Render times are significantly slowed by the 14.4 (and beyond) update!

[Th3Birdman]

Title.

Apparently, this isn't a "Known Issue" to Adobe because they have released two updates without addressing this issue.

Hardware encoding for version 14.3 is SIGNIFICANTLY faster than 14.4 and 14.5, upwards to literally 5x times faster. Have been trying to render a  couple videos the past couple days and the render times were out of this world slow (a 2 hour video took 5 1/2 hours to render!). I checked my task manager to find my CPU's (9900k) utilization was around 10%! Even worse, my GPU's (2080ti) utilization was at 20%.

These updates have ruined encoding times, because they severely underutilize the CPU and GPU. The solution is to downgrade from 14.5/14.4 to at least 14.3.2. 

I hope I have helped solve an issue for people like me who were wondering why the heck were rendering times so bad. Please fix this!!!

[Andy 1968]

Th3Birdman,

My system is not taking five times longer to render now as opposed to seven months ago. I would notice that and I would be complaining. That is not to say there isn't a problem with Premiere Pro's latest updates.  That being said any download (Nvidia, Windows, Intel, Adobe) or update can cause problems. Simply installing an audio card can cause problems. That is computers 101. 

As you can tell I will responde to your dishonesty like it or not. Learn to deal with it!

I was having probelms with a Premiere Pro update and I contacted Adobe and an Adobe Employee had full control over my computer and asked why I had seveal older versions of Premiere Pro on my computer. I stated I am always afraid of updating and the older versions might be my best option. I was once like you! The Adobe Employee stated that having several versions of Premiere Pro might be why my system is having problems. The Adobe employee did go into the registry and Nvida control panel (the same thing I did) but nothing the Adobe Employee did helped my system. He actually made it worse. I had to resinstal Windows and Premiere Pro. Everything worked fine after that. It sucks to have to wipe and reload Windows but sometimes that is the only cure. After that the new Premiere Pro update worked fine. It was infact something with my system. Did the older version cause the problem? Who knows for sure considering my computer had a few Windows updates as well as Premiere Pro updates. Windows updates don't always go well.

An Adobe Employee told me having several versions of Premiere Pro might cause problems. I am not saying it will. I am saying an Adobe Employee told me it might.

Once again no one has stated there is not an issues with the latest verson of Premiere Pro. That being said I am not going to download and older version on a system that is working fine nor should you want me to. I also want to add in the past the Adobe updates would mess up the CUDA and Quick Sync setting. I would have to reset them as did other people. So ya once again  my video is 100% was relative. That is not to say it helped with this update. Sometimes intsalling the latest Nvidia drivers can be the cure for an update or installing older drivers. People are going offer basic suggestions before dowloading and older version of Premiere Pro. It is par for the course.

[jones1351]

Here, here man.

There's this guy 'Barnucles' on You Tube. Used to work for MicroSoft. He talks about how, once upon a time, QC on new updates was done by humans using a variety of machine configurations. But now it's all simulations using 'AI', so MS could cut costs and send a lot of employee's packing. As a result more and more machines in the wild started having problems with Windows updates. To me it feels analogous to rolling out a new vaccine without adequate phase I,II, and III trials. People start getting sick.

I can only speculate but it sounds like Adobe is doing the same s**t. And then denying any responsibility. While it's not every update, I've been - off and on - having these kinds of problems with Adobe since 2015.

BTW I'm now having the problem you've experienced. As I write this (Jan '21) I've been waiting several hours for a straight forward (<<4K) project to render. When it's done I'll downgrade to 14.3.2 to see what's up. Thanks for the tip in advance. Bon Chance.

[FlyingFourFun]

There is also one major thing not being discussed here.  I use Media encoder for pretty much every export.  The latest versions use the GPU for both decode and encode.  In the preferances in media encoder you can now tweak it to use CPU for Decode and only GPU for encode, or other combinations like CPU for encode, and GPU for Decode.

I have done some extensive testing as part of my work of switching over to the RTX 3090 and I can say that in some cases, turning on CPU for Decode and GPU for encode works signficantly faster than GPU for both encode/decode work.  I have not spent enough time to figure out in what cases this can be repeated.  But the this change, might be why you are seeign differances,  the older versiosn you referance, only used GPU to encode and always used CPU to encode.

I suggest, if you have nto already, to try this setting in media encoder preferances and see if explains some of your concerns.

[Th3Birdman]

I shall test and report back with results. 

[FlyingFourFun]

I dont have a quicksync enabled CPU (I have a 10980xe), so may have other combiantions that makes sense, like using quicksync for decode may fair better than CPU.  To the best of my memory, I think the older versions used quicksync to decode video even when the GPU encode was added.  Since I didnt have quicksync I never paid much attention to that note I read, but it may be helpfull to you.  You already likly know this, but quicksync encode doesnt look very good comapred to nvenc or CPU, so probaby not worth trying quicsync for encode.

As a side note, update the video drivers, not sure what driver versions your using but the early studio drivers for nvidia gave me trouble, the latest versions are better.

Good luck in the quest,  I will say the stats from your original post for render times are a bit alarming, I have not seen anything that dramatic.  Hopefully a driver package update (if available) and trying the different encode/decode settings helps you narrow in on the issue.

[Th3Birdman]

Nope, this did not make any difference:

(Performed on 14.6. 5 minute 4k video, maximum render quality off.)

[FlyingFourFun]

Not sure what to tell you,  swithing the decoder and encoder for sure makes a differance to to the utlization of each resource without fail.   I'm leaning towards something else is goign on with your setup.  Can you confirm your using the latest studio driver 457.30 for the nvidia card?

I know its a major dissruption, but you may have to trash the preferances and clear out the cache or maybe even do a clean install of premier/media encoder.

What your describing should not be possible, there will for 100% sure be a variance when switching encode/decode.  The 5.5 hours you described reminds of pre GPU enabled encoders and the CPU was doing all the work.  I think it would be worth it to do a clean install of at least Premier and your video card drivers (The check box in the studio driver installer should do the trick, but the gamers use some 3rd party tool to truly delete all the video card files that might be better in your case).

At this point, not sure how else to help you, I will however say its not a wide spread issue with premier code as the worst I ever get is 1:1 for render times....  you have something specific to your enviroment happening, that clean install may help you.

[Th3Birdman]

It's getting frustrating dealing with you "it's your setup" people. 

If the system was working fine on the previous update, and it no longer is with the new update, IT'S THE UPDATE. 

I have literally provided evidence that, without changing anything except the build, there is significant difference in utilization. I cannot see how anyone watches the video and does not come to the conclusion that it's the update. There is another person in this thread stating they're having the exact same issue.

Post your build, do some tests and post your results. Show your upload times on 14.3.2 and then on 14.4/5/6. 

[FlyingFourFun]

Frankly, thats a rude response to anyone trying to help you.

Not sure why I should go to the trouble of installing an old version to prove to you its the same for me - I have no motiviation or gain to make such a claim.  Two people dont make a pattern.  But thousands not here to complain about this specific issue probably means its not the software in general as you belive.  

If people telling you they have no issues, and suggest that a clean install of the video drivers is viable investigative path and your not willing to try it, I suggest you open an offcial support ticket with Adobe.  I didnt come here tonight to be abused in anyway, I demonstrated respect to you - I have not done anything to you to warrant being the attention of your frustraton.

For the record, I never said your problem was not real, never questioned what you posted, even read (and watch watched the two videos) what you and others posted before responding to you.  I belive you are seeing a problem, I dont agree that everyone with version 14.6 has the issue.

I think I solved your problem,  your not going to dealing with this "you people", so you can rest now, no more frustration ahead for you.  I truly hope you find your answer so you can start to focus on your creativity again.

[Th3Birdman]

"Frankly, thats a rude response to anyone trying to help you."

Nah, you just don't appreciate someone speaking to you frankly. Nothing rude about what I said-- I said it's getting frustrating engaging with people like yourself that just jump into the topic without even acknowledging the data that has been provided. Read through the thread; your suggestion isn't something that needs to be addressed. I tested exactly what you said, and showed the results. I asked you to show yours. You won't, hence the frustration.

"For the record, I never said your problem was not real, never questioned what you posted, even read (and watch watched the two videos) what you and others posted before responding to you.  I belive you are seeing a problem, I dont agree that everyone with version 14.6 has the issue."


Not a single one of you have provided any testing on separate versions, and instead have been providing setting changes, which is skirting the issue. The point that I have been making is that the different versions are the root of the issue. You are trying to put a band-aid on a gunshot wound-- even if I were to get a modicum of improvement, it still does not address the issue between versions:

TEST IT ON 14.3.2 THEN TEST ON 14.4/5/6 AND POST YOUR RESULTS. 

Jesus, it is not that difficult. 

"I think I solved your problem..."

Smart aleky response aside, I am the one that provided a solution in this thread. It's literally in the original post: downgrade to 14.3.2. It works. If anyone from Adobe would like to fix the issue that I'm referring to, great! But the issue is solved in the OP-- I was not asking for recommendations or suggestions. I was the one giving advice lol... 

[iLuh]

Hello again to everyone,

I have read every comment done in this thread in the last hours. I am afraid to tell you that I could not agree more in Th3birdman's case because I am suffering exactly the same issues in my 2 PC setups. And let me explain about this:

I am also a content creator and I also have both AMD and Intel processors and I could compare because I have been suffering exactly the same as him.

My Intel setup is an i9-9900k, 32gb RAM and RTX 2080ti. And my AMD setup is a 3950X, 32gb RAM and RTX 2080 Super. CUDA is, for me, a must. And even if it weren't the case, it would work equally well on both systems.

My main working setup is the AMD due to its cores and threads. I have been creating ProRes proxies from +3hr video files in less than 20 minutes until 14.4 came out for both Media Encoder and Premiere (taking more than 1 hour and 40 minutes for one ProRes proxy file). Exporting a simple H.264 1080p mp4 video is using CPU and GPU at the same time and rendering times got slower. It is a software developing error and I can confirm and hightlight it.

In fact, I realised this is a ".4" issue when I was uninstalling Media Encoder 14.4 and rolling it back to previus version but keeping Premiere to 14.5/14.6 and trying to render directly on Premiere. I also compared 14.3.2 render times and man... performance is very different.

What @Andy 1968 has shared is something very basic and I am more than experienced in that point. The main problem is that, regardless of Windows updates, Premiere performance (and also Media Encoder) must be at least the same as in previous versions and is worse. Moreover, Intel's QuickSync is not panacea and is not the solution, of course it is discarded for AMD users and also for the rest of users who want CPU or GPU encoding. We are in 2020 and this performance is NOT admissible.

Let me invite you to open Davinci Resolve, which I saw in your video that you have it installed and it is your Task Bar and please compare GPU usage while rendering and render times... your mind will change.

@Kevin-Monahan I would like to suggest you to take this case to the Premiere and Media Encoder tech team because this is not a hardware issue. There is big differences in rendering performance after jumping to 14.4.

Current solution is rolling back to 14.3.2 or rendering outside Adobe's ecosystem.

[Andy 1968]

iLuh,

That is awesome that you are very experienced but you are not the only one in these forums. If a forum member post information that is not helpful to you keep in mind the info might be helpful for other people.

That being said why are you creating proxies with your system?  I don't need to make proxies for DaVinci or Premiere Pro. The videos below will demonstrate that. The videos below are a little old but I will try to do an update comparison video just for you if I get some free time. What if on my system Premiere Pro renders faster and offers better playback performance than DaVinic Resolve? 

[iLuh]

Thank you Andy.

On the one hand I appreciate your attempt to help, but on the other it seems that what you want is to promote your content. 

My words are solid in what I wanted to explain before. Also, if you consider, you can take a look at Media Encoder community forums and you will see a lot of people complaining about latest versions, which makes you realize we are not alone in this. I repeat, I thank you for your attempt to help but this is not the issue you try to solve. It is a bad development issue. Nothing else.

Regards.

[iLuh]

Oh, and acoording to proxies, I use them because my files are x264 and in custom resolution, 3840*1080. Real-time playback working in a timeline using mp4 is not the best thing. It's better using other codecs and formats.

Take care and please, avoid spamming your content in many threads. It is not ethic.

[Andy 1968]

iLuh,

Thank you for the backhanded compliments. My videos posts are not spaming when you consider I only post them when rendering and playback is mentioned. My system can always playback multiple layers of any 4K codec. When someone cannot playback 1920 X 1080 I know there is a problem but I cannot simply blame Premiere Pro without a little trouble shooting. First would be the CUDA settings and the encode and decode settings. That is what my video covers. Second would be Nvidia Game Driver Vs Studio drives. Third would be Nvida Control panel settings. These have helped with upgrades in the past but all upgrades are different.

That being said no one has stated there is not an issues with the newer version of Premiere Pro.

I could setup a sequence with the resolution of 3840 X1080  and you could upload 6 or 7 short video clips (20 seconds) from your camera. I could then see if my system can achieve real-time playback without the need for proxie files. I admit there are few version of H.264 that Nvida and Intel cannot encode and decode. Your camera might use that verrsion of H.264.

[RjL190365]

I would dare say that the only fix would be to implode everything and redesign the program completely from scratch. (Of course, this would partially or completely break all compatibility with older or legacy hardware and video formats.)

Every single version of Premiere Pro that included hardware encoding with a discrete GPU has major issues. 14.2, the first version that included hardware encoding for anything other than an Intel CPU with integrated graphics enabled, has a serious bug that caused the program to crash when run on default settings if the installed discrete GPU lacks any hardware encoding capability whatsoever.

[Andy 1968]

Rjl,

I would agree that Premiere Pro does seem to get more and more buggy as time goes on. I would like to see Adobe Edit Pro version 1.0 at NAB 2021. A NLE that has the best of Premiere Pro, After Effects, Prelude and Audition.

[jones1351]

Thank you. It helped me. I'm currently rendering a file with ver. 14.3.2. It's moving along at a good pace. The same file rendered with 14. (whatever the lates version) took 6 HOURS.

If that doesn't say the problem is with the different versions then they're not listening.

Thanks again for cutting thru the BS. Adobe needs to step up.

[iLuh]

It is still happening on 14.8 😄 also on Media Encoder and they don't fix it!

[Will5C9F]

I can 100% confirm the same thing. I have talked to Adobe support but they are useless and want to try everything that every level of support has tried again causing me to do the same things that never fix anything over and over without acknowledging that the newer version of their software caused this problem. I have a 6700K, GTX 1070, and 32GB RAM. After installing 14.4 my encode times went from 10 min to 2+ hours on the exact same video. My GPU went from 20-40% usage to 1-2% usage and my CPU went from 60-80% usage to 16-20% usage. I have tried all versions from 14.4-14.8 and none of them work, I only get my render times back if I go to 14.3.2 or below. I'm A+, Network +, Security + and Cisco Certified. I work on and build computers for a living and even though video editing may be a side hobby/job, I know what I am doing and am 110% sure this is a software issue and not a driver or my PC issue. I'm seriously just excited to see someone else is having the same issue so they can't say it is just my computer because I know it is not and we are having 100% the exact same problem. FIX THIS CRAP ADOBE THIS IS RIDICULOUS! 

[Probably0101]

Can 100% confirm this as well. i9 9900KF and RTX 2080ti

14.3 // 30 minute sample file renders in ~5 minutes, between 70-100% on CPU and GPU

14.4+ // Same sample file says it's take 12 minutes, actually takes 25 minutes, about 20% on CPU and 40-60% on GPU

[Will5C9F]

Man I'm going from like 5 min render to like 2+ hours on the same file.

[iLuh]

If you guys find the solution please let us know. I am fed up with this issue. What I do is editing on 14.8 but rendering on Media Encoder 14.3.2, because both Premiere and Media Encoder's engine are the same, Adobe changed their engine from 14.4.

[Will5C9F]

Has anyone tried 14.9 yet?

[drm production]

J'ai essayé la version 14.9 ce matin, et le problème reste toujours le même de mon côté.
Une vidéo de 5min 4K temps de rendu : 5h

Configuration :

AMD Ryzen 9 3950X 16-Core Processor 3.50 GHz
64 RAM
NVIDIA TITAN RTX