RH2020: Condition Tags Ignored at Paragraph Level

[Singlewire Tech Writer]

I'm using RH2020.0.156

Well, this is an odd one. I have a topic that is shared between three applications (and we have four total): IC, Mobile, and Fusion (but not PG).

The topic is tagged as Not_PG (meaning it will show up for IC, Mobile, and Fusion).

Within the content, there are three tags: IC (only shows for IC output), Mobile_Fusion (shows for both Mobile and Fusion outputs), and Fusion (only shows for Fusion output).

In all outputs, if the condition tag is included at the paragraph level instead of the character level, it's being ignored and showing up for all outputs.

For example, this doesn't work, i.e. it's showing up for all outputs even though it's tagged for IC only:

<p class="Note" data-condition="Others:InformaCast">Note: If you disabled the automatic import of certificates...</p>

And this does work, i.e. it only shows up in the IC output:

<p class="Note"><span data-condition="Others:InformaCast">Note:If you disabled the automatic import of certificates...</span></p>

Even odder, everything shows up correctly in Preview mode, i.e. stuff excluded at the paragraph level stays excluded. 

Please tell me there's a fix for this. I have a lot of conditional text that's tagged at the paragraph level.

[Amebr]

Are there condition tags on the problem topic? Have you used "Include" anywhere in your condition expressions? Just trying to see if there might be other interactions going on.

[Singlewire Tech Writer]

Hi Amebr.

There are condition tags at the topic and content level of this topic.

None of my condition expressions use Include statements.

A few more details:

• This wasn't a problem in RH2019, and I've changed nothing aside from upgrading to RH2020.
• While I am citing a specific topic for example purposes, this problem affects ALL topics. 

[Peter Grainge]

I recently discovered that AND/OR work in different ways to what you might expect. This is because of historical reasons from long before Adobe came on the scene but if they change it, that would mess everyone up. What can be done is reviewed.

Meantime I have prepared a PDF that explains how expressions should be working. I can't upload it here so email me via my Contact page. It does rather sound as if the way the tags and expressions are working is not what you would expect.

My suggestion would be that rather than play around with your live project, create a new project with just the minimum number of topics to test things noting what's in the PDF. If that works, you have your answer, if not come back and let us know.

[NexgeniOS]

I am having a similar (same?) problem. I have two topics that are tagged at the topic level for certain audiences, and that is working fine in the published output, but within those two topics there are content-level tags that are not working correctly in the published output. Let's say the content level tags are called CSP and Local. In the Local published output, some of the CSP content is showing, but not all of it; and in the CSP published output, the Local content is showing. In Authoring>Preview mode, everything shows up correctly.

[NexgeniOS]

I neglected to say what version I'm using. This is RoboHelp 2019.0.14.

[Jeff_Coatsworth]

@NexgeniOS is this for a Classic or New UI project? Check Peter's site (grainge.org) for his explanation of conditioning - he may have added it as a snippet to his list.

[NexgeniOS]

OK well it's a little embarrassing that I'm not sure of the answer to that. I think it's Classic. When I click the File menu inside the project, there's an item in the menu called Upgrade RoboHelp Classic Project. Does that answer the question?

[Peter Grainge]

This reply was based on a misunderstanding of the issue. Content removed by me to tidy up the thread.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Peter Grainge]

This reply was based on a misunderstanding of the issue. Content removed by me to tidy up the thread.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Jeff_Coatsworth]

Not really - what's your project's editing screen look like?

[Peter Grainge]

Classic does not have an Upgrade option so it must be the new UI. If you look top left you should see Author, Outputs and Review tabs.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[NexgeniOS]

I see Author and Output, but not Review, in the editing screen. Let me know if this screenshot answers the question.

[Peter Grainge]

If you are seeing this, albeit without Review, then you have the new UI.

Review can be turned on if you ever need it by going to this screen from Edit > Preferences.

As before, there is currently an issue with DCF where a topic has both topic and content level tags in it.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[NexgeniOS]

Thank you Peter for your guidance so far. I'm not familiar with the screen from My Basic Project that you attached to your previous reply. I'll try to explain in a little different way.

Using another topic as an example... The topic is meant to be seen by audiences called “CT Local” and “MA.”

The Output Condition Expression for audience “CT Local” is to include tags A or B or C.

The Output Condition Expression for audience “MA” is to include tags B or D.

My topic is tagged “B” at the Topic level. In the published build, both Audience “CT Local” and “MA” see that topic, as expected, because they both include “B.”

My sample topic has some content tagged “A.” According to the build expression, that content should not show in the published file for “MA” but it does.

When I use the Preview in Authoring mode and I select audience “MA,” the content tagged “A” does not show, which is how I expect it should be working in the published build. Your response that you contacted Adobe and they acknowledge that it's not working correctly is encouraging. 

Attached is a screenshot showing the build expressions referenced above.

[NexgeniOS]

And yes, the problem is occurring only when there's a combination of Topic Level and Content Level tags. When there's no Topic  Level tag, all of the Content tags work correctly.

[Peter Grainge]

This reply was based on a misunderstanding of the issue. Content removed by me to tidy up the thread.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[NexgeniOS]

We are not using Dynamic Content Filters. Should we be?

Also and as an aside, when I select Edit>Preferences, the resulting window is called Application Settings rather than Application Preferences as in your screenshot, and it only has selections for General, Version Control, and File Association. Clearly we are not on the same version. No matter -- this is only an aside from the issue at hand.

For now, I am going to work around the Topic tag vs. Content tag issue by breaking those topics (of which there are not many) out into separate ones for each relevant audience. I am curious how we will know when there's a fix for this issue.

Thanks very much for your help.

[Peter Grainge]

OK there are two mixups here. You are using RoboHelp 2019 but the thread is about RoboHelp 2020, then somehow I mixed up filtering.

I think the best way forward now would be for you to start another thread. If you agree, when I see it I will come back to this thread, reference the new thread and then lock it before it gets any more muddled. 

Please use the photo icon to insert images within the post. Seeing an image inline with the text makes it easier for anyone answering or viewing the post.

The issue you are facing will be nothing to do with the known issue about filtering. 

My apologies.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Peter Grainge]

First just try changing the OR settings to AND.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Peter Grainge]

The change from OR to AND is a just a wild try. After that start the new thread as I have suggested. If we can't resolve it there I will take a look at your project or a mocked up test if you can't share your live project. 

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[NexgeniOS]

I will start a new thread, as you suggested. My apologies for muddying the waters. I'm afraid to change the OR to AND because we already reconstructed our build expressions when we realized they weren't working as expected, and now all seems to be working fine except for this one issue.  I applied the workaround you suggested (remove the Topic Level tag from Authoring mode and leave it only in the TOC), and that worked. 

[Peter Grainge]

I will look out for the new thread. 

This thread is now locked.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Peter Grainge]

I have looked at the thread again and I think I see the issue. Write your expressions as Exclude what you don't want rather than include what you do want.

Exclude expressions have always worked better.

Try that and start a new thread if that does not work. If it does, I have unlocked this thread so that you can post back. Then I will tidy up the thread and just leave relevant content.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information

[Peter Grainge]

@NexgeniOS has started a new thread and this one is now locked.

________________________________________________________
See www.grainge.org for free Authoring and RoboHelp Information