was a Mac Pro, we could swap out cards for a test but not sure what to do in the case of an iMac - except report this to Apple and see what they say. Hope by now you have a contact with Apple that is aware of your case . . .
Documenting what I did today...curious to know what you think my next step should be.
12:26pm In Premiere Pro I changed the render settings to Software Only from Open CL.
I edited for 4 hours without the iMac unexpectedly shutting down.
I edited both a 1080 HD project and also a 4K project to push the computer harder.
4:20pm I changed the render settings to Open CL
4:43pm the iMac unexpectedly shutdown
I powered back up checked the CPU temperature 56.56 Celsius (documented in detail with Macs Fan Control software). Opened Premiere Pro and commenced editing.
4:46pm the iMac unexpectedly shutdown again
4:48pm the iMac unexpectedly shutdown again
4:52pm I changed the render settings to Metal
4:53pm the iMac unexpectedly shutdown again
4:55pm the iMac unexpectedly shutdown again
4:56pm I changed the settings back to software only.
5:29pm I changed the render settings to Open CL and edited until 6:09pm without a problem.
6:21pm Then, when I was documenting my troubleshooting for today, with Premiere Pro already closed, and with only Safari and Photoshop running, the iMac unexpectedly quit at 6:21pm. I was so surprised. It was the first time the iMac shut down without Premiere Pro on. I opened Photoshop to crop a screenshot and it crashed.
What a day!
Many thanks in advance to anyone who wants to chime in on what they believe I should do next.
You need to know the temperature seconds before Shutdown (You can set the App to notify you when the GPU or the CPU reaches a certain Temp). At this point I think we are narrowing it down to be a GPU problem rather than CPU (Both Metal and OpenCL utilizes GPU)
The GPU might be having one or both of those 2 problems: Overheating and/or Power anomalies.
At this point you can either re-take you iMac to Apple with your findings and ask for a replacement/refund if it's still under warranty, or attempt to gather more Info that it's not a software problem (Photoshop is still an Adobe software)
Try to Run the GPU Benchmark I suggested earlier, or any GPU dependent software besides Adobe and see what happens, this is just a step to back up your claims with Apple.
Well, I think you need to report your experience to Apple and see what they say. I hope you have a single case number and they can see the duration of your problem. Ask to have the case elevated to a higher level of support (do this nicely - explain the duration of trouble and all you have done to try to fix it, and the inability to get work done - it usually gets you to person with more power to make the problem right).
I don't know if it is a good thing, but if you are beginning to see trouble with other applications that put a load on the graphics card - maybe the graphics card will fail entirely. That should be lot easier for them to diagnose.
Hi Meg and Adobe friends,
Just a quick update: after contacting the Apple senior advisor that has been assigned to my case and telling her all the troubleshooting we did last weekend, we agreed for me to bring the iMac back to my local Apple store to have them stress test the graphics card. They said they will have it 7 -10 days.
In the days before taking it in I was able to edit on it with the render settings set to Software only. Anytime I opened a project that had the Open CL or Metal settings, the iMac would shut itself down. Even with the software only setting, the iMac still shut down unexpectedly about 3 times a day while I was editing. Once while launching Photoshop, otherwise while opening a web page on Safari like YouTube. But at least I was able to get some work done...
Fingers crossed that the Apple geniuses and engineers can find the problem.
Thank you again for all your help troubleshooting and I'll let you know what happens next.
Fingers crossed. I've found Apple support pretty good over the years but you often have to push past the first level of contact.
Just a quick update, the geniuses at the Waikiki Apple Store worked on my iMac for 8 days. They said that they were unable to recreate the problem of it unexpectedly shutting down, however they said that the old Data Captures from 1/4/19 and new Data Captures that they did this past week suggested that there was a problem with Adobe Creative Cloud sync.
Because I have been having problems for so long, they did replace the power supply and the logic board, which included replacing the graphics card that is soldered onto the logic board and the VRAM for the graphics card. But the tech I spoke with today as well as the two techs that worked on the iMac this past week all said that they strongly believe it is not a hardware issue, but an Adobe software issue.
I have the iMac back and will begin working with it again tomorrow. I just set it all back up and currently have tomorrow's Premiere Pro project open and working.
One thing we considered when troubleshooting was iCloud syncing, so I turned iCloud off to eliminate that as one possible cause of the crashes. That made me think of Adobe Creative Cloud sync and so I paused file syncing in Adobe as well. So Adobe Creative Cloud was not syncing when it was crashing 3 times a day, week before last.
So, I'm praying that new hardware fixes it. I will start work tomorrow gingerly...same configuration: OS Mojave and Premiere Pro only installed. There's an update for Premiere, but I don't want to update or restore anything until I confirm that the iMac is not shutting down unexpectedly.
I'll turn on the Open CL render setting to engage the graphics card. If that seems to work for a day, I'll turn on Adobe file syncing. If that works for a couple of days, I may consider restoring some of my files from my Time Machine backup.
I'll let you know how it goes. Thank you again for all your help.
I certainly hope that fixes it for you.
Apple works in mysterious ways, but if it was my computer and the Genius was pointing the finger at the software, I would ask them:
1) Why are there not 100s of iMac owners reporting this problem if there is an inherent problem with Premiere Pro and iMacs? As far as I can remember, yours is the first post I've seen about it. What is their basis for this? There must be, at the very least, thousands of Creative Cloud installations on iMacs - where is the general uproar?
2) If the problem has something to do with Creative Cloud sync, why are there no crashes when the load is taken off the graphics card? Cloud sync was on when using software only renderer, yet the crashes seemed to occur only when using graphic acceleration.
I'm having a very similar problem with a very similar machine. Do you have any updates?
One last update, today is my 7th day of editing on the iMac since Apple replaced the logic board, graphics card and power supply and I have had NO CRASHES since. So despite the fact that Apple was never able to replicate or diagnose the problem, and despite that it took 3 1/2 months to get a remedy, they did indeed appear to have fixed it. Until the end, they denied that it was an Apple problem and were saying that they strongly believed it was something happening in Adobe Premiere. Oh well, I just want it to work and now it does! Hopefully this is the end of this saga. THANK YOU to all of you who helped troubleshoot, especially you Meg The Dog! I so appreciate this community of smart editors and engineers. Warmly, Shirley