jsessionid/404 symptoms?

Advisor ,
Jun 03, 2009

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Sorry if I got a little long-winded, and I don't know if it helps, but...

Status = logged out (intentionally).
New browser session.

Upon browser open to any existing 'thread' or 'message' (basically, anywhere other than the front page in forums.acobe.com), links have jsessionid and so called "meatball" graphics are only showing as their respective alt attributes [User | Participant | Employee, etc.]

If this initial page is a 'thread' page showing the subject headers ( http://forums.adobe.com/community/general/forum_comments?view=discussions ), I can click on a subject with no problem. The [Next] or [2] links merely append an octothorpe # do nothing whatsoever. If I click on the dated "last post" above "whoever" link on the right side, I see the Error 404 that others have mentioned.

This appears to be the case whether this new session is opened to a "Discussions" page showing a list of subject headers (topics) or a "Message" thread showing messages in the thread (I am still trying to come to terms with Jive terminology). ie: whether the link is forums.adobe.com/thread/* or forums.adobe.com/message/* and even when the new session is http://forums.adobe.com/index.jspa?showpersonalized=true (Your View)

Most internal links have jsessionid in the URL and the hover JavaScripts (ie: user profile) do not work. Some internal links do not work at all (no jsessionid included) such as the previously mentioned [Next] or [2] from a /thread/* page.

Click on any *working* internal Jive link from here and, upon next page load, all subsequent jsessionid's are no longer required or included in internal links - and the links work fine (sans browser Back button/keyboard shortcut). The "meatball" graphics appear with their respective images. Hover over users now brings up their stats and links through the JS hovers.

Status = logged in.
New browser session.

Same symptoms.

It seems that the initial browser session load of any Adobe Jive page requires a click on a (working) internal link to rid itself of the jsessionid link.

Conclusion?
If you are experiencing 404 errors due to entering the forum in a new session, try clicking on a link that actually works first, ie a "subject" link rather than a "date" link. Or click the forum breadcrumb even to get to the same forum thread index.

I am clearly not a Java/JavaScript enthusiast, but it seems as though it might be as simple as PHP's session.use_trans_sid when compiling the server software - or with a simple server config setting. Or it could be caused somewhere in the over-zealous and voluminous JavaScript (or maybe server-side Java?) used by Jive.

IMHO, Java should be used by refrigerators or PDAs and JavaScript should be used only to enhance a site. It should NOT be required to view or post content for a site. JS should never interfere with function.

--
Mark A. Boyd
Keep-On-Learnin' 🙂
This message was processed and edited by Jive.
It shall not be considered an accurate representation of my words.
It might not even have been intended as a reply to your message.

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jsessionid/404 symptoms?

Advisor ,
Jun 03, 2009

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Sorry if I got a little long-winded, and I don't know if it helps, but...

Status = logged out (intentionally).
New browser session.

Upon browser open to any existing 'thread' or 'message' (basically, anywhere other than the front page in forums.acobe.com), links have jsessionid and so called "meatball" graphics are only showing as their respective alt attributes [User | Participant | Employee, etc.]

If this initial page is a 'thread' page showing the subject headers ( http://forums.adobe.com/community/general/forum_comments?view=discussions ), I can click on a subject with no problem. The [Next] or [2] links merely append an octothorpe # do nothing whatsoever. If I click on the dated "last post" above "whoever" link on the right side, I see the Error 404 that others have mentioned.

This appears to be the case whether this new session is opened to a "Discussions" page showing a list of subject headers (topics) or a "Message" thread showing messages in the thread (I am still trying to come to terms with Jive terminology). ie: whether the link is forums.adobe.com/thread/* or forums.adobe.com/message/* and even when the new session is http://forums.adobe.com/index.jspa?showpersonalized=true (Your View)

Most internal links have jsessionid in the URL and the hover JavaScripts (ie: user profile) do not work. Some internal links do not work at all (no jsessionid included) such as the previously mentioned [Next] or [2] from a /thread/* page.

Click on any *working* internal Jive link from here and, upon next page load, all subsequent jsessionid's are no longer required or included in internal links - and the links work fine (sans browser Back button/keyboard shortcut). The "meatball" graphics appear with their respective images. Hover over users now brings up their stats and links through the JS hovers.

Status = logged in.
New browser session.

Same symptoms.

It seems that the initial browser session load of any Adobe Jive page requires a click on a (working) internal link to rid itself of the jsessionid link.

Conclusion?
If you are experiencing 404 errors due to entering the forum in a new session, try clicking on a link that actually works first, ie a "subject" link rather than a "date" link. Or click the forum breadcrumb even to get to the same forum thread index.

I am clearly not a Java/JavaScript enthusiast, but it seems as though it might be as simple as PHP's session.use_trans_sid when compiling the server software - or with a simple server config setting. Or it could be caused somewhere in the over-zealous and voluminous JavaScript (or maybe server-side Java?) used by Jive.

IMHO, Java should be used by refrigerators or PDAs and JavaScript should be used only to enhance a site. It should NOT be required to view or post content for a site. JS should never interfere with function.

--
Mark A. Boyd
Keep-On-Learnin' 🙂
This message was processed and edited by Jive.
It shall not be considered an accurate representation of my words.
It might not even have been intended as a reply to your message.

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Enthusiast ,
Jun 03, 2009

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java != javascript

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Advisor ,
Jun 03, 2009

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Correct. And it changes nothing about my (late-night rambling) post.

Notice the link: http://forums.adobe.com/index.jspa?showpersonalized=true

And some source code.

[Edit]

Forgot to mention the over 100 KB of JavaScript, too.

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Advocate ,
Jun 03, 2009

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Mark A. Boyd wrote:

[Edit]

Forgot to mention the over 100 KB of JavaScript, too.

Of course, I'm not shocked at all, I've been suspecting that from the first day I started using this thing.  I'm sure there's other reasons why these forums suck but most experienced web developers know that massive JavaScript is simply asking for trouble, in more ways than one.  It's the primary reason there's so many front end bugs in this crap--it's complicated, and put frankly the tools for JS "development" suck too.  I don't know the history of it's creation but I'm fairly sure it was never intended to do what it's expected to do now, and the demands have grown faster than it's capabilities.

That's why my theory is that they're hiring brand new college students. Maybe even high school. High school dropouts for their management...

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Advocate ,
Jun 03, 2009

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I'm fairly sure it was never intended to do what it's expected to do now,

From more of a 'layman' perspective, I agree. I think people who are used to the WebX forum are used to seeing lots of topics on a page, going straight to where they left off, reading and posting a lot, fast - and get very impatient when that can't happen. I just don't think these forums were designed for this kind of community. People want to post code - lots of it, of many different flavours - and have that survive the trip through email if there's no NNTP. If it's possible to attach files they will want to post many different types, and have them appear without a laborious trip through a slow virus checker.


Lots of big brains around these forums, belonging to very busy people. Some suits seem to have decided to try and be 'trendy' and give users avatars and points, profiles and 'My Stuff' and pretty toys to play with - and hang the speed or the details.


I think they have totally misread their audience. I have great sympathy and admiration for JC and his team, trying to wrestle this inadequate, over-decorated mush into the kind of fast, efficient system that users here demand.


I still think it will be abandoned when the loss of major contributors has a serious effect. Sadly, people have started squabbling over points and whether they gave *the* one correct answer, and rocks and hard places will be apparent in any effort to revert to a more stripped-down format that actually works.

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Advocate ,
Jun 03, 2009

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Sorry, I meant I don't think JavaScript was designed for what it does now (Ajax, Jive , etc.)

BUT that is a good point, these forums clearly weren't designed for what we're using them for.

For example: How many GREAT and FAST forums are there out there, at development websites, that allow you to post code with full syntax highlighting, formatting etc?  I've seen quite a few. Check out the gamedev.net community. Adobe? Hello?

So why don't we have that here?  Flex, Flash, and I'm sure other Adobe tech uses plenty of source code.  Clearly Jive Crapspace wasn't designed for a development community.

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Jun 03, 2009 0
Kath-H LATEST
Advocate ,
Jun 03, 2009

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It seems more for a bunch of 22-year old gel-haired sales executives - hey, who made the most sales this week? Let's stand them on a table and give them a round of applause! Let's put them in a 'top participants' panel! The whole feel is wrong, wrong, wrong.

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