Please bring back NNTP

New Here ,
Apr 06, 2009

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When I got into work this morning, I checked my email and newsgroups as usual.  When I selected adobe.photoshop.lightroom, my newsreader chugged away for a minute or so and then gave me a "host not found" error.  I tried again a few minutes later, with the same result.

So I decided to browse over to http://forums.adobe.com and see if the forums were up.  Imagine my surprise when I discovered that

(a) there's new forum software

(b) there was no NNTP-visible announcement of the new forum software

(c) NNTP will no longer be supported.

Is Adobe trying to alienate a certain class of user?  If so, they're succeeding.

I have used NNTP for a decade and a half.  It is a highly efficient way of sharing information.  Using a newsreader, I can see the list of postings since my last visit (and *only* those posting), or I can see all postings.  I can sort them quickly, in any order I wish.  The listing will have only the information I choose to show (in my case, it's typically Subject, Author, and Date/Time, all in one line, producing a highly compact, information-dense display that can't be matched by forum software).  From that listing, I can easily and quickly respond to postings or decide to post something new.  Oh, and I can do all of that for all of my newsgroups, from one place.

Getting similar functionality with this new software will apparently require an RSS reader for the listing, a browser to read each posting I'm interested in (opening in a new window or tab), and a browser to post new messages.  Every page I view will have all sorts of wrapper cruft - headers (with a shopping cart icon!  boy, I really need *that* when I'm reading or posting!), footers, formatting, etc.  That all takes time to load and adds visual clutter, both of which get in the way of my primary task, which is giving and receiving information.

And, of course, if I read several forums/newsgroups per day, I need all of the above for each one.  And they're all different.  Yeah, I'll do *that*.

I searched for NNTP across the forums and read the thread about how horrible NNTP is because of overquoting and (gasp!) lack of formatting.  I have one reaction: GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!!!!!!

Overquoting?  It's quite easy to trim your quoting, and it is also proper ettequitte.  Anyone who doesn't is an idiot and will probably find other abuses to commit using this new software.

Lack of formatting?  Hardly.  This posting has formatting.  It's got paragraphs (remember those from English class?  It sure seems like a lot of web forum users don't), a numbered (well, lettered) list, and use of capitalization and other special characters for emphasis.  Maybe it's not as flashy as using boldfaced clever smileys and lots of random fonts, but it's pretty darn readable anyway, isn't it?

Let us not forget why we are here.  We are not here to be entertained.  We are here to give and receive information about products we use.

I have gotten a lot of benefit over the past couple of years from the Lightroom forums, in large part *because* of the efficiency of NNTP.  I simply don't have the time to devote to accessing them without NNTP, so I will only be rarely checking in, which means I will lose a valuable source of information.

Adobe, you have succeeded in alienating at least one customer.  Congratulations.

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Please bring back NNTP

New Here ,
Apr 06, 2009

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When I got into work this morning, I checked my email and newsgroups as usual.  When I selected adobe.photoshop.lightroom, my newsreader chugged away for a minute or so and then gave me a "host not found" error.  I tried again a few minutes later, with the same result.

So I decided to browse over to http://forums.adobe.com and see if the forums were up.  Imagine my surprise when I discovered that

(a) there's new forum software

(b) there was no NNTP-visible announcement of the new forum software

(c) NNTP will no longer be supported.

Is Adobe trying to alienate a certain class of user?  If so, they're succeeding.

I have used NNTP for a decade and a half.  It is a highly efficient way of sharing information.  Using a newsreader, I can see the list of postings since my last visit (and *only* those posting), or I can see all postings.  I can sort them quickly, in any order I wish.  The listing will have only the information I choose to show (in my case, it's typically Subject, Author, and Date/Time, all in one line, producing a highly compact, information-dense display that can't be matched by forum software).  From that listing, I can easily and quickly respond to postings or decide to post something new.  Oh, and I can do all of that for all of my newsgroups, from one place.

Getting similar functionality with this new software will apparently require an RSS reader for the listing, a browser to read each posting I'm interested in (opening in a new window or tab), and a browser to post new messages.  Every page I view will have all sorts of wrapper cruft - headers (with a shopping cart icon!  boy, I really need *that* when I'm reading or posting!), footers, formatting, etc.  That all takes time to load and adds visual clutter, both of which get in the way of my primary task, which is giving and receiving information.

And, of course, if I read several forums/newsgroups per day, I need all of the above for each one.  And they're all different.  Yeah, I'll do *that*.

I searched for NNTP across the forums and read the thread about how horrible NNTP is because of overquoting and (gasp!) lack of formatting.  I have one reaction: GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!!!!!!

Overquoting?  It's quite easy to trim your quoting, and it is also proper ettequitte.  Anyone who doesn't is an idiot and will probably find other abuses to commit using this new software.

Lack of formatting?  Hardly.  This posting has formatting.  It's got paragraphs (remember those from English class?  It sure seems like a lot of web forum users don't), a numbered (well, lettered) list, and use of capitalization and other special characters for emphasis.  Maybe it's not as flashy as using boldfaced clever smileys and lots of random fonts, but it's pretty darn readable anyway, isn't it?

Let us not forget why we are here.  We are not here to be entertained.  We are here to give and receive information about products we use.

I have gotten a lot of benefit over the past couple of years from the Lightroom forums, in large part *because* of the efficiency of NNTP.  I simply don't have the time to devote to accessing them without NNTP, so I will only be rarely checking in, which means I will lose a valuable source of information.

Adobe, you have succeeded in alienating at least one customer.  Congratulations.

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Community Beginner ,
Apr 06, 2009

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It looks like Adobe screwed over the NNTP user.  Now, instead of reading through the forums via the highly-efficient method of newsgroups, the Adobe forums user can waste hours trying to find the forums that one reads.  Newsgroups make it easy to read multiple forums.  Adobe's Web version does not do this and FAILS MISERABLY.

The end result for Adobe is that I will rarely read the forums in the future.  The only reason I have lurked and occasionally participated in these forums is BECAUSE it was possible to do it via newsgroups in Thunderbird.

I think some people forgot how efficient news readers are and I think new designers do not have a clue.

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 06, 2009

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Rob Freundlich wrote:


Is Adobe trying to alienate a certain class of user?  If so, they're succeeding.


yes. pros. apparently.

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Explorer ,
Apr 06, 2009

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Bring back newreader access. The web interface is slow, clunky and NOT something I will ever use. There was absolutly no reason not to have both after this upgrade (which was long past due).

Robert

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 06, 2009

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I agree. With NNTP it was very simple to see what threads/replies were new and made for a much more efficient use of time.

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Enthusiast ,
Apr 06, 2009

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I think they want us all in the same boat. those of us who like the old web forums are now just as disappointed as those who used to like nntp access. now we all just think it rots.

dave

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Apr 06, 2009 0
Advisor ,
Apr 06, 2009

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I have to add my voice to those expressing discontent in this thread. I've been using nntp since my college years ('88) and don't particularly want to have to change to yet-another web-ified discussion forum.

I'm happy with gnus, I'm happy with Thunderbird.

And I'll find other ways to spend my time if the NNTP gateway doesn't reappear.

Oh, and this text entry widget sucks. My spellchecker doesn't work, the navigation keys are fubar, etc...

But I do have pretty fonts and colors and syntax highlighting other useless stuff so I guess that makes up for the reduced functionality.

Time to go check out the Big Blue Room.

-X

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