Bibliotecas CC - Indesign convierte imágenes TIFF en PNG

Community Beginner ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Tengo una biblioteca con imágenes TIFF en capas.

Si uso esta biblioteca en Indesign, las imágenes TIFF me las convierte en PNG.

¿Esto es normal?

¿Hay alguna forma de que mantenga el formato original del archivo?

gracias

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Cual tipo de biblioteca usas?

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Hi franp30034553 ,

if I the translation of the forum is right you are using CC Libraries.

It's not normal that stored TIFF image assets are turned into PNG images by placing them to InDesign pages.

How did you store the TIFF images as assets?
Was this with PhotoShop? Illustrator? InDesign?

What's your version of InDesign and version of operating system?

Regards,
Uwe

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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The library was created with Bridge.

Bridge version: 9.1.0.338

Indesign version: 14.0.2

OS: Mac OS 10.12.6

thx Uwe

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Hi franp30034553 ,

I'd like to replicate the issue on my system.

Could you provide a sample TIFF file through Dropbox or a similar service and post the download link?

Hm. Did you import a library to Adobe Bridge?
Or did you create a new library with Bridge and just added the TIFF image?

What is the creator app of the TIFF image?

Regards,
Uwe

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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I created a new library in Bridge with Photoshop files.

I send you an image for you to try:

WeTransfer

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Hi franp30034553 ,

thank you for providing the image.

I can replicate the issue with:

Adobe Bridge 9.1.0.338

InDesign CC 2019 14.0.2.324

TIFF-Placed-with-CCLibrary-vs-PlacedFromFile-CC-2019.PNG

Regards,
Uwe

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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thx

Let's see if we solve it

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Adobe Employee ,
Jul 18, 2019 Jul 18, 2019

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Hi Fran,

Thanks for raising this. We were able to reproduce the issue at our end and it has been reported the product team. Please upvote this issue on the Uservoice link shared by Uwe and stay tuned for updates.

This is the best way of communicating with the Engineering and Product Management teams regarding issues and suggestions so they can be implemented in future releases.

Regards,

Srishti

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 22, 2019 Jul 22, 2019

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Hi Srishti,

maybe the report should be done at Adobe InDesign UserVoice and Adobe Illustrator UserVoice as well. And removed or closed at Adobe Bridge UserVoice. Only two users have voted to fix the bug so far.

Regards,
Uwe

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 23, 2019 Jul 23, 2019

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Adobe Employee ,
Jul 24, 2019 Jul 24, 2019

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Thanks for your continuous support, Uwe. This issue has already been raised to the engineering team and they are looking into it.

Regards!

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Valorous Hero ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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This behaviour is correct, but could be improved by InDesign.

The CC Libraries basically don't store any content as ordinary files, but as vector and/or pixel based 'stuff'. Sounds maybe a bit silly, but that's what it is in essence. So when you drag files from Bridge into its CC Library, they're converted to whatever is the best kind of stuff for that content. The fact that it originated from a certain file format with a certain name and type, is probably only a mention in a tag. After all, the asset might even have been a selection of an unsaved document.

But as you can see by the popup info, the CC Libraries panel still has a notion of the file's original file type !

Schermafbeelding 2019-07-16 om 13.20.02.png

When this asset is placed in InDesign, it is being handled as a bunch of pixels. When you create a package, InDesign needs no clue of the original file type of the asset, neither does it need to know its original whereabouts. So InDesign just generates the file with an appropriate format, being PNG for this kind of stuff. Which is also basically a good choice, unless you're working with imagery in CMYK mode or in modes higher than 8-bits per channel. These will be converted to 8-bits RGB in a PNG file. (Layers, transparencies, and blend modes are preserved.)

So InDesign might improve its method, by letting you specify which kind of file format you'd prefer for such files, not just for mimicking the original file (if there has been one), but also to preserve these modes (CMYK, higher then 8-bits) which are lost in a PNG output.

(Illustrator also offers the option to select from some file types upon exporting embedded images.)

If you need to recreate those TIFF files right now, you can use the web view of your CC Libraries, where you can select a file and download it in the original or some other preferred file type:

Schermafbeelding 2019-07-16 om 13.33.15.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Hi Peter,

tried a PSD file as asset with Adobe Bridge and a CC Library.

Placed that PSD image and InDesign is recognizing the PSD as PSD.

So I think something's wrong with TIFF images.

PSD-Placed-with-CCLibrary-vs-PlacedFromFile-CC-2019.PNG

Regards,
Uwe

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Community Beginner ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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thanks for the explanation.

Yes, the PSD files manage them well.

I'll have to convert the files to PSD 🙂

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Valorous Hero ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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The combination, that is: TIFF assets into InDesign.

InDesign just doesn't want to generate that format.

There's no problem with CC, Bridge, or the TIFF itself.

I tried several versions of them and they all went PNG...

Adobe Illustrator behaves the same way for packaging.

So the behaviour is quite consistent, perhaps a policy.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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Hi Peter,

thank you for testing!

Did some tests as well with a very simple TIFF image. No transparency, just RGB pixels with a standard sRGB color profile.

The image in the library is tagged as TIF, however it is placed as PNG. I consider this a bug in the import mechanism of InDesign.

Easy-TIFF-Placed-with-CCLibrary-vs-PlacedFromFile-CC-2019.PNG

As you can see a placed TIFF from a file successfully is showing the sRGB profile or the LStar profile.

InDesign simply cannot maintain the placed asset of a TIF file as TIFF. It is "converted" ( ? ) to PNG with transparency.

FWIW: My simple TIFF image has no transparency applied.

Regards,
Uwe

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Valorous Hero ,
Jul 16, 2019 Jul 16, 2019

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So InDesign is intentionally interpreting (upon placing from the CC Libraries) and converting (upon packaging) the image data of a TIFF as a PNG. While it knows exactly how to deal with TIFF data, because you can still place regular TIFF files (not from CC Libraries). A difference might be that linked files just need to be copied, while CC Library assets are chunks of data – not files (anymore or yet).

Maybe the creation of a TIFF file is prohibited by legal restrictions ? Compression schemes are not always free. But strangely enough, Adobe is the owner and current developer of the TIFF format (acquired through Aldus). So they know very well how it works, and they don't need to license it from some one else. The PNG is an open format. Might that be the reason ?

TIFF - Wikipedia

PNG - Wikipedia 

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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I filed a bug report at Adobe Bridge Uservoice in category LIBRARY:

Why? Illustrator is affected as well. It's not only InDesign. So my guess is that the bug is with CC Libraries that are created with Adobe Bridge. I could be wrong, but let's see what the developers tell us.

You can vote for fixing the bug if you follow this link to Adobe Bridge Uservoice:

TIFF images added to CC Library are considered as PNG images when lib is used with InDesign or Illus...

Regards,
Uwe

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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I filed a bug report at Adobe Bridge Uservoice in category LIBRARY:

Another curious thing I'm seeing is all InDesign Links have to be stored locally. So if I choose Edit Original on the converted PNG Link, and check its path when it opens in Photoshop, the path is to the system’s Temporary Items, but the format of the temporary file isn’t PNG, it‘s TIFF.

Screen Shot 14.png

Screen Shot 15.png

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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Hi Rob,

yes. I've seen this as well as I tested this with Adobe Illustrator today.

Also with InDesign now that I tested:

Edit Original

Edit with > Adobe PhotoShop CC 2019 20.0

PhotoShop opened the TIF file from:

pc name > local disk (C:) > User > user name > AppData > Local > Temp

Regards,
Uwe

EDITED: That PhotoShop will open a TIFF file is proof enough, I think, that the issue is with InDesign and Illustrator, because the CC Library is really storing the right file format. Maybe the developer teams of InDesign and Illustrator should do a little conference with the developers of Adobe Bridge and CC Libraries ?!

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Valorous Hero ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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The problem is definitely not caused by or related to Bridge.

Whether you drag a TIFF labelled asset from InDesign's own Library panel, or via the Bridge's panel into InDesign, it is described as a linked PNG resource in the Links panel. So the problem is consistent; Bridge imports and keeps the file correctly labelled as a TIFF asset – but InDesign (and Illustrator as well) imports the Library asset as a PNG, with or without Bridge.

Using Edit Original always opens a temporary and locally stored file/fragment. But it's indeed peculiar to see how the "PNG" described resource still opens as a TIFF fragment. Good catch !! We're getting closer to the initially troublemaking step in the process...

Assets in the CC Library can indeed have a type and file format. I probably simplified it too much, although dragged selections of pixels and paths don't have any file type or format as a resource. And Photoshop assets carry all kinds of data, because of the various kinds of layers (pixels, vectors, type, etc.) So it's a mix, at least. But so far, the CC Libraries and Bridge know very well how to handle them.

It's the importing of InDesign and Illustrator where it goes astray.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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Hi Peter,

may I ask how one can add a TIFF image to a CC library labeled as TIFF inside the library without using Adobe Bridge?

If I try this with a placed TIFF image from an InDesign page the label will be always Id, not TIFF, so I think an IDMS representation is stored as asset. And if you place this IDMS representation on an InDesign page you always get a placed TIFF back.

Thanks,
Uwe

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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may I ask how one can add a TIFF image to a CC library labeled as TIFF inside the library without using Adobe Bridge?

On OSX I can drag an image file from the Finder on to the InDesign Library panel and it will get added. Still get the TIFF> PNG problem dragging from the Library to a doc.

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Adobe Community Professional ,
Jul 17, 2019 Jul 17, 2019

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Thanks, Rob.

This is working on Windows as well.

And of course the same issue:

PNG in the Links panel and on the page.

Regards,
Uwe

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