Switching a font from Type 1 to TrueType. Will they be different?

New Here ,
Nov 14, 2008 Nov 14, 2008

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Hi all,
My company's corporate font is Univers, and for the past 8 years we have been using a Type 1 version for all our literature and materials. I recently was given a new workstation (HP EliteBook 8730w) and the video driver doesn't like Type 1 fonts. There's no telling how long it will take for HP and NVidia to come up with a new driver, so we're thinking about buying a the TrueType version of Univers so I can still do my job.

My biggest concern is that I have numerous brochures (built in InDesign) that go through regular updates. Are there any issues that I should be aware of if we do switch to the TrueType version? Is there a chance that the fonts will be different enough to throw off my layouts and force me to re-format every printed piece that I have to update? Is there a chance that InDesign won't recognize the TT version as being the same font?

Thanks in advance,
Dave

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Community Beginner ,
Nov 14, 2008 Nov 14, 2008

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A number of things here.

Primarily, you can't have two different versions of the same font
installed at the same time.

ANY two different versions of the same typeface, regardless of format,
even if from the same vendor, may not be identical, and may result in
reflow differences as a minimum.

There are also intrinsic differences in the fonts themselves. The
mathematics of the way the shapes are created are different between T1
and TT. The two formats use different techniques for hinting. The
rendering engines that interpret the font to display on a screen or
convert them for placing ink on the printed page are also different.

Most of the time, these differences can only be seen under close
analysis; sometimes however, they are significant.

When you DO get the correct driver, you have to be careful not to
install two different fonts with the same name ... any OS WILL get
confused, with unpredictable results.

- Herb

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New Here ,
Nov 14, 2008 Nov 14, 2008

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Thanks Herb. Hopefully HP will come through with a new driver. However, if they don't and we do end up buying the TT version, I will make sure to remove the T1 versions before installing the TT and just keep a close eye on my documents when/if I need to revise them.

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New Here ,
Dec 12, 2008 Dec 12, 2008

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Hi Herb,

Could you tell me if I can rename one the fonts and install them both?

A

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 12, 2008 Dec 12, 2008

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> Allen, while running, asked:

> Could you tell me if I can rename one of the fonts and install
them both?

Yes - but you have to change the INTERNAL font names, not just the
external FILE name, which except for the extension (if Windows)
carries no meaning. In general, it takes a font editor such as FontLab
or Fontographer. You can use FontCreator to change the fontnames for
truetype fonts only. It has a free trial available.

If it's a member of a family, with bold, italic, etc. variants, you'd
need to change all members of the family and keep the relationships
intact.

- Herb

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Dec 12, 2008 Dec 12, 2008

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On behalf of Adobe, I would strongly recommend that you not hack around like this with fonts. Solve the real problem. Don't use a workaround that will could cause more problems than it will solve.

- Dov
- Dov Isaacs, former Adobe Principal Scientist (April 30, 1990 - May 30, 2021)

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 12, 2008 Dec 12, 2008

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Dov - In principal, I fully agree with you. However, in practice,
there are some situations where ONLY truetype fonts can be used.

Examples include embroidery programs that do their own rendering to
'convert' from text to stitches in a design file. In this case, font
quality isn't an issue, given the the comparitively low resolution
available when using thread instead of ink or pixels :)

While a font manager would be appropriate for switching between T1 and
TT versions of a font, in our multi-tasking world some people would
really like to be able to have both a high quality original Adobe T1
font installed for preparing a document while taking breaks from an
embroidery digitization task.

- Herb

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Dec 14, 2008 Dec 14, 2008

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In the general case, in investigating such programs, we have found that in fact, they really don't need TrueType fonts as opposed to Type 1 or OpenType CFF fonts, but rather, improperly parameterize their OS calls to exclude anything other than TrueType. Such programs do not do their own rendering, but let the OS do it and for which it is irrelevant whether the font is TrueType or Type 1. Examples of programs that improperly set their calls to exclude Type 1 fonts are Apple's FileMaker Pro and Microsoft's Visio.

- Dov
- Dov Isaacs, former Adobe Principal Scientist (April 30, 1990 - May 30, 2021)

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Community Beginner ,
Dec 14, 2008 Dec 14, 2008

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That's VERY interesting, and certainly makes sense for programs like
Filemaker and Visio, where fonts are used simply to display text. I
wonder if it's equally true for programs like embroidery applications
who's primary font use is essentially to convert the outlines to a
completely different format. The only way they could use the operating
environment's rendering engine would be to take the output and
internally auto-trace it.

I think it's much more likely that they interpret the outline data
itself and do their own rendering. The ttf-only requirement is
pervasive across every embroidery application that has such a
function. Although there are some 'families' of applications that use
common libraries, there are also a half-dozen or so radically
different programs that all work only with truetype. Off-hand, I
forget what they are, but I remember that there are a couple of
applications other than embroidery that do a similar function and also
use only TT fonts.

On the other hand, I've been wrong before :)

- Herb

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Enthusiast ,
Dec 15, 2008 Dec 15, 2008

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The underlying problem for the original poster was resolved in another thread.

--- start of email from HP ---

Good news. Nvidia has identified the problem and provided a fix. The way it was explained to me, Windows expects the device driver to be a certain size (maximum). In this case, the nvidia driver is slightly larger than expected. A simply registry entry will resolve the issue in WinXP (the issue doesn't occur in Vista).

To resolve the problem, do the following:

Open the registry editor (regedit)

Navigate to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Session Manager\Memory Management

Add a new REG_DWORD entry called SessionImageSize with a value (decimal) of 20

Reboot

The Type 1 fonts should now open/install without any problems.

--- End of HP email ---

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New Here ,
Dec 15, 2008 Dec 15, 2008

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LATEST
Yes it was. And contrary to personal experiences from a few years ago, the tech support from HP on this was excellent. Once I got to tier 2 support, they were very responsive and I had direct phone/email access to my support rep. For having to deal with HP *and* NVidia, this was resolved rather quickly.

http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?128@@.59b61a73

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