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Well the title sums it up.
Chris, rather than coming back here and posting my top 10 problems with the forums that still haven't been fixed, I've just stayed away for a week or two at a time, where I used to come to the forums virtually every evening. I'll spend 20 minutes in the General Forums to see what's been done to fix the problems (mostly nothing, as far as I can see) and then a few minutes in the Photoshop Windows forum, but the forum is unusable for anything but asking a simple question and getting a simple answ
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dave milbut wrote:
…i've also seen groups and some very "unsinkable" people go down because they failed to be able to admit that they have a failed project on their hands and rather than dump that albatross and move on, they tie it around their necks and wear it like a badge of ho
nrror until it stinks to high heaven. THEN the body count starts to rise...
Nothing I have typed—or even thought—suggestes that I have in any way discounted that very real possibility.
Nor do I think Chris thinks this is not a failed project and/or an albatross at this time. If anything, I suspect he is as upset as the rest of us or more.
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"Nor do I think Chris thinks this is not a failed project and/or an albatross at this time"
I do not think it is a failure. It is simply a project in progress. It is improving.
Yes, there are some things I don't like about the new forums. Some I think must be fixed ASAP, and some I can ignore until we revisit the decisions that lead to their inclusion.
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This was the best starting point available. Now, can you work with us to make it the best?
Absolutely. How can we help?
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Is the issue of repeating posts as in 'More progress' on the list? Top half or bottom half?
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dave milbut wrote:
on the other hand, i've also seen groups and some very "unsinkable" people go down because they failed to be able to admit that they have a failed project on their hands and rather than dump that albatross and move on, they tie it around their necks and wear it like a badge of ho
nrror until it stinks to high heaven. THEN the body count starts to rise...
I'd be interested to hear about what happened to the members of "The Adobe Web Team" who became kind of visible sometime around the "Great FuseTalk Forums and Adobe Studio Exchange Makeover Failure of Aught-Seven?" The folks who showed up at the table all shiny-faced and smiling, ready to take the AdobeForums world by storm, to make it the best damn User-Driven site on the planet?
Remember how enthusiastic they seemed to be when they were soliciting our opinions and feedback? How chirpy they were about listening to users about what we wanted? All the lofty and useful changes we were going to see with the ASX? Many of us had some GREAT ideas for how things could be made better...ideas that didn't require massive changes to the nuts & bolts, ideas that only required CSS elements to be tweaked.
Like quite a few others, I contributed back then. I painstakingly answered questions posed by " 'Our' Adobe Web Team" and filled out a poll/questionnaire or two. I crafted a few deeply-considered UI mockups which utilized space more efficiently and guided the eyes more naturally, and sent them along to the folks I thought might implement them, or—at the very least—think about incorporating some of my ideas.
The feedback we got during that time started off fairly decent, then quickly trailed off into nothing as it became clear to all involved that the Web Team was trying to jump start a pile of sludge.
Then they disappeared, without so much of a whimper, and WebX came back.
I wonder what happened to "Our" Adobe Web Team?
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Phos±four dots wrote:
I'd be interested to hear about what happened to the members of "The Adobe Web Team" who became kind of visible sometime around the "Great FuseTalk Forums and Adobe Studio Exchange Makeover Failure …
Yeah, does anyone know what became of David Hatch, Chief Information Architect, User Experience Team Sr. Mgr for Adobe.com at Adobe Systems?
Wonder if he's still involved with the user experience?
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Ramón G Castañeda wrote:
Yeah, does anyone know what became of David Hatch, Chief Information Architect, User Experience Team Sr. Mgr for Adobe.com at Adobe Systems?
His blog was only accessible through Google cache a few minutes ago:
http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:3vvrl9hTxyIJ:weblogs.macromedia.com/dhatch/archives/2007/01/hi_all_since_th.cfm+david+hatch+adobe&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us
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He looks a bit right of centre to me.
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This is a much better position (left of center)
The don't want computer tech to related to GOP. They hate any kind of change, or progress.
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PjonesCET wrote:
The don't want computer tech to related to GOP.
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Ann Shelbourne wrote:
Neither am I prepared to contribute until both the Points system and the "Community Experts" labels are removed — both of which features I find thoroughly insulting to the rest of us.
Hear! Hear! Hear!
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Ann Shelbourne wrote:
Chris Cox wrote:
We cannot go back to webx.
Why not?
This is a good question here, not irrelevant at all. People that have spent hours and hours of their time answering questions for Adobe customers, for free, deserve at least an explanation for this. And it's not "childish" asking for this: childish == worthless "point systems" and stupid "special forum e-penis titles".
I suspect part of the answer will be "it will make certain people who made certain decisions look incredibly bad due to all the money and time that was wasted".
Of course, we as customers, couldn't care less about internal company politics. Especially if it means saving the rear of anyone responsible for cursing us with the evil of Jive software.
I like how the response on their forum was basically "give us more money for a new version"--typical answer for one of these money sucking software contractor companies. They've pulled a fast one on you all, Adobe. Time to pull the plug now before the losses get even worse!
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If you want these fairly basic, obvious features, pay for an upgrade. Hmmm, where have we heard that before?
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Kath-H wrote:
If you want these fairly basic, obvious features, pay for an upgrade. Hmmm, where have we heard that before?
<keanu>whoa!</keanu>
i smell a buyout...
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Kath-H wrote:
If you want these fairly basic, obvious features, pay for an upgrade. Hmmm, where have we heard that before?
From the last scam artist, thieving contractors that will say and do anything to get you to buy their product or services, regardless of whether it really fits your needs or not? Noooooooo... that never happens in IT... right?
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Kath-H wrote:
If you want these fairly basic, obvious features, pay for an upgrade. Hmmm, where have we heard that before?
From Adobe, for one: "Bridge 2.x (CS3) is a piece of cr@p, but Bridge 3.x in CS4 is better."
Not funny.
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Ramón G Castañeda wrote:
Not funny.
no, but there is some sort of cosmic justice to it...
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"You know this is a disaster what politics are in play here?"
No, I know that it is mostly working.
Sure, there are problems - and we're trying to get them solved. But it takes time to fix them.
There are some politics, and I'm trying to work on that as well. That takes more time (like I've got any to spare).
Having a few of the "usual suspects" constantly overstating the problems and throwing tantrums tends to drown out the real problems (noise >> signal). Please try to keep the problem discussions focused. Explain the problems, ask about features you may not understand the reason for (like the #$%@!% points, er, um, scuse me), don't go into hyperbole, then wait for a response.
Remember that the forum team is busy right now (Adobe's and Jive's). They've got a new product with lots of rough edges (some visible, some not). As explained in another thread - you may not get a response instantly. But they are paying attention, and they are working on the problems. (give em some slack, dude)
Look, we all want a working forum. But there was no premade forum that was going to work perfectly out of the box. This was the best starting point available. Now, can you work with us to make it the best?
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Chris Cox wrote:
We cannot go back to webx.
How many times do we have to say that before it sinks in?
Forever, until we're told WHY. Intelligent people aren't willing to blindly take the word of others, they want to know all the facts, it's the difference between sheeple and being an informed person. Do you want us to all turn into sheeple?
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I believe Chris said earlier that contracts have ended, new ones been signed.
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At least that's an answer. So basically Adobe has been duped by Jive, the criminal swindlers.
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so they bought a "contract". i'll wager nothing says they have to actually "use" the software. let it sit on the shelf until the contract expires. bring back web crossing and pay them to set up and scale the site correctly.
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The Jive Manifesto states, "It's about doing a lot more, with a lot less." A lot more means a lot more logging in, and a lot less means no NNTP.
Best,
Christopher
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No, I didn't give any details. Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to provide the details.
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Sorry, Chris, I knew I'd seen it somewhere. From Peter Spier:
Last time there was still the opportunity to go back to the old system. That is no longer true due to ended contracts
http://forums.adobe.com/message/1917780#1917780