Welcome Dialog

Welcome to the Community!

We have a brand new look! Take a tour with us and explore the latest updates on Adobe Support Community.


Why doesn't everyone just ditch this place?

Advocate ,
Aug 16, 2009 Aug 16, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Start up 3rd party forums elsewhere for a few major Adobe products, with software that meets these requirements:

- Must work

(i.e. Any forums other than Jiveware. )

Everybody knows competition makes you better, perhaps that's what Adobe needs right about now.  Problem solved! 

Views

14.5K

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines

correct answers 1 Correct answer

Mentor , Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009
I'm watching the train wreck.

Likes

Translate

Translate
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

I'm watching the train wreck.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Valorous Hero ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Hi all

While I'm sure some of you are viewing things here as a train wreck, a great many folks are finding helpful and timely responses in the assorted fora offered by Adobe.

Sincerely... Rick

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
LEGEND ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

It is interesting that most of the complaints about falling standards and dwindling participation come from the Photoshop area.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

John Joslin wrote:

It is interesting that most of the complaints about falling standards and dwindling participation come from the Photoshop area.

the oldest part of the forum.

I posted this in the Joke thread. I really think this is a calculated move by Adobe.

Its funny go to the Mac Photoshop forum I have never seen so many unanswered questions. And a lot of the answers are the blind leading the blind. I just don't care anymore, Why should I? Adobe doesn't care. I'm convinced Adobe has done this because their revenue is down not selling enough CS4s, a crappy forum will will drive people to spend money at tech support instead of come here. I also have a feeling that CS5 will not sell well either. Since its only Intel friendly. It should have been a Universal Binary like CS3 and 4. There are still many PowerMacs being used and with the down economy new computers just to use new Adobe software is not a priority. So we can see more layoffs and cutbacks at Adobe.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Who among the disgruntled has the bucks, and the Serverspace to create their own newsgroups

You would have to have  the following Groups.

Group for Forum problems

Acrobat Mac

Acrobat PC

Reader (could be under acrobat)

DreamWeaver Mac

DreamWeaver PC

PhotoShop Mac

PhotoShop PC

Flash Mac

Flash PC

Indesign Mac

Indesign PC

A Goof-off Forum

It would be preferred if the products were supported were seprated into Mac and PC camps.

For some reasons the PC Folks think Mac people are a bunch of dummies. while most Mac people don't care one way or the other. we take attitude what ever floats your boat.

Oh, and most of all it should be NNTP allow signatures, and use HTML so That images can be inserted as need within the message. If you you use small compact size images should not tax your computer. After 30 days old images could be deleted  for space.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Advocate ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Wouldn't be that expensive PJ, just purchase one of the hundreds of forum hosting services out there. You could probably combine most of those forums until volume picked up, but that's really the problem--getting anyone there.

But I guess if most of the complaints from from the Photoshop forums, there IS an alternative now if you google "photoshop forums".  What sucks is that some products (the two I use) don't seem to have *any* active forums anywhere, except on stupid yahoo groups which is worse than Jive (if that's possible).

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

I use Acrobat & Dreamweaver & Photoshop & Premiere/Encore... and will continue to read/post in those 5 forums as long as I find information that helps me use the software

I don't much care about the look of the forums... webx was uncluttered and fast, but seems to have reached the limits of functioning, at least according to the postings saying why it had to be replaced

When Jive works... it's OK... but it too has is faults (general slowness due to all the scripting and inability to go back to where you last read being the two biggest faults, for me)

Since we the users have no choice... I just read/post (less due to slowness) with what Adobe provides

Complaining does no (or very little) good... we can't force Adobe to do anything

I'm more interested in using the software I have, and exchanging ideas with other users, than in complaining about the forums (see line above)

Even with the previous forum software there was an ongoing ebb-and-flow of good-vs-bad answers... new people come in and post what they know, or think they know, and the world goes on

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
LEGEND ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

John T Smith wrote:

Even with the previous forum software there was an ongoing ebb-and-flow of good-vs-bad answers... new people come in and post what they know, or think they know, and the world goes on

True, but all the people I ever learned anything from have gone.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Valorous Hero ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Hi there

Since I've been taught this by my own spritual leaders, I'm fond of it ... You cannot possibly move forward while you are looking backward.

Perhaps it's time for you to become akin to one of those you are bemoaning. Shift gears and become the master, not a student?

Additionally, sometimes it's helpful to see new blood. Sometimes they aren't painted into their own mental corners and cause you to think in new ways that become amazing in and of themselves.

There is good in everyone and everything. You just have to be willing to see and accept it.

Sincerely... Rick

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

RoboWizard wrote:

Perhaps it's time for you to become akin to one of those you are bemoaning. Shift gears and become the master, not a student?

Well Padawan learner, that's the point why should we who have been teaching all these many years put up with this crap? JJ is one of the teachers.

Additionally, sometimes it's helpful to see new blood. Sometimes they aren't painted into their own mental corners and cause you to think in new ways that become amazing in and of themselves.

New blood is great when they know what they are talking about. When there is supervision they can be corrected when they screw up. That supervision has gone, so all you are left with is the blind leading the blind.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Valorous Hero ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Hi Buko

I'm not sure what you mean by Padawan learner. Please clarify. I am familiar with Star Wars.

I've been around the block a time or two. I guess I'd qualify as a Jedi Master with my own products. (RoboHelp and Captivate) I earn my living by facilitating classes on them. But if I were to approach Flash or Photoshop, indeed I'm much less than a Padawan. Such is life!

You said JJ is one of the teachers. That's fine. But it was JJ's post that was bemoaning the loss of anyone he learned from. This seemed to infer he wanted to learn more and wasn't going to because they were gone.

It's been my own experience that if a forum thread ends up with a blind leading the blind situation, group consensus will eventually override and provide a good outcome. I can't recall ever seeing a post that totally screwed someone up where the eventual outcome was just wrong and others would fall into the same trap.

It's best to keep in mind that we were ALL new once. And if you don't find yourself being a newbie yourself from time to time, you aren't growing. You are stagnant. That's not generally a good place to be! I like to grow.

Cheers... Rick

(Who is a happy Fireworks neophyte at the moment)

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
LEGEND ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

I have been using Photoshop since Version 3.0.


I am still learning. (Or I was!)   

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Well for being a master you certainly have a rookie mindset. I wish you well teaching everyone.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Valorous Hero ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Please do expound on the rookie mindset. I'm genuinely curious. And thanks for the well wishes. One can never have too much good karma!

My class reviews are always favorable. Then again, I never claim to know it all about anything. I feel that's a crucial component.

I suppose I have a rookie mindset because I don't choose to bemoan the forums? I just see the changes as being what you choose to make of them. They are what they are. I can report things to Adobe that don't seem to be working right. I might report them once and expect that by doing so they have seen and heard my report.

Sure, I could stomp off and totally forget about helping anyone else with products because I don't like the forums. But who would I really be hurting? Adobe? Not really. Who I would be hurting are those that come here to seek assistance with odd situations. Why would I want to inflict bad will toward them is beyond me.

Anyone may choose to stop participating at any point in time for any reason. Personally, I choose to stay and help because I recall being in similar shoes when I started out. And I'm happy that folks were there that saw fit to extend me a hand in my own time of need. I prefer to see it as paying it forward and helping others. I also feel that it helps me to retain my Community Expert status. (I'm also a Certified Expert in my products as well as a Certified Trainer)

Whatever the rest of you do, I wish you most of all peace and harmony. Give things time and room, they will settle.

I choose a calm and quiet path. One that seeks balance... Rick

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
LEGEND ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Rick


I am sure you are a very talented guy (you certainly have a lot of pretty badges anyway).


However you shouldn't jump to conclusions and you shouldn't assume that what applies in your forums applies in others.


The Photoshop gang (I hesitate to use the word community for obvious reasons) has lost 90% of its valuable members and the convenience of a zippy, functional forum software.


We don't get any solace from pious words from people who don't understand that.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Valorous Hero ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

LOL, it's funny you interpreted my words as being pious. I never intended them to be that way.

I think what we are seeing here is a difference in forum behavior. From my standpoint, the forums did nothing but improve. I'm really sad to see that so many folks percieve it so differently. Then again, I'm also aware that Adobe had two or three different forum platforms. So the platform I came from was likely different than the one you came from. I never experienced your platform so I have no real frame of reference.

There was lots of discussion about the loss of NNTP by some of the other Community Experts. Discussion that was quite heated at times. And demonstrations of how those folks used NNTP and how much easier and more effective it was in their minds. I recall watching one such session and thinking how it basically mirrored what I already did with basic E-Mail subscriptions. So from that aspect nothing changed. At least for me. I have to say that after having watched it, I'm really surprised at how frustrated folks were with the replacement. They claimed that E-Mail was not the same as Newsgroups. That part I understood but failed to see how it was all that much different from sorting in E-Mail. Then again, I know how difficult it can be to adapt to a different way of thinking once your mind has been made up.

It is unfortunate that there has been a loss of valuable members in the fora you frequent. I don't assume that everything translates directly. But I do find it odd that Adobe has 80+ different products. Yet what it would seem from the verbalization here is that Photoshop constitutes 99% of Adobe's business. I'm not totally convinced that's the case.

To me, the bottom line is that if everyone takes a deep breath and gives it time, it will stabilize. Will it be as fast as what you had before? Probably not. It would seem that any time you add more features, you sacrifice speed. I'm confident the folks at Adobe are doing the best they can with what they have been given. I know I certainly wouldn't want to be in their shoes trying to decide on a scalable platform that would work for everyone. It would seem to be a no-win choice. You choose this product and X number of users will be unhappy. You choose Y product and N number of users will be happy. It's always a compromise.

I will admit that some of the gizmos mean nothing to me and add no value. For example, the points system, list of Top Participants and the "More like this". I can easily ignore those things easy enough.

I do tend to find that the more pleasant I am about things, the better the service is I receive. It costs me nothing extra to smile and it may just make someone's crummy day a smidgeon better as a result.

Cheers... Rick

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
LEGEND ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Yet what it would seem from the verbalization here is that Photoshop constitutes 99% of Adobe's business. I'm not totally convinced that's the case.

Nobody is claiming that  – come on!


It is however, like it or not, the "flagship" product!


And the ship seems to be sinking – not helped by crappy support.

I know I certainly wouldn't want to be in their shoes trying to decide on a scalable platform that would work for everyone.

They decided and, unfortunately, it was an EPIC FAIL – to quote the vernacular.


Keep trying Rick, but you won't convince the Photoshop gang! 

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Advocate ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Wow Rick, a whole essay? 

My attention span is too short to read all that, buuuuut... saying a product doesn't constitute most of Adobe's business is a pretty lame excuse for standing by while it's support community is destroyed.  Some day I may become a Photoshop user (it is the standard...for now) and one of the first things I check before I buy something that expensive is how good the community support forums are.  Right now, were I to be in the market for that type of software, I'd probably pass Photoshop by.

PJ - me either, support for that feature could possibly push the price up to "not worth it" levels, yeah.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Advocate ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

RoboWizard wrote:

From my standpoint, the forums did nothing but improve.

Wait, this comment is pretty Jived up so I need to single it out.

(ouch, if you were an NNTP user)

How much is Jive paying you? 

From wha...what standpoint?  That of a Jive salesman?  Or the standpoint as in, you're standing on the ISS viewing the forums on Earth?

lawl.jpg

(So sorry, just a joke, don't take it personally.. lol)

Note: Photoshop was NOT used during the time that was wasted in the making of this graphic.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Mentor ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

What JJ said.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Advocate ,
Aug 17, 2009 Aug 17, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

RoboWizard wrote:

It's been my own experience that if a forum thread ends up with a blind leading the blind situation, group consensus will eventually override and provide a good outcome.

Perhaps, but the difference is 20 extra posts and a few collective hours of 'newbie' time vs. a fewer number of posts and quick, high quality answers. 

Productivity is clearly going down with the Titanic in this type of situation.  Jive being the iceburg. 

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Participant ,
Aug 24, 2009 Aug 24, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

RoboWizard Said: "Since I've been taught this by my own spritual leaders, I'm fond of it ... You cannot possibly move forward while you are looking backward. "

Tell that to a guy in a rowboat.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Adobe Community Professional ,
Aug 25, 2009 Aug 25, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

Saskatchewanobie wrote:

RoboWizard Said: "Since I've been taught this by my own spritual leaders, I'm fond of it ... You cannot possibly move forward while you are looking backward. "

Tell that to a guy in a rowboat.

Well, some rowboats are rowed while looking ahead, and not only gondolas.

On the other hand, only looking forward may be the certain way to get lost, maybe most seriously when failing to bear the past and thus failing to fully live in the present and embrace the future, or what is left of it, as is evident from Gondola no Uta, one of the greatest songs ever, especially in the core version under a different name, performed by one of the greatest actors ever in one of the greatest films ever.

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines
Advocate ,
Aug 25, 2009 Aug 25, 2009

Copy link to clipboard

Copied

So basically, Adobe's implementation of Jiveware is a leaky rowboat named the Titanic.  Got it...

Likes

Translate

Translate

Report

Report
Community guidelines
Be kind and respectful, give credit to the original source of content, and search for duplicates before posting. Learn more
community guidelines