forums.adobe.com Server Location

Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Perhaps the thread where we had idly discussed whether the servers are  located in Minnesota or whether Geotool gives misleading results was lost because it was in the temporary preview forum.  In any event, the search function can't find it.

Keeping in mind that some contributors opine that IP location is not determinative, I still find it curious that Geotool continues to place the servers of this forum at Medicine Lake in the Minneapolis area on an absolutely consistent basis.

It still did a few minutes ago:

Picture 3.jpg

My bottleneck, to a big degree, is that I'm too much of a power user.

That must be it.

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forums.adobe.com Server Location

Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Perhaps the thread where we had idly discussed whether the servers are  located in Minnesota or whether Geotool gives misleading results was lost because it was in the temporary preview forum.  In any event, the search function can't find it.

Keeping in mind that some contributors opine that IP location is not determinative, I still find it curious that Geotool continues to place the servers of this forum at Medicine Lake in the Minneapolis area on an absolutely consistent basis.

It still did a few minutes ago:

Picture 3.jpg

My bottleneck, to a big degree, is that I'm too much of a power user.

That must be it.

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Advisor ,
Apr 10, 2009

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And the point is?

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Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Curt Wrigley wrote:

And the point is…

…obviously over your head.

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Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Curt Wrigley wrote:

And the point is…

…obviously over your head.

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Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Curt Wrigley wrote:

And the point is?

The purpose of my original post is to revive the thread.

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Contributor ,
Apr 10, 2009

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Ramón G Castañeda wrote:

Curt Wrigley wrote:

And the point is?

The purpose of my original post is to revive the thread.

Now Ramón has the hiccups. (posted identical posts 3 times, if you're reading in email and don't see it Ramón)

[added] Sorry... twice, then a different edited copy. Didn't see the difference the first time.

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Guide ,
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Nope, Dorothy.  No hiccups, but two intentional re-postings because it seemed to me that the little tuxedo teenager with censorship powers was making my posts invisible.  Though the numbers of replies as shown increased, the "last post by" on the thread index page kept showing curt Wiggly as the author of the last post until finally you posted.

You had warned me about him. 

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Apr 10, 2009 0
Contributor ,
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Ramón G Castañeda wrote:

Nope, Dorothy.  No hiccups, but two intentional re-postings because it seemed to me that the little tuxedo teenager with censorship powers was making my posts invisible.  Though the numbers of replies as shown increased, the "last post by" on the thread index page kept showing curt Wiggly as the author of the last post until finally you posted.

You had warned me about him. 

Wait... back up... I ain't takin' that last bit!! I have never said one thing against Curt. In fact I've come to respect him in many ways... most especially for his ability to endure the criticism that is unfairly heaped upon him. If you want to jump on that boat, don't even consider taking me along. I not only am not interested, but I abhor the unfair treatment that I regularly see a very few people meting out. Yourself included at times, sad to say, because I generally have a lot of respect for you as well.

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Apr 10, 2009 0
Guide ,
Apr 10, 2009

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DorothyK@Adobe wrote:

Ramón G Castañeda wrote:

Nope, Dorothy.  No hiccups, but two intentional re-postings because it seemed to me that the little tuxedo teenager with censorship powers was making my posts invisible.  Though the numbers of replies as shown increased, the "last post by" on the thread index page kept showing curt Wiggly as the author of the last post until finally you posted.

You had warned me about him. 

Wait... back up... I ain't takin' that last bit!! I have never said one thing against Curt.

Dorothy, I was referencing an instance—not sure if in last month's forum preview—where you jumped in an altercation he had either provoked or encouraged and participated in to warn me (or all the participants) specifically to show more respect for people or faces who were going to be bearing badges and having host powers in the new forums.  I personally took that as an unmistakable warning to me, specifically in regards to my addressing the Wiggly fellow.  That's what I meant by

You had warned me about him. 

No more, no less.


His first reply to my totally harmless original post in this thread was needlessly confrontational and for no reason whatsoever, especially coming from anybody who would ever aspire to be considered with the deference and respect due a forum host, ever.  If I was ever treated like that by a human host in real life, a punch in the nose would be the least he could expect.  Hope the guy's not family to you.

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Apr 10, 2009 0
Contributor ,
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Sorry, it's a matter of perspective, I suppose. I saw his query as a request for clarification, not of confrontation.

I know that there are people here who have chosen to make me their enemy and find fault with everything I do and say. Fine. Their choice, their life, their karma. The part that I hate is how it rubs off on others. And Curt, and now others are a victim of the same unwarranted judgments.

I hate cops because they wear the uniform. We all know that all cops are totally bad and out to get us, right?? Same attitude. And wrong. Please be bigger then that.

What I'd said early on was simply pointing out that these are people who have done a hell of a lot for the Adobe community, up to and including knowing the software in their area of expertize well enough to write the books that we buy to teach us and speak at conferences that people pay a lot to attend to learn amd whatever all... and they have been and are going to be around, even if you haven't run into them before... so we might as well learn to play nice together.

Yes, individual respect needs to be earned in time, but, putting yourself in their place... if you introduce yourself by whatever title you've earned (or been awarded) by your hard work and experience, and someone comes along and throws it on the ground and tramples and disrespects it for no apparent reason, and without ever attempting to get to know you before judging you... you have every right not to think very highly of them. I have to give a lot of credit to a lot of the folks from that group for putting up with their welcome as well as they have. It was not, and is not, deserved.

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Apr 10, 2009 0
Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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DorothyK@Adobe wrote:

… Please be bigger then that.

Again, you mean than

DorothyK@Adobe wrote:


I hate cops because they wear the uniform. We all know that all cops are totally bad and out to get us, right?? Same attitude. And wrong.

Dorothy, I would never refer to law enforcement officials as "cops".  I've worked with hundreds of them for decades, socialized and still socialize with many of them.  My grandson plays with their grandchildren.   I personally know several who have taken a bulltet for another human being.  Would you like me to refer to you as a crone, a hag, a nag or something as pejorative?

Everyone is free to like or dislike anybody, and respect has to be earned.  At this point I have none for the individual we have both been referencing.

On a different subject, the cursor sometimes disappears in this reply box.  I can continue typing, but I have to have a darned deal of confidence to know where the letters are going to appear, or disappear if I need to delete anything.  I've typed this whole post without ever seeing a cursor. 

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Apr 11, 2009 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 11, 2009

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When I was at school we had a game called "Cops and Robbers". It wasn't pejorative, we wouldn't have known a pejorator if he jumped out and bit us.

We also have the more modern term "Good cop – bad Cop". The good one can't be bad can he?

There are plenty of really offensive terms for members of the police forces but "cop" isn't one of them!

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Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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John Joslin wrote:

There are plenty of really offensive terms for members of the police forces but "cop" isn't one of them!

What? ???

You mean like Kr@ut is not offensive to a German, or Cöön to an African American, K¡pper to an Englishman, or R@ghe@d to an Arab…?

We try to like Pömm¡es from Perf¡d¡ous Alb¡on, but it's such a hard sell…

If it's offensive to the person, it's pejorative.  Period.

It's certainly pejorative to get anybody who utters it thrown out of my house.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Contributor ,
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DorothyK@Adobe wrote:


I hate cops because they wear the uniform. We all know that all cops are totally bad and out to get us, right?? Same attitude. And wrong.

Dorothy, I would never refer to law enforcement officials as "cops".  I've worked with hundreds of them for decades, socialized and still socialize with many of them.  My grandson plays with their grandchildren.   I personally know several who have taken a bulltet for another human being.  Would you like me to refer to you as a crone, a hag, a nag or something as pejorative?

Everyone is free to like or dislike anybody, and respect has to be earned.  At this point I have none for the individual we have both been referencing.

On a different subject, the cursor sometimes disappears in this reply box.  I can continue typing, but I have to have a darned deal of confidence to know where the letters are going to appear, or disappear if I need to delete anything.  I've typed this whole post without ever seeing a cursor. 

Ah, so you fully understand my point then... (or than... whichever way you prefer. Makes no never mind to me. As long as most people know what I mean. I've got other nits to pick, very few of which have to do with spelling or grammar.) Cops are by and large good guys (non-gender term) and it is not a word that has negative connotation... just a very informal term.

For the record, you joined in the trampling when they were first introduced. Perhaps sometimes it would be well to choose a different leader to follow now and again. And, ya, as always, if people say negative stuff about people over and over again, whether it's true or not, it is going to influence other's opinions in very unfair and unjustified ways. Or do you really think that people in the Experts group are all as bad as they've been made out to be? Or that Curt is really as bad as the first impression left you feeling?

In any case, is it any more unreasonable that we ask respect as the default for the people that Adobe has given that status to then you expect for anyone working in law enforcement?

I like my html straight up... don't like sites that sing and dance. This has gotten to be one. The cursor thing is one symptom.

I will take the pagan meaning of Crone from wikipedia, and accept it, since I am clearly on the other side of motherhood, and yes, sometimes I can be a nag. Hag I'd quibble about.

  • The Maiden represents enchantment, inception, expansion, the promise of new beginnings, birth, youth and youthful enthusiasm, represented by the waxing moon.
  • The Mother represents ripeness, fertility, sexuality, fulfillment, stability, power and life represented by the full moon.
  • The Crone represents wisdom, repose, death, and endings represented by the waning moon.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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DorothyK@Adobe wrote:


… Or that Curt is really as bad as the first impression left you feeling?

No, my impression of him has been deteriorating gradually, steadily over time, sort of like an overripe banana.  (Hey, you asked!) 

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Apr 11, 2009 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 11, 2009

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If it's offensive to the person, it's pejorative.  Period.

I disagree.

Wordsand phrases are pejorative if they imply disapproval or contempt.

If such is not implied, as I believe it would not be for many people using the word 'cops', myself incldued, then it's not pejorative.  If a cop takes it as such, then he really needs to get a thicker skin.  (Someone with a gun really should not be that touchy.)

This is very much different from the racial and ethnic epithets you referenced, where they most often are used to imply contempt.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
LEGEND ,
Apr 11, 2009

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P.S.

I had the same question as Curt.  What's the point here?  (Not having seen any earlier threads on the subject.)

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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Interesting that neither Dorothy nor Curt are featured on the Adobe Community Expert list, their badges notwithstanding.  I went there to look for the books they have authored, as per Dorothy's remarks above (http://forums.adobe.com/message/1884775#1884775)

http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/all.html

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Advisor ,
Apr 11, 2009

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Ramón G Castañeda wrote:

Interesting that neither Dorothy nor Curt are featured on the Adobe Community Expert list, their badges notwithstanding.  I went there to look for the books they have authored, as per Dorothy's remarks above (http://forums.adobe.com/message/1884775#1884775)

http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/all.html

I am not aware of the process Adobe has for updating the page you refer to. Perhaps I never filled out the right form.   I am the author or two Adobe Classroom in a Book's for PPRO and also a technical writer on their ACE certification exams. I have been a contributor here since 2001.   I am an Adobe Certified Expert at Adobe's invitation, I have ACE certification, I help moderate the adobe community help system, produce adobe online tutorials, written articles for various video magazines,  like to fly ultralight aircraft and am due to be a grandfather any day now.

I aplogigize if I have offended you Ramon.  I, like most people here, am here to give back to the adobe community.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Explorer ,
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I know that there are people here who have chosen to make me their enemy and find fault with everything I do and say. Fine. Their choice, their life, their karma.

Apparently, it is your Karma.

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Guide ,
Apr 12, 2009

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Thank you for the courtesy of your reply, Curt.  It had escaped me until just now.

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Apr 12, 2009 0
Engaged ,
Apr 12, 2009

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Curt...

You should change that 'avatar'. It really does make you look like an upstart bean counter...

Cheers and ATB,

JJ

PS: No offence meant....

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Apr 12, 2009 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 10, 2009

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so once we get over hte sidebar, what IS the point of this thread? does it matter where the servers are? should we get out our tinfoil hats or something? i don't want to be left without my foil hat on... i'll put it on just in case... 😉

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Apr 10, 2009 0
Contributor ,
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dave milbut wrote:

so once we get over hte sidebar, what IS the point of this thread? does it matter where the servers are? should we get out our tinfoil hats or something? i don't want to be left without my foil hat on... i'll put it on just in case... 😉

Well, I'm in Wisconsin... the next state over from Minnesota... and it's slow for me too. I can't say that being closer makes it quicker. Tho it may well go back through California before it comes back to me. Dunno.

My bottleneck, to a big degree, is that I'm too much of a power user. I almost alway have the Windows Task Manager open so I can keep an eye on the use of resources. I tend to max them out on a regular basis.

One question I haven't asked is how hard of a resource hit the new forums take on our systems compared to the old. I know that mine is hit pretty hard, even this one that has 1.5 gig of ram. The 256 mg machine they have for me at work starts smokin' by late morning, and I usually have to shut down Firefox and restart it so it can release some memory. NEVER had those kinds of problems in the WebX forums.

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Advocate ,
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My bottleneck, to a big degree, is that I'm too much of a power user.

That must be it.

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Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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Kath gets the points from me this time.  

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Advisor ,
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Ramón, you may have missed it in one or more of the other threads, but John has stated that the new forum is hosted on a Jive server (just as WebX was on a WebX server). Also, there was a thread on the preview forum where people were posting their tracerts (I think while trying to determine why it was slower from Australia).

Here are a couple of snippets from tracerts I just ran that show the truth of it:

$ tracert forums.adobe.com

Tracing route to adobe.hosted.jivesoftware.com [209.46.39.53]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
[snip]


$ tracert adobe.com

Tracing route to adobe.com [192.150.18.117]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

[snip]

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Guide ,
Apr 11, 2009

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Mark A. Boyd wrote:

Ramón, you may have missed it in one or more of the other threads, but John has stated that the new forum is hosted on a Jive server (just as WebX was on a WebX server).

No, Mark, I did not miss that.  And I've known that for years and years. 

You, however, seemed to have missed the thread I was referencing in my OP.

Of course I'm eferencing the Jive server.  What else?

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Advisor ,
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You, however, seemed to have missed the thread I was referencing in my OP.

No, I saw that one, too. So, you're posting the geo-estimated location FOI (For Our Information)?

I wonder if it's still slower for the Aussies on this new server?

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Guide ,
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Mark A. Boyd wrote:

So, you're posting the geo-estimated location FOI (For Our Information)?

Just as an item of possible interest to anybody, to revive the old thread.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Advocate ,
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Ramón G Castañeda wrote on 2009-04-11 06:41 :

Keeping in mind that some contributors opine that IP location is not determinative, I still find it curious that Geotool continues to place the servers of this forum at Medicine Lake in the Minneapolis area on an absolutely consistent basis.

The reason many automated tools locate the servers in MN is the IP

addresses used. You don't just get IP addresses out of thin air, you

request them from your regional registry. Most of them keep a public

record of their allocations. The IP addresses used by Jive are allocated

to some business in MN:

https://ws.arin.net/whois/?queryinput=!%20NET-209-46-39-0-1

The location found this way is more often then not the corporate

headquarters. In the case of these forums I am inclined to believe the

servers are actually located near Denver since the last IP address

before the forums is 65.168.255.156 which belongs to

https://ws.arin.net/whois/?queryinput=!%20NET-65-168-254-0-1

As for the performance the TTL is 200 ms instead of the 150 ms I had to

San Jose. It should have been around 140 ms if all else remained equal

because Denver is closer to me. It looks like all timings are normal

through Amsterdam (6 ms), New York (80 ms) and Chicago (100 ms), but

then there is a 100 ms jump. So from Europe to Chicago takes as long as

from Chicago to Denver.

BTW, Windows users shouldn't use tracert for this, but pathping.

Jochem

--

Jochem van Dieten

http://jochem.vandieten.net/

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How quickly some people forget.

From the very begining of the Preview forums it was nnounced that ALL (that means each and every one) of the messages on the preview forum would be purged (made to go away, poof, gone) when the production forums were released.

And in the old discussion in preview I pointed out that the forum servers were in Colorado, not Minnesota. And that WebCrossing servers were in San Jose, not in San Francisco.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Guide ,
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First sentence of the second paragraph of my original post:

Keeping in mind that some contributors opine that IP location is not determinative…

No, I had not forgotten what you said, John, that's why I added "I still find it interesting…" etc.

Jochem's timely elaboration above futher piques my interest:

The IP addresses used by Jive are allocated

to some business in MN:

https://ws.arin.net/whois/?queryinput=!%20NET-209-46-39-0-1

Yup, I followed that link.

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Apr 11, 2009 0
Mentor ,
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Enthusiast ,
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hmm... force logged out while going from the last page to the next to last page... brilliant!

anyway...

http://www.famousdaves.com/

ah. it's all starting to make sense...

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