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A Death of the Family

Explorer ,
Nov 06, 2009 Nov 06, 2009

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Once upon a Time the Adobe Photoshop Forum was a community.  A lot like a family.  There were members who participated daily for a decade or more. Friends. Friends who are now gone, thanks to Jive ware.

A great many of us met one another face-to-face.  Even more have talked on the phone.  We celebrated births of children, new houses, new jobs.  We commiserated over lost jobs, broken marriages, deaths.  We kept up with one another's birthdays.  We had a round robin Christmas card exchange.  Our community, though online, was a real community with daily exchanges, dear friends, like family.  Now gone.  Like a death of the family.

We shared vibrant, energized discussions of how to improve one’s skills using Photoshop.  What one person does not know, another does.  Or did.  The knowledge shared on the Photoshop forum of this day is dismal in comparison.

I personally have owned Dreamweaver about as long as I have owned Photoshop, 11 years or so.  In the beginning I tried visiting the Dreamweaver (Macromedia) forums.  They were cold, devoid of friendship, and uninviting.  No reason to go back there.  I'm not surprised a spirit of community never developed there.  I learned how to use Dreamweaver via the Adobe Photoshop forum.

Now, we old-timers, faithful Adobe customers, are being told that we should put on a happy face and learn to love Jive ware.  We are being told our discontent is the only problem. That this is the only forum that HAS a problem. This forum,  Forum Comments,  where complaints / suggestions on how to improve things  are supposed to be lodged.

We know better.  Jive ware sucks.  It has killed our community and we are supposed to learn to love it.

Also, we are being told there were numerous complaints voiced about recently banned members.

Funny thing about that.  Where are all those numerous complaints?  Perhaps that means there is another forum where these complaints were lodged?  One we, Adobe's customers are not allowed access to?  Or perhaps these complainers managed to e-mail Adobe employees?  Those same employees whose e-mail addresses are not available?

Somehow that does not have a ring of truth.

Or perhaps all these numerous complaints were lodged by one moderator?  That might make sense, if any of this makes sense.

We are told we should ask members why they were banned.  Of course since they are banned, that won't be easy will it?  That is, of course, assuming they have been told.

I must admit that while I am sorely disappointed, I am not surprised with the way Adobe has in the past and now continues to handle one member's complaints about another.

The Adobe way is to take one for a member's complaint about another and ban the accused, without so much as making the effort to contact the accused to find out their side of things.  No matter how serious the charges or how serious the repercussions to the person who has been banned.  No matter if there is not a single word of truth in the accusations.

That sucks even more than Jive ware.

Clearly our former community is of no importance to Adobe. Sorry, I cannot put on a Happy Face.

Paz

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replies 109 Replies 109
Community Beginner ,
Nov 08, 2009 Nov 08, 2009

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>but it won't really be abusive and will be deemed as being okay by the tribunal.

I think I could help out here. I have a SLEW of text documents on my desktop, that have made it into the message box, only for me to decide NOT to hit the "Post" button. All I need is a good Full Moon Monday Night!

I'm not done in here, (yet!)

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LEGEND ,
Nov 07, 2009 Nov 07, 2009

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I don't suppose anything, and I don't know what the "No" in Jochem's message means. I only know that, to this humble person, it seems that something is awfully wrong in all this. Something to do with an almost forgotten concept called "manners". And perhaps related with hiding the dirt under the carpet...

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Guru ,
Nov 09, 2009 Nov 09, 2009

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The abuse button should be turned to the OFF mode. Naming names was not a good thing as all it did was generate hurt feelings and a lot more animosity. Ann and Kath are not here to defend themselves or dispute the allegations declaired against them. 

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Explorer ,
Nov 09, 2009 Nov 09, 2009

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I find it appalling that several basic Tenants of Justice, granted by the 6th Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America, appear to have little or no value to the people running the forums of the Adobe Corporation.

Among these rights are:

The right to a Speedy Trial.

A person cannot be incarcerated for a lengthy period without having been found guilty.  (Or banished)

A Public Trial, by a Jury of their Peers

The accused cannot be tried in secret, by an all powerful, unknown tribunal.

A Notice of Accusation.

The accused has a right to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation against him/her.

Confrontation of Opposing Witnesses.

The accused has the right to be present at his/her trial.  The accused has the right to know what charges have been made against them and by whom.  The accused has the right to cross examine his/her accusers at trial.

Compulsory Process for Obtaining Favorable Witnesses.

The accused is allowed to testify on his/her own behalf and is entitled to subpoena witnesses in his/her favor.

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Explorer ,
Nov 09, 2009 Nov 09, 2009

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I received an email from a friend who has only recently become aware of what's going on here THIS TIME.

They said:

     "I did see that  some things just don't change: Adobe continues on the path of total world  domination by way of customer insults. Kicking people out of the forums, along  with insults to their character, something you're all too familiar with.  A corporation can do that if there's no  competition, eh? So welcome to the toilet paper line, comrade. The day will  come when the Adobe monopoly is busted up. Until then I will avoid  supporting them whenever and wherever I can."

I couldn't agree more.

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Mentor ,
Nov 09, 2009 Nov 09, 2009

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If this site was Public held (say Government run. Then everything you say would be  true.

Problem Is .... This is held by a privately held company. and everything such as free speech is out the door. Its only free to the extent the company allow. For example say everyone at Adobe is not allowed to wear Blue Suites and you know it. But if as a way to insult them. You say "You look good in them Blue Suits". You could be banned just for saying such. And there is nothing that can be done about it. Because its  a Forum Provided by a Private Company. In other words as long its done under the guise of a Privately held Company you can do anything you want.

Unlike Companies Like Apple that considers support forums are a necessary part of Support and also good PR. Adobe doesn't care about about either. It just an necessary irritant to be put up with.

If they thought otherwise, The forums would be better, and they would hire people that could speak proper language.  I am not saying I am aginst Foriegn People having such jobs, I just mean, if they do, they should be taught to speak in a manner the customer can understand.

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Guru ,
Nov 09, 2009 Nov 09, 2009

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.

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Advocate ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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Nice to see that someone is answering questions around here...all I wanted was some clarification but I guess that's not possible. Leads me to believe that Jochem knows he is wrong on this one.

Message was edited by Jochem van Dieten to make hidden content visible

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Guru ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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Sometimes it just makes a person wonder what the real deal is.

Message was edited by Jochem van Dieten to make hidden content visible

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Mentor ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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.

Message was edited by Jochem van Dieten to make hidden content visible

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Participant ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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Guys, guys, fret not ( unless you are playing guitar ) - All of the Photoshop regulars have moved to a newly established community on Facebook. It's only a fledgling beginning but has attracted a swarm of misplaced familiar family members. Get thou over there and sign on. It is one way that we can survive and keep our relished history together red hot and rollin'.

Just sign on and search for Photoshop Lounge

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Mentor ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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Do they have points?

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Advocate ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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nope, no points....no bannings....no deletion of posts....heck no moderation at all...well worth it.

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Guru ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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They do offer free laundry and dry cleaning services.

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Advocate ,
Nov 10, 2009 Nov 10, 2009

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And you can always poke someone.

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Engaged ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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Signup on Facebook?

Man, that is a scary concept - I might end up finding out what my son has really been up too...

   TLL

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Mentor ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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Wonder if there is one for Acrobat as well.

I'm not all that sure about Facebook anyway. After the article I read from a ZDnet news item yesterday.  You have set security in sveral different place before you really secure.

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Advocate ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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I don't see why FB should be such a security problem for you. You have practically posted your whole family tree on here before...

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Mentor ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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Not hardly.

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Participant ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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Ozzwoman9 wrote:

I don't see why FB should be such a security problem for you. You have practically posted your whole family tree on here before...

And we can see right through that blue tie you are wearing.

Really, Seriously, FB is no different than the rest of the internet. Simply post and have fun. Be smart and don't post your bank account security code, or, if you want to, do it in bold!

: - )

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Guru ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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I know were off topic. But Facebook is not all that bad Phillip. As long as you don't post anything that you feel that the company you work for will fire you about then it is safe. Same with personal information. Just like in here you don't post your home phone number and address. some posters on here use their same sign-on name for all their web place forums and such.

There are several people that post here that if you google their posting name you can find their real name, address, phone number, e-mail address and where they work, their work phone number and e-mail address. That is not a very smart thing to do. Just stay safe. 

(Polo)

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Participant ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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PjonesCET wrote:

Wonder if there is one for Acrobat as well.

I'm not all that sure about Facebook anyway. After the article I read from a ZDnet news item yesterday.  You have set security in sveral different place before you really secure.

How is it I can tell form that comment that you are running windows?

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Mentor ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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Saskatchewanobie wrote:

How is it I can tell from that comment that you are running windows?

Not very well, as I haven't  even touched a windows machine since windows98 when I help a friend defrag their Hard drive. They didn't know how to).

I worked on all kinds of computers from TI-88 Comadore, Epson, Winn, AppleII, and Mac. My first computer of my own was Radio Shak Color computer II. My second was a V-Tech Clone of an AppleIIc. My first Mac was an SE-30. since then I've been strictly Mac My latest Model is a PowerBook 17".

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LEGEND ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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PjonesCET wrote:

I worked on all kinds of computers from TI-88 Comadore, Epson, Winn, AppleII, and Mac. My first computer of my own was Radio Shak Color computer II. My second was a V-Tech Clone of an AppleIIc. My first Mac was an SE-30. since then I've been strictly Mac My latest Model is a PowerBook 17".

And not one mention of Seamonkey. You're getting better Phil.

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Mentor ,
Nov 11, 2009 Nov 11, 2009

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~graffiti wrote:

PjonesCET wrote:

I worked on all kinds of computers from TI-88 Comadore, Epson, Winn, AppleII, and Mac. My first computer of my own was Radio Shak Color computer II. My second was a V-Tech Clone of an AppleIIc. My first Mac was an SE-30. since then I've been strictly Mac My latest Model is a PowerBook 17".

And not one mention of Seamonkey. You're getting better Phil.

The comment was about Computers.  not Browsers.

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