Cannot delete (remove) topics from RH7

[Guest]

I checked Adobe's online help topic, and tried following the steps there, but it is not working. In the help topic, "Hide, unhide, and delete files" it shows a dialog box that gives you the choice to either 1) hide in all views 2) hide in current view only and 3) permanently delete from database. I delete topics from our shared help project, and I do not get this choice nor this dialog box. The only question I get is whether I want to remove all references to the topic and then the topic disappears from my view. It is marked as hidden by me in the source control history. Other authors on my team can see it. We want to remove it from the database permanently. How can I accomplish this? I am an admin user with all permsssions, so I should be able to do this. Has anyone else run across this who can assist? Thanks in advance. Dawn

[Gravenstein]

When you delete a topic in RoboHelp, you simply delete it, and it's gone. However, when you are working with source control, there are other considerations. You may want to blow away all evidence that the topic ever existed...but what if you want to restore an older version of that topic, or maybe an older version of the entire project? That is one of the basic functions of source control, after all. As you've probably surmised, "delete" refers to the first case, blowing the topic away entirely, and "hide" refers to the second case, where the topic is recoverable. "Unhiding" a topic would mean that you are restoring it. I can't speak to your particular case, but it's more common to want to hide something than delete it.

I haven't played much with the views, so can't help you there. I think, though, that with some configuration of your views, your problem can be resolved.

I have to admit that the term "hide" threw me off at first, too, but it does make sense after you get used to the idea.

G

[Guest]

I admit there are times when "Hide" would actually be better. However, did you know that each author has to hide it from their view for it really to be hidden for all users? I don't need to send a message each time we want a topic gone forever to all my authors telling them to hide it. Also, this is a case where we mistakenly imported a topic from a legacy project that never should have been imported in the first place. I hadn't gotten any replies to this, so I opened a web support case. When I actually get a real answer from Adobe tech support, I will post it here. Thanks for your thoughts, as I can see times where it would make sense. But I would want a way to globally hide it for all users at once, rather than per user.

[Gravenstein]

There must be something about the way you're set up. We aren't having that problem. I just double-checked a project where I know that several folders were deleted, and I just see the current view with the old stuff gone.

We are using just the default view, if that helps.

G

[Guest]

We just set up our new upgrades recently, and we are only using the RoboHelp 7 Server and clients for new projects, no legacy stuff yet. We haven't set up anything custom yet, such as Views or anything else. I just mean that if one user "deletes" the topic in the default view, other users can still see the topic. It's the only the user who deleted it who doesn't see it anymore. Both users who are deleting topics have all rights in the User Library.

[Gravenstein]

For the record, we're still on RH6, although I doubt that that is the difference.

Here's a thought...how did you place the project in source control: did you add it via RH, or did you do it directly from RSC? Back before I knew that you had to go through RH, we did experience some weird stuff with what the writers could see on a given project.

G

[Guest]

We add our projects using the RoboHelp 7 client application, always. But it is a good thought. Actually, in our legacy X5 implementation, we can actually delete files and folders for topics from the database permanently. We did not upgrade to RH6; we went straight to RH7, and we are only using new projects (not legacy yet) in this new server.

[Gravenstein]

So it's not that... That would've been too easy, eh?

Let me just make sure I understand your issue. Is the problem limited to when you manually delete a topic from RSC, or are you having trouble with writers deleting topics from RH?

Usually, when the writer deletes a topic from RH, that's the end of it. Occasionally, there's some kind of problem and I have to delete it from RSC. (This is usually due to some interruption that causes RH and RSC to desynchronize with one another.) If it's a totally bogus file, as in your case, I would select "Permanently delete from database." Mostly, I've avoided dealing with hiding files directly from RSC, although I've done some "unhiding."

It's probably good that you have a case open on this. Views are an area I don't know much about.

G

[Guest]

Actually, I am referring to deleting topics using the RoboHelp 7 client application. This same issue happens for any writer who removes a topic. Like you, I only delete topics directly in the RoboSource Control Explorer as a last alternative due to an issue. I don't know anything about "Views" as a UI feature in this new application. I only meant that the writer who removes the topic doesn't see the topic in his local project anymore, but all other writers do continue to see the topic. Thus, for all writers to not see the topic anymore, each has to remove it individually. That's how it is working in my implementation, which I have not customized yet in any fashion. So, the writers can still "view" or "see" the topic that another writer has removed. I am not given any option (as I am in X5) to remove the topic from the database. The only confirmation I get is whether I want to remove all references to the topic. I say yes, and then the topic is gone. When I open RoboHelp Explorer and view the history on the topic, it says that the user (me in this case) "Hid file". I just want to know how I can delete the topic rather than hide it. Hide seems to be the default and there are no other options given. In my first post, with those options in numbered order 1-3, I got that from an Adobe help topic. A help topic that seems to have mysteriously disappeared from the online help since I opened a web case. That's where I got the idea that you should get those 3 options to choose from when you remove a topic. However, I never see that dialog box in RH7, and I have only seen it in help. I don't care about "Views" right now or hiding. I just want to actually remove the topic permanently like it says in option 3. Thanks!

[Gravenstein]

Thanks for the clarification--your problem is worse than I thought. Something is definitely messed up, as this is not normal behavior.

Wait...you said you were using X5. Are you mixing an X5 client with an RSC3 database?

G

[Guest]

Actually, I was comparing the behavior of X5 to RH7. We do use X5 for our legacy projects still, as there is an issue with upgrading some topics. I am waiting on a resolution from Adobe for that issue (see empty topics post in the RoboHelp forum for that one). However, we are starting any new help projects in RH7. I am not mixing them; that's the last thing I would do. But one never knows! I was saying that I can delete topics in X5 and I am given an option to remove them permanently. I am not given this option when I am using X5. And yes, we are running X5 on a different server computer with its own database. And running RH7 on a separate server with its own database. Never do the two cross paths. Yes, we can successfully run both the X5 client and the RH7 client on our client computers; it's nice.

[Guest]

Finally got an answer from Adobe customer support. Having gone back and forth for a while with a web case and getting no where fast, I called and talked to the customer support representative on the telephone. A couple of things helped clarify my issue. First of all, the difference between X5 and RH7 source control is that the default behavior when deleting using the client is now to "hide" topics rather than delete them from the database permanently. You can keep users from bringing those topics back by not giving them the unhide right. The only way to actually delete a topic from the database permanently now is to use the RoboSource Control Explorer, which breaks the project. Of course, I just check out the folder fpj file, modify it myself, and check it back in to fix that issue. But who wants to do that all the time? And not all of us understand XML and are able to do that. OK, so that is the first issue. One has to understand that hiding is deleting now. But on to the second issue. Why was the topic I was deleting only being hidden from me and not all of the other users are our team? Turns out I should not be giving Admin and Sub-Admin rights to myself as an authoring user. Only the "Admin" user account should have these rights, and only for administration, only use the Admin account. After removing these rights, I was then able to delete topics and the topics would then not show up for any of my team. I also found another issue resolved by taking these rights from my authoring user account. When I had the admin and sub-admin rights, I could not re-import topics another time. I would get a message that said the topic already existed in the project. After removing the rights, I could then choose to overwrite the existing topic or not. Thus, my other post in this RoboSource Control forum about wanting more than a one-liner on user rights is even more important. I submitted a feature request for better documentation of user rights. Let's hope someone listens!