Problems with Word Import

[Guest]

I work for a company that uses Microsoft Word as the primary tool for developing documentation. We then import the docs into RH5 creating topics by heading levels.

I downloaded the RH7 30 day trial and I noticed when I imported the docs it would not split by heading styles. Instead it just lumped evything together based on my heading 1 style with the sublevels linked to the heading1 topics. I could not find a way to unlink the topics so that I can reorganize and reuse content. Also when I clicked on a topic it appeared as just one long topic.

Not sure if this is a limitation of the trial, but any support would be welcome, since my company is trying to decide if we will upgrade.

Also on a side note, i was curious what peoples experience where with converting styles on import with RH7. RH5 had this feature but it had many issues with crashing and not being able to convert some style elements from word.

[MergeThis]

In your initial post, your last sentence was "Could you spell out the process of clearing the heading format then re-applying a little more?" (I think I provided the MS method for this.)

Yet, in your next post, you say "My grandma know[sic] how to select text, clear, and apply formatting in Word."

And your most recent one "I think fast, I talk fast, and I need you two guys to act fast if you want to get out of this." Indeed!

Try to keep in mind, that there are now three major versions of RH in use, dueling browsers interpreting HTML and XML very differently at random times, conversions being made from Word, FrameMaker, WinHelp, etc., and a community of users that range from absolute neophytes to 20-year users, with hundreds of types in between, including software developers and other non-writers. As a matter of fact, it sometimes takes even experienced users a dozen back-and-forth replies before we can determine exactly how we can speak the right user-speak for each user that comes to us with a problem (e.g., What do you mean by the index? and other such questions).

We enjoy helping users fix their problems, except when they come in bomb-throwing. Throwing C*** around is not appreciated. Take the time to actually read our suggestions, instead of blowing us off and insisting that we haven't helped at all.

Good luck (and I really, really mean that!),
Leon

[Wrigbone]

I have had some luck with this issue and thanks for your concern Leon. With a lot of trial and error I isolated the import problem to "Outline Numbering". When I go in and strip out the document list, wholla, RoboHELP recognizes all the headings. I tried to remove the TAB character after the number in those numbered lists and pretty much every other option but found no way to import the docs with the numbering in place.

If anyone knows a way around this I would much appreciate the advice. In the event that there is no way around the problem I hope someone else will find this post before banging away at all the possible import issues if their doc is formatted with outline numbering.

I apologize for offending anyone here with my derogatory comments about Robohelp. This is what happens when you get frustrated with a pretty decent product with spotty help files and the atrocious foreign based tech-support of Adobe.

[Peter Grainge]

It would be way too easy to ask why your granny didn't teach you that HTML does not support outline numbering. Point taken?

There is no neat solution I know of but I don't use outline numbering so I haven't dug into it enough to find a kludge, apart from manually entering the numbers which is a real pain.

The only idea I have is maybe using RoboHelp for Word. I haven't tried it but maybe when generating the help, RH substitutes the correct numbers hard coded as it were. RH for Word is not so well supported on these forums so you won't get the same level of assistance.

A couple of thoughts.

First, HTML 5 specs are being developed and I believe they may include outline numbering, but that's way off.

Second, I gave a presentation recently and made the point that whilst I understand why outline numbering is used, it gets in the way of readability. The Word templates being shown had left aligned headings and indented body text. Even the guys who love numbering had to admit it got in the way of the eye picking up on the headings to help them find what they wanted on second read. So maybe take another look and decide whether you really want that numbering, especially in an online environment.

The help files are being worked on for the next version but that doesn't help right now. Did someone point out the offline help is better than the online help?

[MergeThis]

Ah, Wrigbone, you're still not getting the point.

MS Word .doc files are binary thingies loaded down with macros, hidden xml, and other filth.

HTML (Hypertext Markup Language) files are flat files (straight text) whose tagged content gets interpreted by modern browsers.

Some of what complicates the whole Word conversion effort:

* Many Word files have had styles created and applied in random fashion, usually by multiple users.

* If RH doesn't have an identically named style to match a style it encounters in the Word file being converted, it creates one on the spot and tries the best it can to replicate its formatting. This can apply to all elements: headings, lists, etc.

As to the outline numbering: that's a print conceit only, and has been superceded by hyperlinks in the online world. End of discussion.

The good news is that Word allows you to change and rename styles very easily. For example, RH recognizes the style "Heading 1." Therefore, in Word you would select Edit > Replace > More. In the Replace tab, place your cursor in the Find what box and click Format > Style. In the Find what style box, select the "MyRedHeading1" (or whatever the custom styles are named) and click OK. Repeat these steps in the Replace with box and select "Heading 1" as the replacement style. Unfortunately, you'll probably still have to do some manual style changes if any of those custom headings were edited after the style was applied (an altogether likely possibility).

Another issue to contend with is Word's AutoFormat option, which gives RH the heebie-jeebies, specifically things like smart quotes, hyphens with dash, etc. Again, there's good news. In Word, first turn off all the checkboxes in Tools > AutoCorrect Options > Autoformat As You Type. Then use the Edit > Replace > More option and type each of the characters (double quotes, hyphens, etc.) in both the Find what box and the Replace with box.

And, you're right: none of this is explicitly stated in the "spotty help files," nor might you have obtained it from "the atrocious foreign based tech-support of Adobe." But then again, we users here in the forum love dispensing "entry level BS," even though it probably won't help you.


Good luck,
Leon

[Wrigbone]

Preciate the pointers fellas. Yes I do understand the limitations when converting to HTML however my point, and I believe the point of the others who started this discussion, is that the older versions of RoboHelp did this job just fine. I assume the old version just ignored the number, picked up the heading, then hard coded the number in HTML. This version of RoboHelp will not "see" the headings when importing if there is numbering preceding them. FYI MegreThis, it doesn't matter if you use the standard Microsoft Heading 1 or My Custom Heading it will not pick it up on import. As soon as you strip out the numbering, bam, My Custom Heading 1 2 3 etc are all available.

I agree Peter, and I would love to do away with the numbering, but we are dealing with bureaucrats here and they want to refer to a section and sound important when they do if you get my drift. So it looks like I'm stuck with old school editing on this one. Thanks again for the input. Hope this helps someone in the future.

[mcspt]

Hi all,
I've experienced the same problem about splitting topics according to the desired stiles (Heading1 and Heading2).

RoboHelp 5 worked fine.
Now I'm using the trial version of RoboHelp 7.

I wonder if this is a problem just of trial version.
I hope the commercial version don't have the same problem.
Someone have news about this.

[Guest]

Question about syncing styles between Word and RH HTML 7. I'm using a corporate Help template from RH HTML 5.02, which has both a .htt and a .css.

I created a companion template in Word 2007 (same style names for Headings, Procs, etc.). The printed Word format has Hdr/Ftr, TOC, Title Page stuff.

I understood that, when importing a Word .docx, RH creates books for Heading 1s and Topic headings are Heading 2. That is why both Word and RH templates use the same paragraph style names (though the format in Word/print differs from that in RH/online).

I imported my Word file into a new RH HTML 7 project. The TOC has the expected books/topics/subtopics. I imported the .css and the .htt from the RH 5 template project. I selected all 160 topics in the Topic List pod and applied the corporate .htt template (Topic Properties > General) AND (to be certain), the corporate .css stylesheet (Topic Properties . Appearance).

This project doesn't have the same characteristics as the base/master from RH 5 that uses those same format files. I even imported the same skin. I get the banner, but not the styles.

All the topic headings in the RH 7 project (were transformed to) are Heading 1 styles, even though they were Heading 2s in Word. (this breaks with my tribal knowledge of how RH imports Books/Topics from a Word doc). The heading colors (navy blue, royal blue, etc.) have taken on their own definitions--dunno where from, tho.

Since I'm OCD about creating and using one style for each type of paragraph (procedurehead, syntax, procnum, procnonum, note, bullist) in Word or in RH, Peter Grainger's suggestion to "clean up" styles before importing shouldn't apply.

RH instructions omit any detail about what to specifiy in the Conversion Options and Split On Style. I took a couple of swipes at the SOS--OK, split on Heading 1, Heading 2, Heading 3. So I get Books for Heading 1, separate topics for Heading 2 and Heading 3, but the "topic titles" have become Heading 1 in name but not in format. In fact, the format doesn't match anything I've specified in Word or RH. I thought by "attaching" the .htt and the .css to each topic (select all topics, , I'd have the look and feel I specified in my corporate RH(5) template. The banner imported, the navigation pane and icons imported. What happened to the styles?

Here's the missing link that someone may need to explain (explicitly in Help somewhere). When I open the .htt template (sample topic) that I imported from RH 5, the topic title shows as Document > Heading 2 > in the Design view. The HTML view labels this paragraph as h2:

<!doctype HTML public "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Frameset//EN">
<html><head>
<meta http-equiv=content-type content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
<meta name=generator content="Adobe RoboHelp - www.adobe.com">
<meta name=generator-major-version content=0.1>
<meta name=generator-minor-version content=1>
<meta name=filetype content=RoboHelp>
<meta name=filetype-version content=1>
<meta name=page-count content=1>
<meta name=layout-height content=1927>
<meta name=layout-width content=732>
<title>JavaCode</title>

<link rel=StyleSheet href=mytemplate.css>
</head>
<body>
<h2>NameOfPackage: NameOfMethod</h2>

[Peter Grainge]

There are no functionality differences between the trial and full versions.