How much to charge client for project files?

[shelleyp82438848]

Have a client that wants all Premier and AE project files for a job we are doing for them.  They want to take the files and edit in-house should anything need to be changed in the future.  How many out there charge for this?  How much?

[SJRiegel]

This is not just LA -- its U.S. copyright law. Some designers do hand them over, but in the U.S., they are not required to.  

Who Owns the Rights to Your Design Work?

[Carlos Ziade]

This is only limited to design work

but what if you have footage for the client's properties ? footage for the client himself walking in his company ?

did you design all this ? there are assets in there that belong to the client

[Kat Gilbert]

Copyright laws are complicated. I always made sure that the client knew the aspects of what and who owns what. Yes, you were hired for a task, if work was accepted by client they also need to know that your reputation is also tied into the work produced thus you still have a very invested interest in the product thus if changes are needed you should be the first to be contacted.

I held original files and made sure that if anything needed revisions I had the option to make these. If I opted out then it was my choice to pass the files over with the understanding that my company's name would no longer be connected to the work.

It is not a black and white area and the working relationship with the client often dictates the course of action. Explaining to the client why you are the one who needs to make any revisions is key...

[shelleyp82438848]

Very helpful...thank you

[shelleyp82438848]

It is complicated and a lot depends on the relationship with the client

[Carlos Ziade]

I completely agree with Kat that if any changes should be applied, politely

you as the creator must be the first to be contacted. After all the best

solution is to discuss all those stuff with the client beforehand,

depending on the complexity of projects. If it is a very complex motion

graphics work with 3D and advanced color grading and editing, then i would

set the right and fair contracts with the client before starting any

work... but if its a simple 1 or 2 days routine task like simple and fast

stuff i would not lose another day setting contracts that are meaningless

in this case, i will give the client all their stuff and even delete

everything from my workspace

[Chuck Uebele]

"This is only limited to design work

but what if you have footage for the client's properties ? footage for the client himself walking in his company ?

did you design all this ? there are assets in there that belong to the client"

Carlo, my neighbor teaches copyright law, and just gave a talk on it at our local camera club. There are two different issues here: one is copyright of the work that your produce, which, unless is work for hire, is yours. The other about image of the client's property and of the client is not a copyright issue, but a model release issue. The photographer/videographer can't use images of them without their permission, even though the photographer owns the copyright.

[joel_clements]

International copyright law places ownership fully in the hands of the creator. Music. Photography. Film. Design.

Unless your contract clearly states that ALL intellectual rights are transferred to the client upon project completion (who the heck would do that, and why?)… the designer owns those files and all the rights that automatically apply to them. The client can't hire someone else to copy the design without infringing on the original designers copyright.

[D Fosse]

It's well worth reading, and re-reading, the link posted by SJRiegel. I'll repost it here for convenience: Who Owns the Rights to Your Design Work?

Under European copyright law you automatically have full copyright to your work. You can then decide to sell whatever parts of it you choose. As the creator, you have full rights to decide what to distribute and what not. This is automatic, from the instant the work is created. Anything else needs to be specified by prior agreement.

In an employment situation, it's natural to hand over shared rights to your employer (I'm in that situation). But you still have your original copyright! To share that with an employer (or perhaps hand it over completely) - you need to make an agreement to do so. I have, in written form.

Common sense applies here. Obviously an employer won't hire you if you refuse to give away your exclusive copyright. It's equally obvious that you can't use any of the material in a way that might harm your employer.

But for freelance work - your work files are your own. Unless specifically agreed - or there are very special circumstances that naturally suggest otherwise.

Common sense actually plays a large part in copyright law. It's the guiding principle. That's why it tends to get complicated.

[Brad Lawryk]

I have always handed over the source files. 99 times out of 100 the client has no idea how to use them anyways. I always tell them that support stops with the handing the files over. They need help it's a pretty hefty charge. It's usually worked out better for me to just hand them over (with the exception of any copyrighted material such as fonts and original unedited stock images).

[Brad Lawryk]

I should also add that I always remove my name from the work as well.

[Erik_Lord]

While I don't make it a default habit to provide source files at the completion of a project, I do if they so request, and/or certainly if it's so specified in the contract.

However, in any case where I do give the source files to the customer, I make the same note as Brad - support stops, as I don't then know what changes they've made to source/published. If they need my help later, its a new project and they must hand over the latest source back to me (or note 'no changes since last project' and I'll work with my source...but then no complaining if they say 'why is the text different'?! ).

[susannes52621117]

Unless the project is a work for hire, the creator of the original work id the owner of the intellectual property, this applies to scenarios even without a contract.

A contract is always a good idea, and it is a worthwhile investment to hire a business/ intellectual property attorney to write a contract template (our studio did).

The contract should have an ownership clause that clearly outlines the terms.

As for compensation, the typical cost for source files is 300% of the total project cost.

The below-referenced blog post very well explains that the client typically pays for the final product, not the tools used to create the final product.

“My Designer Won't Give Me My Files!” | Breakaway Graphics

[mgover77]

Contrary to what many have said in this thread, your client DOES NOT have a right to your working files unless your contract or estimate states that you will provide those files as part of the project deliverables. You decide what files you hand over and how much you will charge. If you were an employee however, this would be different.

[NanoQuanta]

Sure

[NanoQuanta]

So what support are you providing with this topic? Hire one more to look at it?

[opaciuszko]

I think, for me personally, so I can't speak from an entirely legal point of view, but...

When I used to work full-time in-house as a video editor then my employer owned all my work, e.g. an After Effects project file.

But now I'm freelance my employer owns only the finished export, not the process I went through to make that export.

Sure, if I've created images or assets as part of that project then I would probably share those - exported to specified formats, and perhaps with an additional charge if it's a considerable amount of time - with my client, but not the project file itself.

I cannot fathom any reason for a client to request a project file that couldn't equally be solved by asking me what they would intend to do with it, e.g. if they want to do some exports in other formats, they can just ask me, and if the reason they're not asking me is because they might have to pay me more then that's a business trying to get away with not paying somebody for the work they do and that's pretty shoddy behavior.

If there are rushes that I've shot for the video then I would probably be happy to share those with the client too, it would be good to establish a cost for those up front, and make sure the client knows - in those instances - that receiving a copy of all the rushes would require an additional charge.

I have had instances where a client has sent me rushes - misplaced their own rushes - and then requested a copy of my rushes, and in those situations I've been happy to just send them their rushes and hope they keep better back-ups in the future.

To use a terrible analogy; you meet the carpenter to talk about the table you want them to build, the carpenter builds the table, you get the table, you don't own the carpenter's arms and tools as well.

The client is asking you to make a finished video, you are telling them how much of your time it will take and how much your time costs, they are not paying for anything other than that finished video which requires x hours of time, they don't even need to know *how* that video comes to be, because, essentially, that's of no consequence to them provided they get their video.

[vedzzusk89348257]

It is customary to include additional costs for native files. How much of a mark up is really up to you. It can range from 1/3 the project cost to 300% the project costs.

[Mo Moolla]

This depends on the original agreement

On TVC's that I do the client owns the footage once they have paid in full.

Should they wish to archive and use my storage facilities they are bilked separately.

But...on smaller projects without anything in writing, legally the client owns the footage

Mo

[Peru Bob]

https://forums.adobe.com/people/Mo+Moolla  wrote

Should they wish to archive and use my storage facilities they are bilked separately.

Is that a typo or a Freudian slip?

[bkeys73]

I look at it like this...when you go to a restaurant, you are paying for the final meal.  You don't walk out of the restaurant with the uncooked food that was leftover from making the meal. You don't force the chef to give you the recipe for your amazing deliverable. A bride is paying for the final cake. Does she force the baker to give her the recipe? We are artisans. What we do requires a special skill set that the client couldn't perform without us. We own all rights to the footage shot on our cameras as well (unless stated otherwise).  Now if you are just hired as a shooter or it's agreed to that you are "work for hire", then cough up the footage. Anything else, they need to pay.  

[KShinabery212]

Charging is a difficult thing to consider without more information.

My first question is....

Is the project for local usage, national usage, or international usage?

Second question is...

What are you creating? 

Third question...

How long will it take you to complete the project?

Fourth is not a question but a recommendation...

Only allow the client to ask for three changes.... any additional change should cost extra.

Another pre-project question...

How much time goes into pre-planning?  How are you coming up with the idea?  Are you doing a sketch first? 

There are so many questions that go into pricing a project.  I could go on and on and on. 

It is tough because you do not want to under price and you do not want to over price.  And there are always fools who will do it cheaper.  But let us know more details.

[marlowef54905319]

interesting replies from all, though noone has answered the second very important question... "how much"? ie. IF it is reasonable/expected/in-the-contract to charge for the project files, how much should that be? ie. if the project cost (for the main deliverables) was $10k, should one charge 5% of that? 10%...20%???

personally, i find it a total pain the arse to receive someone else's project files and try and rethink that into my own workflow. everyone works their own way so i'm not really sure there's a ton of value in having the full project files. for video work i can see that it could be useful to receive the edit stems for the previously delivered edit, but beyond that i want to build something unique from my own storytelling perspective and ability.

the only reason a client would ask for it is so they don't have to hire you again if they don't want to.

i'm facing this exact problem right now. the agency has told the client that it will cost them (they also want to keep the work if possible!). but how much? anyone else have a good formula?

cheers

[Nancy OShea]

Pricing of goods and services rarely have set formulas other than what the market will bear in your region.

[Nancy OShea]

PRICING RULE OF THUMB:

Cost of Goods  +  Your Labor  x  Your Magic Multiplier = TOTAL PRICE.

Cost of Goods:

===========

Licensing fees for fonts, stock images/video/artwork/music; apps/widgets; DVDs, proofs/prototypes and other deliverables that are handed-off to client at completion.

Your Labor:

========

No less than $35/hour (more if you're experienced).

Magic Multiplier:

=============

No less than 1.5% to defray your costs for phones, Internet, utilities, rent, taxes, dues, postage, equipment, insurance, office supplies, advertising, travel to client meetings, etc... 

===================

HYPOTHETICAL PROJECT

===================

Costs: $400

Labor: 10 hours x $35/hr = $350

Magic Multiplier: 1.5%

--------------------------

PRICE: $1125