Could we please know if a thread is locked without opening it?

Oct 23, 2009

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Navigation in these forums is very slow even when everything is working as planned, so it's very annoying to have to open a thread to find that it has been locked. The icon of a lock, even [Locked] at the beginning of the thread title would be enough. Surely it cannot be too difficult?

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Could we please know if a thread is locked without opening it?

Oct 23, 2009

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Navigation in these forums is very slow even when everything is working as planned, so it's very annoying to have to open a thread to find that it has been locked. The icon of a lock, even [Locked] at the beginning of the thread title would be enough. Surely it cannot be too difficult?

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Oct 23, 2009 0
Oct 23, 2009

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There has been a locked icon before. I have seen it. I have seen it a few times here and there but not no more (as you pointed out of course).

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Oct 23, 2009 0
Oct 24, 2009

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Claudio,

that would be communicating ... 

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Oct 24, 2009 0
Oct 24, 2009

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greenjumpyone wrote:

Claudio,

that would be communicating ... 

Hopper, you must be very brave. Using forbidden words is... well, somehow not very welcome by some people around here. Specially by those who decide which words are just not right. "Communicating"..., well, what could that concept possibly have to do at all with these forums?

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Oct 24, 2009 0
Oct 25, 2009

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<shaking head>  I know, I know ....  what was I *thinking*? That perhaps  a forum would be used for communicating and sharing of information and <gasp> to perhaps even have some social interaction!  No, that can't be it ...

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Oct 25, 2009 0
Oct 25, 2009

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greenjumpyone wrote:

<shaking head>  I know, I know ....  what was I *thinking*? That perhaps  a forum would be used for communicating and sharing of information and <gasp> to perhaps even have some social interaction!  No, that can't be it ...

No! No! No! No communication! It ist verboten!! Take your burger and go!!!

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Oct 25, 2009 0
Oct 25, 2009

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Oct 25, 2009 0
Nov 04, 2009

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Claudio González wrote:

Navigation in these forums is very slow even when everything is working as planned, so it's very annoying to have to open a thread to find that it has been locked. The icon of a lock, even [Locked] at the beginning of the thread title would be enough. Surely it cannot be too difficult?

I think this is a perfectly valid and politely formulated question/suggestion, so I expected at least an answer. Not only it hasn't been answered, but we continue having threads locked without any indication in their titles.

I also notice that we continue reading new posters giving users directions on what to do and how to do it, while some moderators openly and repeatedly recognize that the software used for these forums in notoriously defective, and explain why we cannot expect the many reported problems to be solved in a near future.

I am disappointed.

Message was edited by: Claudio González. Reason: I had to add here a comment that I couldn't post in the obvious thread because it had been locked.

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Nov 04, 2009 0
Nov 04, 2009

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Apparently it *is* too much to ask.  The Banned Users thread is locked ... without notice.  It is getting worse and worse.  I hope that Adobe, as a company, can survive the bad press it's getting.

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Nov 04, 2009 0
Nov 13, 2009

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Still no reaction and no answer...

Claudio González wrote:

Claudio González wrote:

Navigation in these forums is very slow even when everything is working as planned, so it's very annoying to have to open a thread to find that it has been locked. The icon of a lock, even [Locked] at the beginning of the thread title would be enough. Surely it cannot be too difficult?

I think this is a perfectly valid and politely formulated question/suggestion, so I expected at least an answer. Not only it hasn't been answered, but we continue having threads locked without any indication in their titles.

I also notice that we continue reading new posters giving users directions on what to do and how to do it, while some moderators openly and repeatedly recognize that the software used for these forums in notoriously defective, and explain why we cannot expect the many reported problems to be solved in a near future.

I am disappointed.

Message was edited by: Claudio González. Reason: I had to add here a comment that I couldn't post in the obvious thread because it had been locked.

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Nov 13, 2009 0
Nov 13, 2009

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Didn't a mod once say something to the effect of this Jiveware not supporting such a basic, trivial, common sense, and helpful feature?  For a short while I think topics were being changed to say [locked] in front but I assume it gets time consuming when you're busy locking so many of them.

Just another Jive flaw to add to the list.

A response to a politely asked question is always nice but I suspect the response won't be happy news anyway.

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Nov 13, 2009 0
Nov 13, 2009

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You are right, I was asking in a somewhat hidden way for the information to be added manually on each locked thread. And that would be very time consuming if one was very busy locking threads...

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Nov 13, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Well... some mods have the courtesy to do that:

http://forums.adobe.com/thread/519278?tstart=30

Others don't. And then they say we don't know how to behave!

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Yes, I know, and they should be commended for that. My appeal was to those who never, or almost never, do it.


In other very active forum I frequent, every moderator that deletes a message or locks a thread leaves a one line handwritten message with his/her screen name and the reason(s) for his/her action.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Over the last 24 hours I have deleted approximately 1500 messages. JC deleted a similar number. Before I started the Database Communication with JRun forum looked like the screenshot below:

jrun_database_communication.png

The spam in another forum is such that it is still closed while it is being cleaned up. Considering the magnitude of the spam problem we are fighting I think you find little support for a position that it is beneficial to leave a notice in place when a thread and/or message is deleted.

As to having threads marked in some way as locked, I would welcome a feature in the software to display that for those using the web interface. Your best bet is to go over to the Jive site and register an enhancement request for that. Moderator support for manually adding something to thread titles is probably sketchy. Those who support it already do it (when not made impossible by the inaccessibility of these forums on some devices). Those who don't, don't.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Is there  away you with your Current powers (not just yourself but the adobe adminstrators) impliment a Filtering system to simply prevent the spam happening. Have it Filter of specific words used in obvious spam.

Otherwise the only way to cure spam is use an authenicated NNTP Server. Or on a Secure NTTP Server.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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No.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Jochem, for posts, I think that perhaps all that it would take would be to make " - this indicates when changes were made and by whom." the selected option by default. I think this would also solve the numbering and related problem left by disappearing messages. 

Message was edited by: Claudio González. Reason: checking the text of the option.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Sorry we are having so much trouble.

Shame there is no magic button we could press on Spammer that would send a signal to burn out their computer, modem and, Router.

WE need enforceable laws on the books where anyone sending blatant Spam could be subject to  amandentory $100,000 per incidnet fine , or two year prison term with no time off for good behavior.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Phillip, all I am asking is a much simpler thing -in my opinion at least. But I haven't received any answer while you do. Curious.


Correction: I mistakenly thought that message #14 was in response to you. However, I think that my message #17 still applies.

Message was edited by: Claudio González. Reason: correction.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Claudio González wrote:

Jochem, for posts, I think that perhaps all that it would take would be to make " - this indicates when changes were made and by whom." the selected option by default.

As I explained in a previous thread that won't work.

You really need to take this up with Jive if you care so much about this. The software just doesn't support it.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Hi Claudio

For what it's worth, I do agree with you that one might expect the option to add a comment to be enabled by default.

The only issue I see with that, is that folks are often in a hurry and either simply don't have the time or don't wish to take the time to additionally add the reason for editing.

I'm thinking if the option were simply enabled by default, we might suddenly begin seeing lots of posts that end with something like this:

tmp1.png

And that would likely lead to more questions and frustration than we already see.

Cheers... Rick

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Captiv8r wrote on 11/14/2009 9:18 PM:

For what it's worth, I do agree with you that one might expect the option to add a comment to be enabled by default.

The only issue I see with that, is that folks are often in a hurry and either simply don't have the time or don't wish to take the time to additionally add the reason for editing.

Not all of us use the web interface for editing messages. So even if it

was enabled by default, even if it was impossible to disable it, it

still wouldn't catch all the edits.

If you want this, file an enhancement request with Jive.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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It would certainly catch the folks who *are* replying/editing from the web.

I would be interested to see the numbers on the folks who are only subscribed via email and those via the web.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Hi Hopper

Indeed it would be interesting to see. But I'd be a bit skeptical of the results. I figure most folks out there operate just as I do. I nearly always reply to posts using the Web interface. But I receive notifications of all the forums I'm interested in, via my In-Box.

Works like this. Someone asks a question.

E-Mail is transmitted to those subscribed.

I see the message and choose to reply, so I click a link.

Browser displays page, I click the reply button and either log in or reply.

As you can see, there is a blend of E-Mail and Web activity there.

Cheers... Rick

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Rick, I know there is a blend of email and web replies.  The point of my message was simply that just because we have email users doesn't mean the software couldn't turn on the edit response by default which would catch all of the web edits.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
Nov 14, 2009

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Captiv8r wrote:

Hi Hopper

Indeed it would be interesting to see. But I'd be a bit skeptical of the results. I figure most folks out there operate just as I do. I nearly always reply to posts using the Web interface. But I receive notifications of all the forums I'm interested in, via my In-Box.

Works like this. Someone asks a question.

E-Mail is transmitted to those subscribed.

I see the message and choose to reply, so I click a link.

Browser displays page, I click the reply button and either log in or reply.

As you can see, there is a blend of E-Mail and Web activity there.

Cheers... Rick

Your using the email Notifications system. That's what I do.

I don't want to be hassled with having to go to Forums web page, then bury down several layers get to the group (forum) I want to read then scroll to threads I want to read.

I only subscribe to just this forum and Acrobat Mac. I have strayed  several times. Once or twice deliberately. Most, I was dragged along with a move and wasn't aware. I had to unsubscribe to the thread, and the group I was Dragged to.  even on this I pick and choose to which I make a Comment in. Some subjects (in Acrobat) I have no clue what to suggest. Some I have exeperienced, some I look up the information I post. Some other have answered with a better answer than I could suggest.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
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Sorry, but most definitely no. I don't see why I should have to address Jive for anything. I am a user of Adobe products who frequent their forums. If Adobe cannot maintain a site with basic -and common- features such as this, it their responsibility, not mine. It is my responsibility to report such shortcomings when I notice them, but it's up to Adobe to do something -or nothing- about my reports.

What Adobe does or doesn't do with their user's reports tells users quite a lot about how much Adobe cares for them. By taking a look at this forum, I am afraid that the balance seems to be heavily on the negative side. Users have been reporting shortcomings since the very first day of the trial period, but results are nowhere in sight. Why, we are here, in middle November, still using version 2.5.7 of Clearspace, when we were told in May that some reported bugs had been corrected in more recent versions of the software. So, ask Jeeves? No, thank you. 


And this is not a criticism to you in particular, or to the moderators in general. You do what you can, with your different styles and peculiarities. Same as us users.

Correction: this is in response to message #20.

Message was edited by: Claudio González. Reason: correction.

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Nov 14, 2009 0
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I was asking in a somewhat hidden way for the information to be added manually on each locked thread. And that would be very time consuming if one was very busy locking threads


Ah, the "veiled reference." It was too subtle for me. I missed things, and apologize. I thought you were referring to the inclusion of the old Locked icon from the "good-old-days." Sorry to have been so daft on this one.

Mea culpa, mea culpa, my comments can be disregarded.

Hunt

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for posts, I think that perhaps all that it would take would be to make " - this indicates when changes were made and by whom." the selected option by default.


OK, I am still playing along, as the discussion seems to have moved to real world issues, or at least I think they have.

In most product fora, when a MOD does edit, or lock a thread, there is almost always a comment to that effect. It's always been similar to the "Edited by" tag line. Now, these particular fora probably get a bit less traffic than others here do. Also, even when logged in on basically an around the clock basis, I have seen scant little spam in any of them, so the work load is much less. In very high-traffic fora, this might just not be possible.

Hunt

PS - still, that little Lock icon would be helpful...

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I would be interested to see the numbers on the folks who are only subscribed via email and those via the web.

FWIW, here is one vote for Web-access only.

Years ago, when things were NTTP-only, that was my method. When Web came about, it did take some years to access via browser, as all of my news readers were set up for the "old way." I get too much e-mail to even bother with that access-point, but then I remember the ARPANET... [For me, that probably should read "AARP a NET."]

Hunt

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Nov 14, 2009 0
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the_wine_snob wrote:


In most product fora, when a MOD does edit, or lock a thread, there is almost always a comment to that effect.

Yes, Hunt, you are correct.  Here, it's up to the moderator and most (note that I did not say all) don't take the time to inform the readers of deletions/edits etc. They stealthily delete posts (messing up the post counts) or remove sentences/phrases/words from a post.  When one refreshes the main forum comments page, a thread might show an update.  If one were to click on the "last post", it will take you to a post higher on the list, because it had been edited.  It's very confusing if you had read the post previously, because now something is different and you don't know how, why or who made a change. 


If they are unable to put an icon next to the thread title, a simpe [LOCKED] would be sufficient.


If they are going to edit a post they could simply put  [edited for content by {put forum host's name here}].


Apparently that seems to be too much to ask. 

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When one refreshes the main forum comments page, a thread might show an update.  If one were to click on the "last post", it will take you to a post higher on the list, because it had been edited.

Claudio,

Thank you for the clarification. I had seen some threads, new to me, with references to Last Post, and to reply counts, and just did not get the issue. Now, it's cleared up - for me at least.

Thank you,

Hunt

PS - I guess that I hang in a bunch of backwater, low-traffic fora. Had not taken notice before.

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the_wine_snob wrote:

When one refreshes the main forum comments page, a thread might show an update.  If one were to click on the "last post", it will take you to a post higher on the list, because it had been edited.

Claudio,

Thank you for the clarification. I had seen some threads, new to me, with references to Last Post, and to reply counts, and just did not get the issue. Now, it's cleared up - for me at least.

Thank you,

Hunt

PS - I guess that I hang in a bunch of backwater, low-traffic fora. Had not taken notice before.

It was Hopper who wrote that, not me .

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I guess that that is what I get for turning off the Threaded View.

In that case, Hopper - thanks a bunch!

Hunt

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greenjumpyone wrote on 11/14/2009 9:42 PM:

I would be interested to see the numbers on the folks who are only subscribed via email and those via the web.

That is easy. Download a sample of messages through the webservices.

Remove everything from your sample where the difference between creation

and modification dates is more then a second since those are the

messages that were edited afterwards. Off the remaining messages those

with a few millisecond difference between creation and modification

dates are created through the webinterface.

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oh good lord, I am not going through any work for my query!  I was all but certain that information would be available, otherwise how does one keep track of their web stats?

Bottom line, just because you won't see the edit "comment" via the email replies does *not* mean that it should not be turned on for the web replies!  We already *know* we can't make this forum work for all formats anyway, so why not do what can  be done for the web view?

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Didn't a mod once say something to the effect of this Jiveware not supporting such a basic, trivial, common sense, and helpful feature?

You are probably correct, but I think I was sick that day and missed it.

There are other icons that differentiate attributes of a thread, and I pretty much find them useless. Heck, in the product fora, it's either a question, or a rant. There seems to be no icon for a rant. Now, a little padlock icon would be useful - more so than the question icon, at least from my standpoint.

I'm not pointing fingers at any particular forum software, but it seems that with a big client, such as Adobe, some of these little changes would be easier, than they seem to be. Of course, I do not know the details of the sale/service contract, or even how "things" work in the corporate world anymore.

Just musing,

Hunt

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Claudio,

I completely agree with you. In the by-gone, olden-days of the Adobe forum, there was that little Lock icon that you mention. It is missed and I'd cast my vote to bring it back.

It was a great "touchstone" for sub-fora, like FAQ's, as newer users could easily see that ALL threads were Locked, and could quickly get the idea that they should only be reading, and not posting there - not even comments on the FAQ articles.

I'd actually take things a bit farther and have sub-fora, like the FAQ's locked at the main page level, with only the MOD's being able to post there. Stickies are seldom seen. If a user, such as myself, needs/wants to post to the FAQ page, then a PM to the MOD's should do the trick.

I am also in agreement on the speed of the fora and how frustrating it is to hit a "deadend," and have to Back, or otherwise navigate out of it. Any help in keeping our experiences pleasant and expedient would be appreciated, and I would hope that more could be done in that regard.

Good point,

Hunt

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