Thumbnail options in RoboHelp 2020

New Here ,
Mar 14, 2022 Mar 14, 2022

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I just upgraded my projects to RH 2020 Update 6. Using RH 2019, I had set up my images to display as thumbnails in my Responsive HTML5 output (Indigo layout). For each image, RH generated a separate _th file that it displayed as the thumbnail.

 

With RH 2020, there are two thumbnail options in the preset: Create Thumbnails for Images and Style Existing Images as Thumbnails. I have generated the output both ways and I don't see any difference. I expected "Create Thumbnails for Images" to generate the duplicate _th files as in RH 2019, but I don't find any such files in output folders. I can't image what it means by using "style" as a verb here. And yet either way, it works.

 

What is the difference between these two options and why would I choose one over the other? I did look this up in the RoboHelp user guide, but it just explains them using the same words that are on the screen. 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 14, 2022 Mar 14, 2022

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Does Peter's site (grainge.org) have any guidance?

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New Here ,
Mar 14, 2022 Mar 14, 2022

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No, I didn't find any specifics there about how these two options differ.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 14, 2022 Mar 14, 2022

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"Create thumbnails for images" should be the one that creates a new image for the thumbnail, while "Style existing images as thumbnails" should apply css/html to the existing image to create a thumbnail image.

 

But in either case you need to go in to every topic, select the image and select the "Use Thumbnail' checkbox for every image you want to display as a thumbnail. I couldn't find any option that said "make every image in my project a thumbnail".

 

Simplified Examples

You insert <img src="MyImage.png" />

Create thumbnails for images = <img src="MyImage_th.png" />

Style existing images as thumbails = <img src="MyImage.png" width="100" />

 

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New Here ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Yes, I understand about needing to enable thumbnails in two places (for each image and in the preset). I did that part right. But I don't see any difference in the output no matter which option I select. 

 

If I select "Create Thumbnails for Images", should RH automatically create a _th file for every image where I've selected "Use Thumbnail"?  I think so, but if that's correct, where are those _th files in the output folder structure? I can't find them. Maybe it doesn't matter, but I don't understand how this works.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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You shouldn't see a difference. It's about do you have one image for the both the thumbnail and the full size or do you resize the full image so that it is seen as a thumbnail. Two images increases the project size but may give better images at both sizes.

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My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

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New Here ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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OK, I generated the output twice into separate folders to keep things straight. I think I had confused myself earlier by using the same output folder every time and I lost track of which thumbnail option I had selected.

 

So, first I selected "Style Existing Images as Thumbnails". I see the thumbnail in my output and the width parameter in the HTML.

Next, I selected "Create Thumbnails for Images". I do not see the thumbnail in my output; instead, it's a missing file image. If I click it, I get the full-size image as expected.

 

So if I select "Create Thumbnails for Images", am I expected to create a second file with the image in the thumbnail size I want? And if so, do I store that in the same folder as the full-size image? Does RH no longer create the _th files automatically as it used to?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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I will check that what I said is correct and get back to you.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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I generated using both options and then used Beyond Compare to see what was different. 

 

In both cases you insert the full size image into a topic and in the Properties for that image you set the size for the thumbnail.

 

Using Create Thumbnails for Images a _th copy is created in the output.

image.png

 

Using Style Existing Images as Thumbnails the _th file does not get created, instead the full size image is shrunk in the topic. 

 

As far as I can see it will not affect the quality of either. The size of the output will be greater in the first instance but I wouldn't have thought it makes a vast difference. I'll see what else I can find about the relative merits.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Peter, I really appreciate all your efforts to figure this out!

What you describe is how I would expect it to work, but I am getting very inconsistent results.

With RH 2019 it was so easy---I specified one thumbnail size and it created a _th file for every image. (I didn't necessarily like the idea of having twice as many image files, but at least I understood what was going on.) I might just go with the "Style existing images" option and move on.

 

Additional problem: in the Frameless output, the enlarged image is missing the "X" in the upper righthand corner, although if you click the circle where it should be, the image closes. I can't figure out what image file is being used here, so I can't check to see if there's something wrong with it, but this happens with the Studio skin right out of the box, no customizations. Here's how it looks:

user20210224_0-1647366545241.png

 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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2020 is creating that second image so I'm not following.

 

My guess would be some corruption is causing the missing image. Create a new copy of the skin with a slightly different name to test. If that fails as well, which skin?

________________________________________________________
My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Fresh copy of Studio skin, generated to a new output folder. Same result (missing "X").

I selected "Create Thumbnails for Images" and I don't get any _th files in the output \images folder. 

I've tried this with two different projects and I get the same results. 

The upgrade to RH 2020 and my attempts to produce Frameless output that functions correctly are beyond frustrating.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Please try a simple test in a brand new project. If that fails then see the Contact page on my site and send the project as instructed there. Do make sure you include a link to this thread and please do not email the project direct.

________________________________________________________
My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Still getting the same results in a new project with one topic and one thumbnail, using a fresh Studio skin.

 

As much as I would love to send you my source files and see if you can figure out what's going on, I'm afraid my employer doesn't allow me to do that. I have SO many issues with RH 2020 that I might have to call Adobe Customer Support directly and hope they can walk me through some things. 

 

Thanks so much for all the time you've spent helping me with this!

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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I said create a new project. A new project only contains First Topic and then you add any image. You only use the default.css in this project. I don't get why you can't share that as it has none of your live project in it.

 

Did you perhaps use some of your live project stuff in it? That's not what I wanted you to do as it that could be where the issue is.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 15, 2022 Mar 15, 2022

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Perhaps you're running into network or path length problems. 

 

Can you create a test project somewhere like c:\test\project and generate to c:\test\output to rule out both network issues and path length?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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I am advised

 

  • In the first case, page will load faster because browser doesn’t have to download the bigger image.
  • In the second case thumbnail image quality might be better because the original image itself is being used.

 

Please check if your manager will allow a new project with no corporate content to be sent. Preparing that might result in a different behaviour that you can investigate and if not then I have something to look at.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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I appreciate all the suggestions, I really do. The issue is not corporate content, which I could easily eliminate; I'm pretty sure any external upload site will be blocked on my end. (I've been down this road before.)

 

I just discovered that Update 7 is available for me now, so I'm going to install that in the next day or so. Maybe if I start over, some of these issues will just go away. 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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I'm doubtful but applying the update will prove it one way or the other.

 

Try using a search tool or the search within File Explorer to search for *_th.png. They have to be there. I notice you said Outputs > Images rather than Outputs > Output folder > assets > images. I think that was just shorthand though.

 

Have you tried wetransfer.com as that seems to get through most corporate filewalls? If push comes to shove in your efforts I'm sure IT could help.

 

Meantime though, I'm stuck in helping you further.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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Yes, \images was just shorthand for the full path. I did search for the _th.png files and nothing turned up. (I did see them once in the output \images subfolder, but I think I overwrote that subfolder in a subsequent test and they never came back.) For me, the two thumbnail options seem to be behaving the same way.

 

I just can't imagine that everyone is having this many problems with the Frameless layout (I haven't even posted about all of the issues I've run into because you've already spent so much time trying to help!). 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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This issue seems to be just you, that's what I am struggling with. It works for me.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 16, 2022 Mar 16, 2022

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Okay, random suggestion time. I was seeing the same problem with RH2019 just then. In the preset I selected a different skin and regenerated. And then I could see the _th suffix in the code. Changing back to the original skin now generates the _th suffixed images as expected. Maybe that will work for you as well. 🙂

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 17, 2022 Mar 17, 2022

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@Amebr You might be on to something there. When testing this I did find I couldn't see an _th image and thought maybe I was looking in the wrong place. Then I generated with both options and used Beyond Compare to find the difference to ascertain where I should be looking.

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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New Here ,
Mar 17, 2022 Mar 17, 2022

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I love all this detective work! You guys are great!

I was able to create a project on C:. It didn't make any difference in the thumbnail situation, but generating output is now a bazillion times faster, so that's a win. Plus for some reason, moving the project to C: solved my disappearing index problem (which I hadn't even brought up yet on this forum :).

I wondered whether the problem was with the skin (even though I've tried this with several fresh copies of Studio), so I created a new frameless preset and generated output using the Orange skin. I made sure to select Create Thumbnails for Images in the preset. Same result---no _th.png files in the output folder. This is the relevant code I see in the topic:

class="popup-image-thumbnail" src="../../assets/images/Login_screen.png" title="Log In Screen" data-rhwidget="Basic" data-popupimage="../../assets/images/Login_screen.png" width="613"

The first path looks like a hyperlink (blue and underlined). I also notice that when I use the Orange skin, the "X" button to close the pop-up looks right, unlike the problem I mentioned above with the "X" button and Studio.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 17, 2022 Mar 17, 2022

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The longer the path, the longer it takes to get down it. 🙂

________________________________________________________

My site www.grainge.org includes many free Authoring and RoboHelp resources that may be of help.

 

New Users: Default forum names can be changed in your Account Settings.

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