i feel the current incarnation of the forum discourages participation

LEGEND ,
May 14, 2014

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Previously the creator of a thread and the last person having posted there were listed, now it seems to be limited to the creator.

I myself take less interest in threads that have already received attention and suspect that some others may feel likewise.

So even if post 1 is by the creator themselves (adding some clarifications for example) I can’t see that immediately and am less likely to even check out that thread.

I guess the Forum administrators should be able to determine if more threads have been contributed to by only two people since the last Form update (which might also be an indicator of other problems though).

Maybe (hopefully) others do take a different approach than me, but I think reinstating the listing of creator and last poster to a thread in both Content and Overview would benefit the Fora.

Anyone else wants to share their opinion on this?

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i feel the current incarnation of the forum discourages participation

LEGEND ,
May 14, 2014

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Previously the creator of a thread and the last person having posted there were listed, now it seems to be limited to the creator.

I myself take less interest in threads that have already received attention and suspect that some others may feel likewise.

So even if post 1 is by the creator themselves (adding some clarifications for example) I can’t see that immediately and am less likely to even check out that thread.

I guess the Forum administrators should be able to determine if more threads have been contributed to by only two people since the last Form update (which might also be an indicator of other problems though).

Maybe (hopefully) others do take a different approach than me, but I think reinstating the listing of creator and last poster to a thread in both Content and Overview would benefit the Fora.

Anyone else wants to share their opinion on this?

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May 14, 2014 1
LEGEND ,
May 14, 2014

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I don't like the new iteration. The lack of a 'Mark All Read' , lack of 'Last Contributor', and the slowness of moving from one page to the next means that I rarely look beyond the first page. As you say, it is discouraging.

It's a pity Adobe haven't implemented the same iteration of Jive that McAfee are using - that's slick and fast.

1.png

Cheers,

--

Neale

Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children

If this post or another user's post resolves the original issue, please mark the posts as correct accordingly. This helps other users with similar trouble get answers to their questions quicker. Thanks.

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May 14, 2014 1
LEGEND ,
May 15, 2014

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It's a pity Adobe haven't implemented the same iteration of Jive that McAfee are using - that's slick and fast.

That list looks better indeed.

As for the speed issue I’m not sure which factors do actually influence that.

In any case I’m curious if and how the administrators do evaluate participation on these Fora.

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May 15, 2014 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 15, 2014

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Hello C,

I suggest that you give your remarks to a kind of a wishform here in the forum. Please see paragraph 46 Preran in
https://forums.adobe.com/message/6366211#6366211 ( "and I will keep some breathing space between my requests so as to not overwhelm them") and

https://forums.adobe.com/message/6367679#6367679 see paragraph 3 and 4 >>> A great "thanks" to Preran, who patiently collected all our suggestions (see esp. 46) to pass these informations to the "team".

Hans-Günter

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May 15, 2014 1
LEGEND ,
May 16, 2014

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Thanks!

The issue of »listing last poster« seems to be on the list already anyway.

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May 16, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 16, 2014

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Yes, I have quit.

I have been answering questions mainly on the Bridge and Photoshop Forums since 2007.  Since then the Forum has gone through many changes.  I have also been active in the Forum Comments Forum over the years to make changes so the forums are more friendly.  It seems like each time the forum format is "enhanced" many useful features are eliminated.  Through the constant repeating of comments of the heavy hitters many of the features were reinstated, only to be eliminated with the last change. 

Major Forum changes occurred about two weeks ago, and of course negative comments flowed on the Forum, but this time this time the heavy hitters seemed to say "we have lost the battle, the Forum is not going to be changed, so just adjust or quit".

We responders are volunteering our time and knowledge to benefit the Adobe users.  Many of us feel Adobe has much to gain to keep us happy as they get excellent user feedback with almost no outlay of money.  But many of the omissions make it difficult to read and respond to the Forums.  We are getting NO positive help from Adobe or MVP's to indicate anything will be done to correct critical omissions.  In my opinion those are:

1.  Point system fouled up and broken.  Only top 6 responders listed, down from 10.  There is some satisfaction to make the top 10, although points hard to get now.

2.  Can not see who  responded last - useful to know as some responders are a must read as one can learn from them.
3.  Overview tab does not list number of responses

4.  Content tab does not list list time since last response, only time of response (useless).

5.  There is no (updated) after thread you have visited.   Makes it more difficult to see if there has been a response since your last visit.
6.  Huge amount of wasted space on page

7.  Can not jump to last comment - how long did it take to get that included last time?  Have to scroll through the entire page(s) to get to last comments

6.  No breadcrumbs at bottom of page - how long did it take to get that included last time?  The back arrow does not always work the first click. 

For me these items makes it difficult to read and respond to questions.  So just want to you to know I am dropping out of the Forums.  It has been fun, but the changes no longer make it fun.

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May 16, 2014 3
Most Valuable Participant ,
May 16, 2014

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Curt,

I am sorry to see you go.

I have seen a solution to (only) number 7 on the list: to the left just above the OP there is a link to Latest reply.

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May 16, 2014 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 16, 2014

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I have seen a solution to (only) number 7 on the list: to the left just above the OP there is a link to Latest reply.

The downside to that is that you must first enter the individual discussion then click to jump to the latest reply.

On the previous forum version all Latest Reply links were shown on the Discussion summary page next the each line item. Much quicker and more efficient.

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May 16, 2014 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
May 16, 2014

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Curt,

And what John said.

I am still cherishing the memory of the fair forums, before 2009.

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May 16, 2014 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
May 17, 2014

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Unfortunately, you are not alone...

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May 17, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 18, 2014

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Curt, I hope you will reconsider quitting these Fora.

Otherwise best of luck and thanks for sharing your knowledge for so long.

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May 18, 2014 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 18, 2014

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Hello Curt,

your work, this list with all the points worthy of improvement - it's a pity - BUT is simply situated at the wrong place. For this reason maybe you couldn't see a great "movement" here: https://forums.adobe.com/thread/1464803?sr=inbox where Preran patiently collected all our suggestions (see esp. his list in page 2 consecutive number 46) to pass these informations to the "team".

And so I can only sympathise, then, with "... and I will keep some breathing space between my requests so as to not overwhelm them ... "

Hans-Günter

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May 18, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 18, 2014

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Hans,

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding you, but you seem to be saying that Curt, posting to 'Forum Comments' is posting in the wrong place, whereas Preran posting in 'Dreamweaver support' is in the more appropriate place.

To me that seems back to front. I would have though this the appropriate place for such posts and am surprised that the Dreamweaver support moderators didn't move the topic here. As it is probably each and every Adobe community forum has its own discussion about the new forum going on, all making the same points -  a lot of redundant effort.

I'm also concerned by Prerans response #53 that suggests the MVP 'Back Room' (whatever that is, but I presume restricted access) is actually the only one that the forum managers are going to be taking any notice of.

Cheers,

--

Neale

Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children

If this post or another user's post resolves the original issue, please mark the posts as correct accordingly. This helps other users with similar trouble get answers to their questions quicker. Thanks.

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May 18, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 18, 2014

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I think what Hans was trying to say is that Preran is keeping a list of

features requested by forum users and that he is in regular contact with

the developers so we are likely to get swift response of any changes

rather than posting it here which nobody acts on it.

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May 18, 2014 1
Enthusiast ,
May 19, 2014

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All you say may very well be true.

The real problem is that virtually all requests, if acted upon, would get this current mess back to what we had before this "improvement".  We just keep reinventing the wheel as Adobe keeps messing with the forums.

Frankly, I'm not convinced that the company gives a damn about the forums.

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May 19, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 19, 2014

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Frankly, I'm not convinced that the company gives a damn about the forums.

Adobe may not, but at least some Adobe staffers do, I suspect.

Some Adobe employees have been participating on Fora, so I assume they would prefer the Forum experience to be »good«, but I doubt they are involved in the Forum development as they probably have their plates full with the application/s they work on.

But when in contrast one does consider the Illustrator team’s seeming neglect of the Fora (particularly with regard to bug reports/feature requests) I guess the involvement with the »community« may vary from team to team.

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May 19, 2014 0
Adobe Employee ,
May 19, 2014

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Just to clear some things up… Preran is the DW support lead, so he has been collecting suggestions from folks in the DW forum. But any feedback you post here, in Forum Comments, will also be passed along to Jive. I've been keeping track of all issues and we have open/closed cases with Jive surrounding these issues.

If you have something you feel is urgent, please feel free to private message your feedback to me.

Thanks!

Madison

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May 19, 2014 0
Enthusiast ,
May 19, 2014

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Hi Madison,

I have no bone to pick with staff members who are trying to patch this leaky ship.

Unfortunately, this whole mess, and it is a mess, has been gone through when the forums changed from Global Crossing to Jive.  Many comments were solicited, but it isn't clear many of them were followed when the Big Change occurred.

As I said earlier, it isn't clear Adobe Management gives a hoot in hell what happens to these forums.  And that's really a shame.

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May 19, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 19, 2014

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Sorry, m.m.murphy, for overlooking that Adobe staffers are indeed actively involved with Forum development.

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May 19, 2014 1
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 20, 2014

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So I feel myself hereby confirmed.

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May 20, 2014 0
Adobe Community Professional ,
May 22, 2014

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Curt Y wrote:

Yes, I have quit.

I have been answering questions mainly on the Bridge and Photoshop Forums since 2007.  Since then the Forum has gone through many changes.  I have also been active in the Forum Comments Forum over the years to make changes so the forums are more friendly.  It seems like each time the forum format is "enhanced" many useful features are eliminated.  Through the constant repeating of comments of the heavy hitters many of the features were reinstated, only to be eliminated with the last change.

Major Forum changes occurred about two weeks ago, and of course negative comments flowed on the Forum, but this time this time the heavy hitters seemed to say "we have lost the battle, the Forum is not going to be changed, so just adjust or quit".

We responders are volunteering our time and knowledge to benefit the Adobe users.  Many of us feel Adobe has much to gain to keep us happy as they get excellent user feedback with almost no outlay of money.  But many of the omissions make it difficult to read and respond to the Forums.  We are getting NO positive help from Adobe or MVP's to indicate anything will be done to correct critical omissions.  In my opinion those are:

1.  Point system fouled up and broken.  Only top 6 responders listed, down from 10.  There is some satisfaction to make the top 10, although points hard to get now.

2.  Can not see who  responded last - useful to know as some responders are a must read as one can learn from them.
3.  Overview tab does not list number of responses

4.  Content tab does not list list time since last response, only time of response (useless).

5.  There is no (updated) after thread you have visited.   Makes it more difficult to see if there has been a response since your last visit.
6.  Huge amount of wasted space on page

7.  Can not jump to last comment - how long did it take to get that included last time?  Have to scroll through the entire page(s) to get to last comments

6.  No breadcrumbs at bottom of page - how long did it take to get that included last time?  The back arrow does not always work the first click. 

For me these items makes it difficult to read and respond to questions.  So just want to you to know I am dropping out of the Forums.  It has been fun, but the changes no longer make it fun.

Couldn't put it any better. Sums up exactly why I too have quit, having been a "top ten" contributor in the Lightroom forum. Helping others resolve their issues can be difficult enough, without having the "job" being made even more difficult.

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May 22, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 23, 2014

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Though you do not need another "me too," I feel the same way.

My participation is way, way down, and will likely be so in the future. I find the new forums to be all work, and little fun. It is so hard to get work done any longer.

Perhaps for a first-time poster with a question, or problem, things ARE better, but for me, a contributor, I am horribly frustrated.

Hunt

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May 23, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 23, 2014

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Bill Hunt wrote:

and little fun

Exactly. And when something, being done voluntarily, stops being fun you stop doing it.

Cheers,

--

Neale

Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children

If this post or another user's post resolves the original issue, please mark the posts as correct accordingly. This helps other users with similar trouble get answers to their questions quicker. Thanks.

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May 23, 2014 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
May 23, 2014

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Curt, Jim Wilde, Bill, Neale,

Having suffered the chaos of the transition from the fair forums to Jive software, and witnessed how little attention was payed to suggestions from oldtimers, I have very little hope that our pleas will produce much results. However, Madison and her team are really working hard to mend things, so I think we should all give them a chance before leaving.

I am formally asking you please not to leave the forums now. Or at least, not completely. Do come in here once a week to take a look. Who knows? Madison and company might be successful in making participation fun again.

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May 23, 2014 0
Most Valuable Participant ,
May 25, 2014

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Curt, Jim Wilde, Bill, Neale, and doubtlessly countless others,

I agree with Claudio, asking you please not to leave the forums now.

We have gone a long way together.

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May 25, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 25, 2014

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I do log into the this Forum and am monitoring the progresses, or lack of progress.  But judging from past experiences on getting changes I think I will be dead, or we will be on Photoshop version 26 before that happens.  Then it is a moot point for me anyways.

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May 25, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Aug 08, 2014

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Claudio González wrote:

Do come in here once a week to take a look. Who knows? Madison and company might be successful in making participation fun again.

Well its been months now. I keep popping in to see if any usability changes have been implemented but I'm afraid I see none. It is still just as not-fun to use as the first day it went live.

Cheers,

--

Neale

Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children

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Aug 08, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Aug 08, 2014

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And the editor works as flaky as ever with Internet Explorer 11.  I still lose stuff regularly.

Type a line with a dash in it - like this one.

Now go back and select a word in it and bold it.  More often than not it will just lose part of the line.

-Noel

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Aug 08, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
May 24, 2014

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My participation is way, way down, and will likely be so in the future.

It would be interesting how participation has developed since the current form of the Fora was established.

As the thing has been up and running a few weeks now I suppose a trend might be recognisable by now.

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May 24, 2014 0
Contributor ,
Jul 01, 2014

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I could not agree more with the title of this thread. Every mouse click now takes 20 seconds or more before anything happens, impossible to tell who the respondents of a thread are and each page of threads is now an extremely short list.

These forums are no longer fun or easy to participate in.

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Jul 01, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Jul 01, 2014

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I've been putting in a lot of effort lately, but I've got to say this forum frustrates at every turn.

Today it's these 20 second long waits for anything to happen.  I cleared cookies to no avail (except that the next attempt to log in just hung up).

Every day it's the stupid flaky editor that eats phrases.  And this business where if you visit a thread via your Inbox it doesn't show having been read in the main Discussions view.  Ridiculous!

I agree with Christoph's original post - even if everything were to work right, the overview screen has lost all its utility.

Adobe, please consider our renewed cries here make it more pleasant for the folks who wish to contribute to continue to do so.  As an example, you've lost a REAL ASSET in Curt Y's leaving (and I'm sure others).

-Noel

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Jul 01, 2014 2
Adobe Employee ,
Jul 07, 2014

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We're working on adding more memory to our jive servers to help with the lengthy load times.

Thanks for your patience as we work to fix this!

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Jul 07, 2014 0
Contributor ,
Jul 07, 2014

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We're working on adding more memory to our jive servers to help with the lengthy load times.

Thanks for your patience as we work to fix this!

Thanks for the heads up....but what Noel said:

even if everything were to work right, the overview screen has lost all its utility.

...is the main point of this issue, I believe.

Faster is better...but if basic functionality remains in its current crippled state, all the extra memory would do is just disappoint us all quicker.

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Jul 07, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Jul 07, 2014

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m.m.murphy wrote:

We're working on adding more memory to our jive servers to help with the lengthy load times.

Thanks for your patience as we work to fix this!

I don't think it is the memory problem.  The problem is with so many scripts running at the server side rather than delegating some to the client side to balance the load.  These forums have become so slow that sometimes it is impossible to login at all.  why is it necessary to run all the scripts all the time?  Why not make use of the browser cache so that processing doesn't take when the info is already on users machine.

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Jul 07, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Jul 07, 2014

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It's 100x too complicated for what it does.

Have you seen how many requests it does and how many megabytes it loads to the client just to show a page?!?  Literally MEGABYTES of script code?  Ridiculous!

Web programmers at Jive ensuring themselves job security?  Maybe.  They're the envy of the Obamacare web site for sure.

-Noel

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Jul 07, 2014 0
LEGEND ,
Jul 08, 2014

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Been reading the comments on this Forum since Jive updated from 4.x to 7.x.  My conclusion from all the comments is that Adobe is in a hole which it can not extract itself.  Can't go forward or back.

The current Jive web is not user friendly for a User to User answer Forum.  Seeing who was last responder, time in minutes since last response, breadcrumbs, jump to last post, and number of responses no mater which tab one uses would seem to be a  bare minimum to make Forums useful for responders.   Neither Jive nor Adobe wishes to spend the time and money to write new code to make this happen.  It appears the ample modifications would make version "non-standard" and then Jive would not cover in agreement.

Adobe can not jump ship and choose another vendor as all the response history would be lost.  So users are stuck with whatever Jive throws at them, no matter how bad it has become, or will become.  And if you are an old time user you will remember the thousands of comments on this Forum about how bad it was when Jive took over from the previous vendor years ago.  It took at least a year of complaining before meaningful changes were obtained.  I do not believe that will happen this time as the major players have either quit or accepted changes as fate.  The least Adobe could do is demand a reduced rate as they are getting a reduced service.

Like my old boss once said about workers like me complaining about the great working conditions of "the good old days".  He said only the old timers complain about loss of freedom to do their job.  The new hires don't complain, and in a few years will look back and say when they were hired "those were the good old days".    In 3 years will Jive 7.x be "the good old days?"  I hope not, but then  - - - - - .

So new blood will fill the Forums and maybe that is a good thing, gets rid of the complainers.

curt y since 2007

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Jul 08, 2014 1