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Adobe Cloud Price Increase

Explorer ,
Apr 16, 2013

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I only use Photoshop and Lightroom, and my monthly subscription is going up from $30 to $50.  I have been unable to find anywhere on the Adobe website to send a complaint.  There seems to be no way to penetrate Adobe's defenses against customer contact.  I found an online chat option but after 1/2 hour of waiting it simply dumped me back to the bottom of the queue.  Does anyone have an email address for an Adobe customer service employee who is fluent in  English?  Thank you!!!

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Adobe Cloud Price Increase

Explorer ,
Apr 16, 2013

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I only use Photoshop and Lightroom, and my monthly subscription is going up from $30 to $50.  I have been unable to find anywhere on the Adobe website to send a complaint.  There seems to be no way to penetrate Adobe's defenses against customer contact.  I found an online chat option but after 1/2 hour of waiting it simply dumped me back to the bottom of the queue.  Does anyone have an email address for an Adobe customer service employee who is fluent in  English?  Thank you!!!

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Apr 16, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 17, 2013

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Alas, customer service is not reachable by email.

This forum here is to discuss how the forums themselves work.

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Apr 17, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 17, 2013

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Is that a result of the one year intro rate expiring? If so, that's the actual price of Creative Cloud and there's not really a price increase. You can always cancel if you'd like but, I'm not sure what you want to complain about.

Have you tried this page for contact info?

http://www.adobe.com/company/contact.html?promoid=JZEGC

Bob

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Apr 17, 2013 0
Explorer ,
Apr 17, 2013

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I want to complain that $50 a month is too high for two programs and suggest Adobe offers more flexible pricing options for people not needing the whole suite of products.   I want to complain that Adobe doesn't offer it's customers any way to make a complaint. Yes, I've seen that contact page, it just forces you into FAQs or Knowledge based searches, doesn't put you in contact with a human being unless you're buying.  Sales is not the same thing as customer service.

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Apr 17, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 17, 2013

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You can subscribe to only one application for $19.99/month. For two that would be $39.98 and you'd save $10/month.

I'm sorry you're unhappy but besides the two apps, you're only other recourse is cancelling. The fact that $30/month was an introductory price is made pretty clear.

Bob

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Apr 17, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 17, 2013

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gspam1 wrote:

I want to complain that Adobe doesn't offer it's customers any way to make a complaint.

World's #1 way of reducing customer complaints, for sure.

Somewhere there's a manager thinking, "I can save another $500K a year by reducing my underworked customer service staff".

A self-eating snake, it is.

-Noel

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Apr 17, 2013 1
Explorer ,
Apr 17, 2013

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Bob Levine wrote:

You can subscribe to only one application for $19.99/month. For two that would be $39.98 and you'd save $10/month.

I'm sorry you're unhappy but besides the two apps, you're only other recourse is cancelling. The fact that $30/month was an introductory price is made pretty clear.

Bob

Bob,  that is incorrect.  Lightroom is not available as a subscription.  I was able to get through to online chat tonight and they confirmed that.  That is okay since I own Lightroom outside the Cloud, but Adobe hasn't said yet whether the forthcoming Lightroom 5 will require a Cloud subscription.  So it's not clear that you can buy two single applications, I think it's one or everything which is not very flexible.  Thank you for the sympathy, but I'm not looking for that, I'm simply  looking for a way to pass my complaint along to Adobe.  The Chat person doesn't do that either.  Thank you for attempting to assist.

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Apr 17, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 18, 2013

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gspam1 wrote:

…I'm simply  looking for a way to pass my complaint along to Adobe…

That would be as fruitful as sending a complaint to the tax collection authority in any country to complain about the taxes being too high.

I'm afraid once folks are locked in to the subscription mode, Adobe will raise prices freely.

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Apr 18, 2013 1
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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You're right. Sorry for the misinformation.

That said, I really think your best bet for a complaint to receive attention is by snail mail. So few people use that route that it has more impact. Try a letter to the CEO at their corporate headquarters in San Jose.

Good luck,

Bob

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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Bob Levine wrote:

...

Try a letter to the CEO at their corporate headquarters in San Jose.

Good luck,

Bob

Do you really think the CEO will even read it?

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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Someone WILL read it, Claudio...yes.

Bob

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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That's true, but I wouldn't bet that it will be the CEO.

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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Better chance of posting a complaint here, though.

Bob

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 18, 2013

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You could always air the issue on FaceBook. Companies such as Adobe can't stand Bad press and if it passed along on FaceBook then the general public sees it not just adobe users a risk to the sales of product.

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 18, 2013

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Bob Levine wrote:

Better chance of posting a complaint here, though.

Bob

But  the Brass don't read these forums.

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 18, 2013

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That was a very serious typo. Should have said, a better chance THAN posting here.

Bob

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Apr 18, 2013 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 18, 2013

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I did the math for my particular situation.

It will cost me anywhere between 250-650% more than previous pricing methods/policies.

Seems Adobe is just another one of those companies that is about putting the screws to its customers during the recession.

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Apr 18, 2013 1
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 19, 2013

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There is never a perfect solution for everyone. The math, however, is apparently working for a good deal of people based on the subscription and revenue numbers Adobe has been releasing.

Bob

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Apr 19, 2013 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Yeah.  No 1 solution works for everyone.  (And $50/month DEFINITELY doesn't work for me)

I'd like to do business with Adobe, cause the software is good, but I've yet to justify it is worth 2.5x my budgeted amount.  I would have to keep my current version software 2.5x longer than normal.  Half this problem stems from the fact that they hit me with the double whammy (Price increase AND tightened upgrade policy)

If upgrades to Web&Design Premium were back to the "2 versions back" policy, I could see a $800-850USD price being justified to upgrade to a non-Cloud version.  But this "You must be no more than 1 version behind to qualify for the upgrade pricing" is too much.

And if Adobe thinks that extending the upgrade policy to 2 versions, but then charging 2 different prices is a solution, it is not.

ie

CS6 > CS7 (1 version back, qualifies) = $799USD

CS5 > CS7 (2 versions back, "qualifies") = $1299USD  << That is disrepectful, and not a true "upgrade policy".

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Apr 19, 2013 1
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 19, 2013

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I get that this won't work for everyone because nothing does, but let's

get one thing clear...nobody as been hit with a price increase.

When you signed up you got an introductory rate that was clearly for one

year. That year is up.

Bob

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Apr 19, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Adobe is strictly out to make money if they burn a few bridges they don't care. Taking care of customers is of little use to them.

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Apr 19, 2013 1
Enthusiast ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Actually, Bob.  That's not exactly true.  You're assuming we are speaking from a $29.99/mo intro rate to $49.99/mo rate hike.  And yes, I agree with you, that an intro rate is just that, introductory.

But I'm speaking from a cost of ownership standpoint. I used to upgrade every 2 versions, spending about $800USD for the latest version of the 7 programs I use. Now, with Adobe's more restrictive "1 version back" policy, I would have to pay for 2 upgrades (CS5 > CS6 > CS7) at $800 a pop ($1600).

It's wonky to do the math, because before every 2 versions came out in 36 months.  Now, every versions comes out in 48 months (I'll use a median value between them and say 42 months)  So $800 for 42 months of ownership is $19.04/month.

There are 4 solutions I have here:

SOLUTION #1 - Upgrade to CS6, then CS7.  That's $800 per upgrade, $1600 total, over a lifespan of 42median months = $38.09/mo (a 100% price increase)


SOLUTION #2 - Buy CS7 Web/Design Premium outright at $1900.  Over a lifespan of 42 months = $45.23/mo (a 238% price increase)

SOLUTION #3 - Buy $50/mo Cloud Subscription.  Even taking intro year pricing into account that's $1860 over 42 months = $44.28/mo (a 233% price increase)

SOLUTION #4 - Buy 7 $20/mo App Subscriptions (to have only the apps I need). = $5880 over 42 months = $140/mo (a 735% price increase)

Solutions 1-3 give me more apps then I want/need.  Solution 4 gives me just the apps I need, but due to the horrible ala carte pricing method, once you need over 2 programs, you might as well get all 17 in the Cloud.

If $50/mo gets you all apps, I would find it reasonable that Web/Design OR Production could cost you $25/mo)  That would be a 31% price increase, and though steep, I would meet Adobe "halfway" and purchase such a price to stay on those apps at their latest version at that monthly expense.

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Apr 19, 2013 1
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 19, 2013

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You need to do the math for new versions every 12 months. That's what you're going to see from now on.

I also think it's important to point out that Adobe is not the only company to eliminate all this upgrade pricing. You cannot buy a MS Office upgrade. You cannot buy an Intuit upgrade. This is simply the way the software industry is moving.

I wrote a blog post a while back you might find interesting, especially the comments. http://boblevine.us/what-will-it-take-to-move-everyone-to-creative-cloud/

Feel free to chime in there. As I've said before, you never know who's watching.

Bob

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Apr 19, 2013 0
New Here ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Adobe is strictly out to make money

A charitable organization like Adobe should not practice rip-off tactics when it could give out its software free of charge.  All charities do that; Don't you think so?

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Apr 19, 2013 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 19, 2013

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With as small as the CS5 > CS5.5 upgrades were, and the previous announcement of a .5 version increase per 12 months, I can't see the half versions being considered a full version, nor would I choose to believe that Adobe could innovate to any noticeable degree by releasing full versions in a 12 month cycle.  It would be, in my mind, akin to Firefox, whom at around version 4 started coming out with full versions every 2-3 weeks (it felt).  They are now at version 20, seemingly treating major version revision numbers like they were minor versions.

Adobe hit consumers with a 1-2 punch, first taking away their upgrade options (again, I understand Adobe's moving away from the ability to have a piece of software qualify for upgrade when it was many versions behind, but I still feel a 2-versions back is more than respectable without forcing your customer base to shell out money, especially if they DO plan to decrease the product cycle timeframe)

Secondly, they put together some horrible ala carte functionality where once you hit 2 applications, you might as well get all 17.  How skewed is that? 

I understand the mentality, why buy 1 at $1 when you can get 2 for $1.75.  But to really entice the consumer and provide as wide an array of solutions to their needs as possible, Adobe could have EASILY done a proper ala carte system where 1 product was relatively expensive, but as you added more products, you saved more money.

As per your article indicated, single applications are inherrently expensive.  But with the Design and Web bundles being merged (now providing me with more applications that I don't need), there simply is no way to affordably get yourself the applications you want or to stay within a respectable budget.

There's something sinister about the Cloud.  How can you offer $50/month for EVERY application you make (ie, the Master Collection, a bundle far too expensive for many customers) and then NOT offer any type of alternate plan? And on top of that they say "Your upgrade pricing policy is now revoked.  1 version back, or you might as well pay full"

I don't think you can compare Office to CS.  For what Cloud charges per year, you can have access to EVERY Office tool for the next 4 years.  If you convert what MS did with Office to what Adobe SHOULD do with the "Master Collection", they would be charging $300/year (~$25/month), exactly the price I'd be willing to pay for just 7-8 products, not even all of them.

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Apr 19, 2013 1
Enthusiast ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Just to clarify my point, I fully understand Adobe has to make money.  All corporations do, otherwise you go bankrupt and then the company AND the users lose out.

I also understand that prices can fluctuate.  But Adobe needs to understand, too, that we're in a recession.  And even though the status quo seems to think "Recession = Jack Prices because people can afford more", the reality is quite the opposite.  Personally, I can go another couple versions without upgrading to a new version.  But with Adobe's overt fondness of money, I honestly now would not put it past them releasing patches that start to break older versions of their software.  I mean, if they heavy hand consumers in the current fashion, what's to stop them from going a step further?

Adobe has no competition.  The closest thing is the Microsoft Expression Suite, which is complete garbage.  Now, being the 800lb gorilla, Adobe's been free to either respect its customers or abuse them.

I am holding out final judgement until I hear what they have to say in May.  It hurts to have loved Adobe as much as I have, and now to say such seemingly mean things about them, but I have to call it as I see it.  When someone shows they only care about you for your money, it's only natural to look upon such people in disgust.

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Apr 19, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 19, 2013

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We can absolutely guarntee that the Brass atadobe will never see these forums. They can't be bothered

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Apr 19, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 19, 2013

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Get used to the concept that the software you want to use is going to cost more and more.  Lots more, as in twice as much twice as often.

Nobody cares how you feel about paying more as long as you pay it.

-Noel

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Apr 19, 2013 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 20, 2013

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I couldn't care less whether someone cares how I feel.  Not even sure why you brought this up.  Are you constantly concerned about what people think of your morales and ethics?

I'll vote with my wallet; it's the only power the consumer has, and it only gets the upper brass' attention when a large enough amount of others feel likewise.  In the event Adobe stays unreasonable with their pricing, I"ll just make due with what I have.  I'm sure the feature differences between CS5 and CS7 won't be significant enough to make this upgrade quandry that difficult.

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Apr 20, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 20, 2013

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gspam1 wrote:

I only use Photoshop and Lightroom, and my monthly subscription is going up from $30 to $50. 

You will be better off buying the products separately on a DVD from Amazon and you only need to upgrade them every two or three years.  There is absolutely no need to upgrade the products every time there is an upgrade.  I upgrade the products every two versions;  for example, I have got CS6 now and the next one won't be until CS8 or CS9 depending on what new features are there for me to benefit from.

Unforyunately, all companies are going for subscription model because people aren't buying new products.  the existing products are sufficient for most users and the new versions are simply the new GUI layout which people couldn't care less.

Hope this helps.

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Apr 20, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 20, 2013

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mytaxsite.co.uk wrote:

There is absolutely no need to upgrade the products every time there is an upgrade

You're aware that you can no longer get upgrade pricing if you don't actually buy EVERY upgrade, right?

-Noel

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Apr 20, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 20, 2013

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Yes i am aware but if you do the math properly, you will find that you will still be better off buying every three or four years down the line.  However, every body has different needs so they need to plan accordingly.

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Apr 20, 2013 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 20, 2013

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Take Photoshop CS6X to start off with.  Assume Adobe sticks with their declared new version rollout every 12 months.  Assuming on average that a full product costs $700 and an upgrade costs $200... (COO = Cost of Ownership)

Person A buys PS CS6X in 2013 - $700 spent COO = $58.33/mo

Person A uses PS CS6X in 2014 - COO = $29.16/mo

Person A uses PS CS6X in 2015 - COO = $19.44/mo

Person A uses PS CS6X in 2016 - COO = $14.58/mo

Person A buys PS CS10X in 2017 - $1400 spent - COO = $23.33/mo

Person B buys PS CS6X in 2013 - $700 spent COO = $58.33/mo

Person B upgrades to CS7X in 2014 - $900 spent - COO = $37.50/mo (29% more expensive)

Person B upgrades to CS8X in 2015 - $1100 spent - COO = $30.56/mo (57% more expensive)

Person B upgrades to CS9X in 2016 - $1300 spent - COO = $27.09 (86% more expensive)

Person B upgrades to CS10X in 2017 - $1500 spent - COO = $25/mo (7% more expensive)

This was the closest I could get to 0% by the end of the year before the upgrade-per-year person started being cheaper.  That means these prices promote those who cannot afford the more expensive prices to wait 5 versions before upgrading.  I'm sure Adobe doesn't want this.  Now look at Person A doing the same thing, but upgrading every 2 years (like as was previous to the current upgrade policy)

2013 - $700, on PS CS6X - COO = 58.33/mo

2014 - $700, on PS CS6X - COO = 29.16/mo

2015 - $900, on PS CS8X - COO = 25.00/mo

2016 - $900, on PS CS8X - COO = 18.75/mo

2017 - $1100, on PS CS10X - COO = 18.33/mo

The end result?  Adobe's current policy gets them an additional 37% revenue by having a 1-version back policy vs. a 2-version back.

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Apr 20, 2013 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
Apr 20, 2013

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Apr 20, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 20, 2013

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Thje problem everyone is worried about is: what comes after this grace period? And still worse, what about those many countries where the cloud versions are not available??

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Apr 20, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 21, 2013

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Claudio, I believe what Pierre is proposing goes something like this:

a) You have Photoshop CS5

b) You wait until less than a month before Photoshop CS7 is released

c) You buy the upgrade to Photoshop CS6 at the upgrade price

d) Adobe gives you a free upgrade to Photoshop CS7 when it's actually released

It seems to me to carry some risk to do this, because you're relying on Adobe to follow past policies of being "nice" and giving you that upgrade.  Policies change.

Thing is, Adobe will feel no slump in sales right before release from people with cloud subscriptions, so policies designed to mitigate that slump will surely be re-examined.

-Noel

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Apr 21, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 21, 2013

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That's what I thought Pierre was proposing, but I see no answer to either of my two questiions.

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Apr 21, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 21, 2013

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What answers are you hoping for?

Either Adobe will give a free copy of the next version or they won't.  I don't believe anyone not at Adobe can say with authority, and I'm quite sure no one at Adobe will be willing to say.

Regarding the second question...  Are you hoping for Adobe to say what's going on regarding cloud licensing in countries where it's not currently available?  I don't know of specific cases, but I imagine there are legal hurdles in some countries regarding signing people up to charge them money repeatedly going into the future.  Other than hypothetical discussions between us users, I imagine it will be the same answer as above.

Part of me wishes that it was illegal to set up recurring charges to credit cards here in the US as well, as people do occasionally have trouble with signing up with nefarious operators then being unable to stop being charged repeatedly (not saying this has anything to do with Adobe).

-Noel

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Apr 21, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 21, 2013

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Noel Carboni wrote:

Part of me wishes that it was illegal to set up recurring charges to credit cards here in the US as well, as people do occasionally have trouble with signing up with nefarious operators then being unable to stop being charged repeatedly (not saying this has anything to do with Adobe).

-Noel

Amen to that some customers of Microsoft and Adobe should file a Class action suite to prove these type arrangements are illegal.

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Apr 21, 2013 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 21, 2013

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My mother, back when she was alive and in her later years, was duped into subscription-based purchases of various things on the implication that it would increase her chances of winning the big giveaway prizes.  Would you believe that even after I closed her credit card account the credit card company continued to send her bills for ongoing charges - for 9 months after?!?  To terminate the trouble, it finally took a letter on legal letterhead informing said credit card company that the account was legally closed and the credit card company had damned well better start rejecting the charges because they weren't going to be paid.

-Noel

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Apr 21, 2013 0
Mentor ,
Apr 21, 2013

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Many people can't afford these arrangements and and 80% of the USA either don't have Internet or have bad Internet connection. Many are still using POTS, or using DSL over Potts, or Cable that haven't been updated in 30 years or more.  For Creative Cloud to work in its current incarnation you must have a Perfect connection to last as long as your computer is running.

Even now for me on Comcast Best Consumerpackage and at least 7 or 8 times a day I get the warning about unable to sync files. which indicates a dropped connection.  If it continues I'll never be able to sign up even if I could afforded it.

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Apr 21, 2013 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
Apr 20, 2013

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mytaxsite.co.uk wrote:

You will be better off buying the products separately on a DVD from Amazon

Can't do that anymore for Creative Suite products, either: http://boblevine.us/adobe-quietly-confirms-the-end-of-boxed-creative-suite-software-sales/

Bob

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Apr 20, 2013 0