That's awfully good of you to recommend that course of action

Community Beginner ,
Jun 14, 2018 Jun 14, 2018

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That's awfully good of you to recommend that course of action. I see that you are "Staff". [Comment removed: edited for content].

Here's the scoop: you know very well that reporting a bug to Adobe is pointless. I have spoken recently with a developer of plugins who said that there are bugs which he has been trying to get Adobe to fix for 4 years. That's four years.

Indeed, the whole Premiere Pro edifice is so shaky that anyone editing other than simple cuts will immediately face never ending crashes. If you plop more than, say, 4 plugins into a shot you will face massive rendering times and system collapse. I believe that this is because Premiere Pro, in current form, is compromised by the fact that it is about 20 years old (possibly more) and the foundation is weak. All sorts of turrets and crenelations have been built onto this castle - including renaming and repackaging it. These changes are simply lipstick on a pig.

It is my belief that Adobe is intentionally and negligently selling a product which is of a very low order and which constantly disappoints those who are paying the license fee. We are treated to new versions and empty promises ad infinitum.

And Adobe does not really give a hoot because it is a company whose employees are secure in their jobs and who are looking forward to their pensions kicking in. Why upset the status quo?

Now look at the vibrant Blackmagic and their constantly exciting lineup. It's a world away, isn't it? And that's why I have recently started the process of porting all my EDLs over to DaVinci.

But it hasn't happened to date. And, apparently, I am the only user who is so outraged that I make this attempt to rally my fellow editors and spur them into action.

I am, no doubt, dreaming.

Harry.

Moderator Note: Edited for content: Please do not discuss legal issues on these forums. Please do not personally attack staff or other community members. Be kind. These items are against Adobe community guidelines.

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LEGEND ,
Jun 14, 2018 Jun 14, 2018

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reporting a bug to Adobe is pointless.

I've seen it work.

Though I would concur that the developers over at Blackmagic are doing a better job of it, overall.

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 15, 2018 Jun 15, 2018

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I'm sure you are correct. That's very nice. But the fact that someone reported a bug and "it worked" does not truly improve the overall situation.

Harry.

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LEGEND ,
Jun 15, 2018 Jun 15, 2018

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the fact that someone reported a bug and "it worked" does not truly improve the overall situation.

It can, if you let it.

The point is that bug reporting does produce results, contrary to your belief.  So folks should report them.  The more that do, the better.  If readers accept your view and don't report, that would make the system less effective.

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 15, 2018 Jun 15, 2018

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Jim. thank you for the reply.

You are correct - especially in saying that members should do so more often - "the more the better".

Are you implying that, when I call tech support in India, my particular problem is not reported and added to the list of bugs? I suspect you would be right. I have never filed a bug report - largely because I would find it difficult to attribute, say, the program hanging or crashing to a particular source or a particular set of commands I have issued. I assume that there are boffins among us who better understand the inner workings of Premiere Pro and are able to bring more concise comments to a bug report.

My report would have to say - on an hourly basis: "PP crashed while exporting" or "PP hangs when I have more than 7 plugins running", or "PP refuses to shut down. Cannot exit program". These seem to me to be describing a general situation rather than pointing out a specific and traceable fault.

I guess a useful bug report would read: "Noah's Ark crashed and sank into Sea of Galilee caused by leak in starboard strut #164 due to aforementioned nail being of incorrect size 24b (series v.3.9.0) and not the size 153c (BC 239, new release) recommended in Ark plans. This nail was fitted on Wednesday afternoon Sept 31st BC 2500 by Joey Darwin-Smashdweller III. Recommend stripping joist, refitting with size 153c unit and firing Joey."

The above is detailed and useful because great care has been taken in depicting Joey's work. I could only say "it sank (crashed)" which doesn't help much because everybody knows that Prem Pro is very crashy.

It appears that you also have faith that such reporting to Adobe produces results - and that someone at Abobe actually reads the report and that a crack Adobe forensic task force is dispatched to track down the bug. I suggest that this happens very rarely. Between all the faults reported on the bug report site and all those reported to tech support, I think the engineers must have thrown up their hands in despair and responded to these alerts by shrugging and lighting up another spliff.

In short, it's difficult to imagine that bug reporting works because, in the three years I have endured Prem Pro, not a single bug - even a well established bug (such as refusing to close down) has been cured. Not one. Truly.

But I admire your loyalty to Adobe and you are obviously very experienced.

Harry

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 15, 2018 Jun 15, 2018

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I am sure that you are correct both in principle and in practice. The reason I shed doubt on this procedure is that I have not seen a single one of the multiple PP problems which I have encountered, solved. And these are common bugs - for instance, as I wrote, the one where it refuses to shut down which is pretty common ... or the generalized crashing and hanging. Surely, over the three years I have used PP, there might have been a marginal improvement, no? I'm taling about very common problems.

I'll give you another example of what I consider to be a careless attitude of the Adobe people ... I have recently read (here) that reverting to PP 2017 is a good idea and that many people find it far more stable than 2018. So, when I call up tech support, why do they not tell me this? Truly, why? Apparently this is a damn good idea. I am stuck right now with project files which are in 2018 and, as we know, cannot open them in PP 2017. And exporting an XML does not bring over a whole bunch of information. So that's a bummer which could have saved me multiple hours of agony.

I do understand that you are talking sense. I get it. However, I have to add some doubt as to the general efficiency of the Abobe operation and that would tend to cover whether they actually do much work on fixing bugs - because i simple have not experienced this - although I accept that you personally have had this happen.

I am not being disrespectful - in fact I am very pleased that a handful of people, such as yourself, have responded in one way or another.

Tell me, though ... are you satisfied with PP? Are you satisfied with the overall response to faults within the program. I should be surprised if you were.

For myself, I would have been better using Fina Cut Pro (the old one, legacy v 7.01) or perhaps the new FCP. It's difficult to imagine a prpgram less stable than FCP legacy, but it is my experience that I have hit the jackpot with PP and I'm more than annoyed about it.

Do you recall the initial advertising for PP CC 3 years ago? There was something called "the Adobe Promise". Not one item in that list of promiss has been kept.

With respect for your endurance and experience, Harry (PS I'm just going out so have not checked for typos. Apoogies)

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 18, 2018 Jun 18, 2018

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Dear Loyal Reader,

Welcome back to the land of horrid comments.

I note that the moderators, in their wisdom, have elected to remove my exhortations to Adobe CC Premiere Pro renters that they consider whether they have been misled by Adobe. SInce my personal opinions have now been censored and enthusiastically cleaned up, my previous posts have, largely, been transformed and reduced to pointless rambling.

I had foolishly forgotten that this board is owned by Adobe and that their moderators, no doubt influenced by their loyalty to Adobe.

The moderators, who may well be awfully nice people, are acting in the best interests of Adobe - not, apparently, the customers.

I dare the moderators to tell me that these "community guidelines" were set forth by the community. No way. These guidelines were almost certainly put in place by adobe and associated flacks. I suspect that my words were not entirely what Adobe had in mind when they set up this board. These moderators also told me that I should "be kind".

I wish you Adobe customers would stop whining about how awful Premiere Pro is and take a position which is actually helpful. Complaining does nothing. Adobe's policy appears to be to ignore complaint. Hey - why bother to fix PP? It's pretty much un-fixable anyway.  And I have to believe that Adobe has tried - probably very hard - to mend it. But it seems that they can't. It's too far gone. The all around awfulness of this application is beyond repair. Better to start again and develop a new editing program. But that ain't gonna happen because the Adobe people simply don't care about matters of ethics. They are not immoral, they are amoral ... they don't understand what purpose there is in behaving decently and honestly with their customers.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall in one of the Adobe software engineers' offices if they read this incredibly long opinion. Do you think they would cluck to each other about what nonsense I am spouting, or do you think that they would agree with me, but say nothing, the better to remain safe and secure.

I dunno. You editors will continue to wail and whinge about PP and it's instability and general awfulness, bit you will not take action. That's why you are not directors. You are not people with the strength, will or determination to stand up and say: "No! Enough! Fraud!."

I wish you well and, as previously mentioned, I'm now going to get cracking on learning Blackmagic's editing and FX software. So far so good. Amazingly not one crash or hang in 2 weeks.

Eat your hearts out.

Hugs

and genuine affection from your fellow ex-sufferer,

Harry.

Moderator Note, Comments removed: Warning. Please do not discuss legal action. It is against our community guidelines.

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Adobe Employee ,
Jun 18, 2018 Jun 18, 2018

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Hello,

I note that the moderators, in their wisdom, have elected to remove my exhortations to Adobe CC Premiere Pro renters that they consider whether they have been misled by Adobe.

Rants are not allowed on the forum. You can also not mention legal action. The topics you brought up had nothing to do with troubleshooting the OPs post. I did not remove your post, I branched it and moved it to our off topic forum, the normal course of action for such posts.

SInce my personal opinions have now been censored and enthusiastically cleaned up, my previous posts have, largely, been transformed and reduced to pointless rambling.


Your personal opinions have been retained. We do appreciate any helpful feedback you can give. Legal action, rants, personal attacks on staff and other members are not permitted, however. Those have been removed. We have community guidelines, please abide by them.

I dare the moderators to tell me that these "community guidelines" were set forth by the community. No way. These guidelines were almost certainly put in place by adobe and associated flacks.


Community guidelines are created by Adobe. We allow all commentary around our products and services that is critical, however, you have to abide by the rules. No attacks, no rants, no posts about legal issues. Sorry if that does not work for you. Furthermore, if your post is off topic, it can be subject to being branched and/or moved to another place more apropos for off topic discussion. Your post did nothing to assist the OP, so this was done. This was nothing personal, we treat all posts equally.

The moderators, who may well be awfully nice people, are acting in the best interests of Adobe - not, apparently, the customers.


I moderated, branched, and moved your post. I am an Adobe employee and acted on behalf of Adobe.

These moderators also told me that I should "be kind".

Personally attacking employees or community members is a not allowed. Please treat people kindly, as you would in normal life. Not too much to ask, I think.

Thanks for understanding.

Regards,
Kevin

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LEGEND ,
Jun 18, 2018 Jun 18, 2018

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I'm now going to get cracking on learning Blackmagic's editing and FX software.

I've gone down that path myself.  I strongly recommend the following:

https://www.amazon.com/Definitive-Guide-DaVinci-Resolve-Blackmagic/dp/0999391305

While neither program is perfect, I do believe Blackmagic is kicking Adobe's behind in both professional features and price.  I think Adobe has some serious catching up to do.

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 14, 2018 Jun 14, 2018

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Well written, my friend. You covered all the complaints I have about Adobe in a concise, eloquently written post.

Too bad they're just going to ignore you.

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Adobe Employee ,
Jun 14, 2018 Jun 14, 2018

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Though we of course cannot respond to every post, we don't ignore our users, or the forums.

As Reg rightly pointed out, User Voice is the best way to provide actionable feedback to the team.

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 15, 2018 Jun 15, 2018

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Thank you, juanm4. And you are correct that Adobe will ignore me. That is their standard operating procedure and it's pretty much how they have got away with Premiere Pro.  However, this post was not aimed at them. They are a lost cause and beyond hope. The post was aimed at the users who have been duped into paying for a product which is borderline unusable.

[Edited for content: comment removed] It would seem that editors are passive souls. And, who knows, there may be countless thousands out there who think that the frequent crashes and freezes are their own fault.

In any event, thank you for your reply. I won't bother to follow up or further waken the snoozing giant. I'm busy learning DaVinci and Fusion.

Best wishes, Harry.

Moderator Note: comment was removed. Please do not discuss legal issues on these forums. It is against Adobe Community Guidelines.

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