Auto Save Not Actually Saving

Community Beginner ,
May 18, 2017 May 18, 2017

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I have now been burned twice by the Auto Save function not working in Adobe Audition CC.  After 30 minutes of editing a session in the multitrack, AA crashes.  When I open Audition, a dialog comes up asking if I want to open the backed up files.  I click "Continue", and my session opens to the state it was in 40 minutes ago when I recorded the first bit of audio....unedited.  I checked my Backup folder and sure enough, the last backup was done 40 minutes ago.

I go to Preferences>Audio Save and both check boxes are enabled.  Auto Save recovery data every 10 minutes and Backup multitrack session files automatically every 3 minutes with a max number of backup files set to 10.  The files are saved within the session folder.

2017-05-18.png

Why is the Auto Save function in AA not saving a new file every three minutes?  What am I missing?  I am beyond frustrated right now.

Dave

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People's Champ ,
May 18, 2017 May 18, 2017

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Well, you have session data set to save every three minutes but you're only saving your sound data every ten minutes.

However,  I think a giveaway here might be a combination of Audition crashing  so often (my last crash was several years ago and caused by a lightning strike) and the fact that you're putting your back up into the same folder as your session.  If your HDD is starting to have problems or some other app is grabbing your disk, the same issue that causes the crash could/would also affect the backup.  For reference, I have my backup set to go to an external USB3 hard drive.

As with most crash scenarios, your best bet if fo follow the instructions in Audition Crashed. Now what?   These reports are read by the developers and they can usually provide a pretty quick explanation of what's going wrong.

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Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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I think the explanation of why the app crashed is valuable, but more relevant is why Audition is not auto-saving when it is set to do that.

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People's Champ ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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I'd be willing to guess that analysing the reason for the crash may also solve the Auto Save issue.  I strongly suggest submitting a crash log and getting it analysed by the developers.

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Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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Well, I haven't had an issue with crashing. But when I've tried to access earlier work (as I do a lot of destructive editing because of the way I deal with large amounts material) by going back to earlier versions of my edits... there are just a few there. There should be about 20 versions created per hour. So, it's not because of crashing that I became aware of the error in auto save.

Based on this, I've looked at the back-up file and noticed that Audition isn't successfully backing up. With this awareness I save manually constantly. At some point I'll have a crash and will have forgotten to manually save and be screwed. So, for now I have no crash reports to submit.

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People's Champ ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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The Autosave feature only works in Multitrack.  If you're doing destructive editing in Waveform view, you have to do your own saves.

For anything in Multitrack, have you checked your settings in Edit/Preferences/Auto Save?  The norm would be to save session data once every ten minutes, with audio data saved more often, say every 3 minutes.  Twenty versions per hour (of sessions) would be a much higher number of saves than usual.

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Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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This isn't a case of a user error. Auto save to recovery of data is set to every 3 minutes and the back up of multi track files is set to every 3 minutes.

I shouldn't have mentioned destructive editing because I think that threw you off. In professional audio production "destructive" editing can be used for specific kinds of edits in conjunction with multitrack edits. Thus, when I look at prior editing versions I'm using auto save as a tool to reference earlier multi-track modulations and fades. But, forget I mentioned it. The meaning of my prior message is that I've noticed I can't use auto save as a tool because it isn't working properly.

Here is what I'm talking about. Note the Iyengar and Susannah Fox projects. Over the course of about 2 to 3 hours of editing in each of these projects only 2 auto-saves occurred. Yes, they were 3 minutes apart. But there should be many more.

Screen Shot 2017-05-22 at 10.35.47 PM.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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I've spent the last little while looking at project backup folders on my DAW to see what the situation is there, as I store mine the same way you do - on a local drive. I'm fortunate; things don't crash too often, and because I save mixdown intermediates, I generally don't need to go to backups very often, if at all. The upshot is that I don't look in the backup folder very often, either.

But what I can see there looks very much like what you're experiencing. Which got me to thinking about it, and wondering why. I have a potential explanation of what's going on, and I don't think you're going to be too impressed. Come to that, I'm not either; it's messy. Here is the entire contents of a typical backup folder on my system:

Backup.JPG

You will notice that even though it's about one session, the session has been edited on more than one occasion - in fact, three. But the folder is only allowed to keep ten files in it, and that's all any of mine contain. I think that the problem arises not because of failures to save, but because of a strange way of prioritising the way files are deleted. My guess here is that it's using the Windows file name protocol (or something like that) to get rid of old files, and not the date/time protocol, which is clearly what it should be using.

If you want a quick fix, I'd say that the answer is simply to increase the number of backups that can be saved in a folder to a much higher number - like in the hundreds. Then, the system won't have to delete any because of reaching the folder limit.

Meanwhile, through channels, I will make some further inquiries about this...

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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I should add that if, because of your folder protocol, you are saving backups for more than one session in a single folder, the situation will be worse anyway under this scenario; you'll just end up with effectively random deletions across the sessions. Probably better also to keep them separate, as well as increasing the allowable number of saves.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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SteveG(AudioMasters)  wrote

Meanwhile, through channels, I will make some further inquiries about this...

I have received at least a little clarification about this, which I can share with you. And it's pretty clear that the UI doesn't exactly go into a lot of detail about this either. Like any at all...

It goes something like this: The dialog in preferences appears to offer a "Backup interval" in minutes, but it doesn't quite mean what you think it might, or indeed ought to. This is just the minimum interval. Apparently a backup file is written only if anything has changed in the document in the three minutes since it started counting again after the last save. So any expectation that you might have had that you would get a backup file every three minutes is not going to be realised anyway - by design. This is simply to prevent the recording of a large number of identical backups when you leave a session open and go for a coffee break.

Now, before you start shouting and screaming about

"I click "Continue", and my session opens to the state it was in 40 minutes ago when I recorded the first bit of audio....unedited.  I checked my Backup folder and sure enough, the last backup was done 40 minutes ago."

I read that too, and it has not gone unnoticed elsewhere. What needs to happen now is a test based on the principle I outlined above, to establish whether any backups that should be being created are indeed missing. If they are, then this would be a bug. I'm going to check this here, and if anybody else reading this would like to as well, that would be great - just report it back into this thread.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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To add a little more clarification to this, this is what's supposed to happen in a session:


On open/creating a new session, a backup file is written ASAP.
If the session is modified, then
a) if the last backup was longer ago than the specified interval: write a new backup file ASAP
b) if the last backup was less then the interval minutes ago: write a new backup file as soon as the full specified interval time has passed.

Apparently the file name contains a creation date and time encoded into it, and files are deleted in the correct order.

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Community Beginner ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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I have set number of saves high, to 120. Doesn't seem to affect anything. In my latest session over the weekend I edited a 30 minute program over the course of 3 hours and performed about 500 multitrack edits and operations. Auto save only produced 4 back up files all within the first 10 minutes of when I started editing.

Moreover, I'm merely pointing out the dearth of back up files because I'd like to use them to make comparisons of versions from time to time. I edit news features and talk shows and it would be a helpful tool to be able to recall earlier edits.

My issue is not crashes and lost material. I have come to copiously manually save when I edit.

So, I'm not sure about what you're saying applies to this.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
May 23, 2017 May 23, 2017

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JasonLopez  wrote

I have set number of saves high, to 120. Doesn't seem to affect anything. In my latest session over the weekend I edited a 30 minute program over the course of 3 hours and performed about 500 multitrack edits and operations. Auto save only produced 4 back up files all within the first 10 minutes of when I started editing.

That's pretty much as I suspected it might be, from what you were saying previously.

JasonLopez  wrote

My issue is not crashes and lost material. I have come to copiously manually save when I edit.

So, I'm not sure about what you're saying applies to this.

I don't think it does either - the 'crash' scenario is different. Your issue seems to me to be purely about session file backups not being quite what Adobe thinks they are - if you get what I mean. It would be good though if a few other people could replicate this.

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New Here ,
Mar 13, 2021 Mar 13, 2021

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I am having similar auto-save issues. Does Adobe realize that this feature is not working as advertised?

 

If I have multitrack autosave settings set so every 3 minutes it saves my work in a backup folder (say in a folder on a hard drive) and the number of saves is set at 120 like Jason Lopez...

JasonLopez  wrote

 

I have set number of saves high, to 120. Doesn't seem to affect anything. In my latest session over the weekend I edited a 30 minute program over the course of 3 hours and performed about 500 multitrack edits and operations. Auto save only produced 4 back up files all within the first 10 minutes of when I started editing.

Then, what the eff is the reason for having that feature in the first place?

 

Is anyone else looking at this and wondering why it's still broken?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Mar 14, 2021 Mar 14, 2021

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The feature is not broken, and works exactly as advertised unless you try backing up to a cloud location, in which case all bets are off. You do realise that this is only session data that gets backed up, not actual audio? And the nunmber of edits you make is immaterial - it's the session file state at the backup point that gets saved - just a snapshot. So it won't save things like undos.

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New Here ,
Mar 14, 2021 Mar 14, 2021

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Oh Steve, but it is "broken." It's not-as-advertised so it's de-facto broken.

 

For context, I'm not talking about the actual audio. I think I speak for many when I say, making manual copies of audio you've altered destructively is good practice.

The issue is with the "backup" part of autosave: I think we can all agree that .sesx files act as a ledger in time, recording, as you say, a snapshot of someone's multitrack work.

Audition advertises in its settings as "[] Backup Multitrack Session Files Automatically." It reads to me as a feature that allows me to look back across a window at an interval I can control - this is what I believe Jason Lopez is alluding to and the reason many of us feel burned by Adobe. 

 

Take this situation:

I'm working on a session, in multitrack. There's 40 min of multitrack tape I've edited across multiple tracks -- scored music, FX, host and guest interview, pre-roll and mid-roll ad breaks.

Let's say I add a plugin to the effects rack, a reputable one like Izotope, let's say. I make my adjustments to the plugin and then... pop... my Audition crashes. Not only does it crash, but my .sesx file that I was manually saving every 5-10 minutes (because I know it's important) is gone. I mean, it's disappeared. All I have left are the backup files... and those stopped being created 2 hours ago. It's infuriating.

 

I can send a crash report -- and I do -- but I'm also on a deadline with a client who I rely on for my rent money or healthcare. I can stop using the plugin, but that doesn't retrieve my lost .sesx file. Instead, I have to into Time Machine to find the .sesx file - a feature I shouldn't have to rely on at all if Multitrack Session File Backup worked the way it has been advertised to me.

 

In short... Audition is selling a feature in its DAW that does. not. work. as. advertised.

 

So, my question to Adobe and the community is... will this be fixed? Or will Adobe at least use all that dead space in the setting window to clearly and appropriately describe HOW auto save and backup works so that users aren't duped into thinking this is a reliable feature - because it isn't. If there are cloud conflicts, can they alert us about that? WTF Adobe... why are we paying you monthly subscriptions for something like this?

 

unrestfully,

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

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New Here ,
Jun 03, 2021 Jun 03, 2021

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I've had this exact same thing happen twice. It doesn't happen with Premier. It actually does back ups. What's up?

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Community Beginner ,
Jun 12, 2021 Jun 12, 2021

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Same issue here. I totally agree, not only would multitrack backups be incredibly useful references (when it works and doesn't just stop backing up, I've been able to look at them), but WHY would it just stop backing up the session. It seems to be random when it stops, as well. It does restart the backups when reopening Audition, but literal days of my work history are missing.

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Community Beginner ,
May 22, 2017 May 22, 2017

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I'm having the same issue. I'm saving to my Creative Cloud folder. I can work for 3 hours on a project and although auto-save is set to every three minutes for multi track session files, there will be only 4 or 5 saves generated over that span of time. I hate it and constantly save manually. The auto save function is totally unreliable.

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Community Beginner ,
Apr 30, 2018 Apr 30, 2018

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Same issue...  I have all sound files saved locally and was working on the multitrack (basic tracklay) with the AutoSave supposedly saving to the cloud.  Only it didn't and I lost 2 hours worth of work.

Disgusting.

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New Here ,
Sep 12, 2018 Sep 12, 2018

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I just lost two days of voice over work because Audition does not auto-save correctly. Recovering from crashes has never worked either. For me this happens when multiple multi-track sessions are open at the same time. Audition seems to be saving only one of the multi-track sessions. Unfortunately for me, not the one I was actually working on.

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