What have I done to deserve this?

[Yammer]

Using the Adobe forums has had its foibles, but this last update is the final straw.

It's slow, it's confusing, it's lacking familiar features. It's making my participation unnecessarily difficult and unpleasant. It's supposed to be a community where Adobe users help each other out, but, as someone who likes to give back what I receive, I'm just not going to bother if the new format makes my life difficult. It's not like I'm getting paid to help solve people's problems.

At last, the auto-login feature was fixed, but I'd gladly have that problem back if it meant that the website was faster, it was easier to see which threads were new and mark all as read when I'm finished. Notifications are now so confusing I am ready to give up, rather than try to respond quickly.

Someone at Adobe should read this this book: Advanced Common Sense - Don't Make Me Think

[Phillip_M_Jones]

most people agree. But adobe has been sucked in by JIVE and can not or will bot get out. Why in the world they did use Phpbb I'll never know. Even on of the Moderator (i guess) that the system we have and originally got from JIVE was never ever meant to Forums such as these. But the Front off was anxious to unload the forums to whomever would take it up.

[Guest]

Could not agree more.  As you probably noticed I have dropped out of forums since the last update.  Here is my list which I have posted on several of these threads.

I have been answering questions mainly on the Bridge and Photoshop Forums since 2007.  Since then the Forum has gone through many changes.  I have also been active in the Forum Comments Forum over the years to make changes so the forums are more friendly.  It seems like each time the forum format is "enhanced" many useful features are eliminated.  Through the constant repeating of comments of the heavy hitters many of the features were reinstated, only to be eliminated with the last change. 

Major Forum changes occurred about two weeks ago, and of course negative comments flowed on the Forum, but this time this time the heavy hitters seemed to say "we have lost the battle, the Forum is not going to be changed, so just adjust or quit".

We responders are volunteering our time and knowledge to benefit the Adobe users.  Many of us feel Adobe has much to gain to keep us happy as they get excellent user feedback with almost no outlay of money.  But many of the omissions make it difficult to read and respond to the Forums.  We are getting NO positive help from Adobe or MVP's to indicate anything will be done to correct critical omissions.  In my opinion those are:

1.  Point system fouled up and broken.  Only top 6 responders listed, down from 10.  There is some satisfaction to make the top 10, although points hard to get now.

2.  Can not see who  responded last - useful to know as some responders are a must read as one can learn from them.
3.  Overview tab does not list number of responses

4.  Content tab does not list list time since last response, only time of response (useless).

5.  There is no (updated) after thread you have visited.   Makes it more difficult to see if there has been a response since your last visit.
6.  Huge amount of wasted space on page

7.  Can not jump to last comment - how long did it take to get that included last time?  Have to scroll through the entire page(s) to get to last comments

6.  No breadcrumbs at bottom of page - how long did it take to get that included last time?  The back arrow does not always work the first click. 

For me these items makes it difficult to read and respond to questions.  So just want to you to know I am dropping out of the Forums.  It has been fun, but the changes no longer make it fun.

[John T Smith]

>heavy hitters seemed to say "we have lost the battle, the Forum is not going to be changed, so just adjust or quit"

From what I've read in another message, Jive 4.5 was "heavily" customized, and Jive refused to keep supporting such an old version, so... the upgrade to Jive 7

Whatever the pros/cons of the J7 interface changes, the "orientation" changed between J4x and J7... J7 is now more like Facebook, where people in a company "follow" each other via forum postings... and every time you post to a message, you must click the Follow option at the top right and select Stop following our you will AUTOMATICALLY be added to a follow list for that message, and every future addition to the message thread will result in a notice in your inbox

Since this is part of the design of J7 it can't be changed... which I guess is "great" if you look at J7 as a "social networking" program

You are not the only person who has said he may stop helping in the forums... which is going to be a big loss in one particular forum (not going to say who, because this was via PM)

I am retired and enjoy trying to give back for all the help I've received over the years... but even being retired so I have more time (other than the wife's job jar list) there are parts of J7 that are a PITA... such as what I wrote above about the automatic following

I'm not going to leave... but I do understand people who do leave... John

[Guest]

John, thanks for your explanation, whether the whole story or not, it makes sense.  I do not do social media so my revulsion of Jive 7 is understandable.  Don't think the Like and Follow are appropriate as we are here to answer questions and get answers, not to make new online "friends".

Your info reinforces what some have been saying.  Jive 7 is not acceptable as a web service for these Adobe Forums.  But I am afraid the die is cast and I am just a dinosaur in the Cloud.

[Claudio_González1]

Curt, you are not the only dinosaur around here. If we could survive the first transition to Jive -which was much more traumatic than this "up/down_grade"- why shouldn't we be able to survive this chaos? After all, people like Madison and Dave Merchant are doing a great job to patch as much as they can. Why not give them a chance?

[Guest]

Claudio, I think the difference now is HOPE.  With the first transition to JIve there was lots of traumatic changes for sure.  The "heavy hitters" had quite explicit suggestions, and some were banned from site for not shutting up.  But it seemed like in those days John C. took all of the comments and composed a list to things to fix.  Not all of the items were fixed or restored, but many were.  I do not see that kind of statement anywhere now, so HOPE for changes is dim.  Jive 7 is now more like Facebook and the features we lost that made the site helpful and easy to navigate for answering questions are probably not and easy fix now.  So therefore, I will continue to check in, but have little hope that the forum format will see anything beyond a few bug fixes.

[John T Smith]

>I do not see that kind of statement anywhere now

There are some discussions in the MVP forum, but I won't post those links because you have to be an MVP to go to that forum

But... some fairly recent discussions in this forum that may give you an idea of what is being talked about

Jive 7: Questions, Answers, & Updates

i feel the current incarnation of the forum discourages participation

New Forum format

Forum changes

Please give us breadcrumbs at the bottom of the page and more

[Phillip_M_Jones]

I really haven't seen John's name on the forums Does he still even work for adobe?

[John T Smith]

John C is retired, Madison Murphy is the new Adobe-Admin person... she is active in some forums, including some behind the scenes work on fixing minor Jive problems

But, as I said in #3 some things are internal to J7 and may not be changed

[John Waller]

https://forums.adobe.com/people/john+cornicello+(retired)

[Claudio_González1]

Phillip, for about a couple of months and until this morning, there has been a link at the top of the main page of these forums for the announcement of John's retirement. I thought there was no oldtimer that didn't know this.

[Phillip_M_Jones]

No I didn't know. For a while I have been slacking of on the adobe forums after I was appointed a Community Moderator on the MicroSoft. Answers forums. By the time I worked my way back I suddenly found I was signed in and using this new system.

Plus the way I get into forums. I receive email notifications and respond to the notification by clicking on the links. In the notification. It's a pain to go on website and go each of the forums and scan all the Topics. I only view and Post to those I get notice of.

I guess when went Bonkers having to put up with complaints from us and having deal with an intransigent Jive who don't want or don't care what we want. If I was in his place I would have retired as well. Probably will take him ten years to get over job.

[Yammer]

It's comforting to know that others feel the same. I have been most active in the Camera Raw forum for about six years, and I know Curt from the Bridge forum. I came to this forum because I have had a complete lack of information on the recent "upgrade" and wanted to find out if there was a "make this all right" button, or a discussion on how these problems were all temporary.

Bridge has always seemed to be a low priority to Adobe, but as far as the forums go, I guess it comes down to the luck of the draw, and whether any product staff volunteer their time on that particular forum.  Camera Raw used to see more staff/user interaction when I first started.  I certainly suggested a few improvements which where incorporated into the product, and although I don't claim to be responsible, I'm sure my suggestions were noted. Maybe if Bridge staff had used the forums it would be a better product.

Adobe is missing a trick here, if it drives volunteers away from the forums. It will create more work for support staff, surely. They will also lose informed feedback from old-timers, and, although I guess the management don't really care, the staff who read the forums will witness a dumbing-down and reduction of useful observations. Maybe they aren't too happy either.

[Phillip_M_Jones]

The support at Adobe, they don't care either all they are interested in is a pay check. And somewhere to hang out away from home.

[Jacob Bugge]

What Claudio said.(said by another old native that has never considered considering social media).